pfriedma
While planning reheating a casserole I was thinking, this would be a great use case for (traditional, like machine vision) AI - my oven could detect what I've put in it, and I say, I'd like this ready by 4:30 and it would just take care of it.


But also, it wasn't hard to figure the timing and temperature and punch that into my 25 year old oven that's not internet connected, doesn't require a license, and can't be remotely bricked, which...none of that is a requirement for the AI piece
..at all.. but that's what capitalism has decided is profitable...

Eventually there will probably be a market for dumb smart appliances - appliances that have smart features but that are fully supplemental and work offline.

My evse is like this. There's a separate module for the wifi/app features, but they're not required for use and you can literally unplug it and turn it into a fully offline device.
Mar 23 at 5:51pmWeb
Show threadIsocatMar 23
@pfriedma I'll have mine with no such module, kthx. I don't need or want a cooker detecting what I'm cooking, or a washer detecting what I'm washing, or a toaster programmed to mistakenly believe it knows what kind of bread I've put in and how I want it done. NO!
Show threadpfriedmaMar 23
@isocat
The best toasters have a sensor that measures the bread surface temperature. This used to be more common in high quality toasters of the 50s and 60s.
They've mostly been replaced with commodity modules which are timers which don't detect anything...and they're not as good.
so older toasters actually have more of a sensor loop.

Washers made for the last 30 years or more detect weight and balance. And they have optimized cycles for the things you tell it the load is made of.

Higher in dishwashers sense how dirty the water is and have for decades.

The point is that appliances which sense things and adjust accordingly isn't an inherently bad idea, and people's mistrust of that is way more so a factor of intentional decisions by corporations.
Show threadIsocatMar 23

@pfriedma I think the main thing for me is that I don't want to have anything resembling a conversation or two-way interaction of any kind with machines. I want the controls to be _controls_, not beg-buttons to request permission to be granted the machine's idea of what I really want. As the owner and/or operator, I am god: I shall command, and it shall comply – without any backtalk or second-guessing or helpful hints.

Sensors and systems to optimize the completion of the task I set: Sure. But just go do as I order, don't be trying to negotiate or debate with me; neither override nor countermand my directives. I despise getting in arguments a machine is programmed to win regardless of how wrong it is, whether it's a toaster or a transmission, a washer or a windshield wiper.

Show threadStephen Hoffman6d ago

@pfriedma Various dimensions here… Boeing versus Airbus control philosophy, with a side-helping of local and offline operations versus connected and server-based and with subscriptions, and with a side-helping of which sensors are involved if any.

My oven or refrigerator or clothes washer doesn’t need a camera, or a network connection.

I -might- be talked into a strictly-local (probably Matter & Thread) network connection for certain benign notifications, such as “done”.

But full operations while offline and disconnected is absolutely non-negotiable.

But unfortunately, I’m expecting to encounter embedded cellular data modems within new devices in the very near future, collecting and uploading metadata the purported device owner just can’t block, and presumably downloading advertisements.

Show threadpfriedma6d ago
@HoffmanLabs
Like with so many things, it's the NON inevitability of all this that gets me. Tech did not *need* to be like this to be successful or helpful. But we've been conditioned to accept always listening, always monetizing, forever advertising as the price to pay for technological convenience and it's just not necessary.

Modern tech is speedrunning unbridled capitalism
Show threadStephen Hoffman5d ago
@pfriedma What we have (and where we’re headed in this handbasket we’re in) is what happens with regulatory capture, yes.