Mastodawn

Women are being abandoned by their partners on hiking trails. What’s behind ‘alpine divorce’?

https://sh.itjust.works/post/56947245

Women are being abandoned by their partners on hiking trails. What’s behind ‘alpine divorce’? - sh.itjust.works

MJ calls what happened to her in Zion national park “small ‘T’ trauma”. She knows women have experienced worse from their partners. But she still feels the anger of being left behind on a hike by her now ex. “It brings up stuff in my body that maybe I have not cleared out yet,” she said. Five years ago, MJ and a new partner – he was not exactly her boyfriend, and the pair were not exclusive – traveled from Los Angeles to Utah for an adventure getaway. MJ, who is 38 and works in PR, was looking forward to exploring Zion’s striking scenery; its vast sandstone canyon and pristine wading trails were on the list. But on the morning of their big hike, MJ was not feeling well. She could not shake the feeling that something was “off”; indeed, MJ would learn on this trip that her partner was seeing other women. As they made their way up Angel’s Landing, MJ’s partner started walking faster than her. “I could tell it was getting on his nerves that I was slow,” she said. “I was like, ‘Fuck it, just go ahead of me.’” He did without hesitation. When she caught up at the top of the mountain, they took a picture together. Then her partner hiked down the mountain with a woman he had met on the way up, leaving MJ to finish by herself. They broke up shortly after that trip. (MJ asked to be referred to by her initials for the sake of speaking openly about a past relationship.) Last month, MJ opened TikTok and heard the phrase “alpine divorce”, a label she now attaches to her experience in Zion.

givesomefucks 5d ago

So…

They weren’t in an exclusive relationship.

She told him to walk ahead without her.

And he talked to someone else since she told him not to walk with her, someone he seems to have met while waiting for her at the summit before going down.

Kind of sounds like she broke off a situationship on a hike. And immediately assumed if he talked to any woman then he was romantically interested in her, so their open relationship was never going to work anyways.

Even the actual alpine one where the woman was left in a blizzard recently and died, her parents have come out and said the infantilizing of their daughter was an insult to her memory.

Like, it should be a safe bet that anything that starts on TimToknis bullshit.

But yeah, big outdoorsy trips aren’t for rocky relationships. Romantic or otherwise you need to be going with people you trust. Shit can get stressful and not everyone reacts well to stress. It’s not the same thing as the same distance walk thru the park.

HellsBelle 5d ago

You seem to be making a lot of assumptions there.

givesomefucks 5d ago

No, I just read the article…

HellsBelle 5d ago

With a male bias. Are you a misogynist by chance?

naught101 5d ago

Just a few weeks ago I saw a dude have an argument with his partner on top of Cradle Mountain and then head down before her. We kept an eye on her to make sure she made it down OK (sketchy down climbing). He was at the bottom of the steep bit on his phone when we got there… She caught up and they seemed fine, but it was a weird vibe.

unexposedhazard 5d ago

I mean what else are you gonna do? Have an escalating fight while you are in an emotionally unstable state? Walking away to calm down is just the right thing to do often, that doesnt change just because you are on a hike.

The cases in the article sound like there is more to them though.

Samskara 5d ago

Especially on a hike, it’s far safer when you’re not super upset about something.

eleijeep 5d ago

A recent case study illustrates this point: last month, an amateur Austrian mountaineer was found guilty of gross negligence manslaughter for leaving his exhausted girlfriend behind on his country’s highest peak while he went in search of help. The man, a Salzburg chef identified only as Thomas P, said he was “endlessly sorry” for her death, and his lawyer called it a “tragic accident”. But Thomas P could not explain why he failed to wrap his freezing girlfriend in her emergency blanket before heading down the mountain without her. Earlier in their trek he had also told a police officer over the phone that they did not need any help, even though a rescue helicopter was made available to them.

I remember hearing about this one.

Climber convicted of manslaughter after leaving girlfriend on Austria’s highest peak to seek help

Thomas P given five-month suspended prison sentence and €9,400 fine over death of Kerstin G by gross negligence

The Guardian

CompactFlax 5d ago

He had done it before with another woman, but she didn’t die. In the recent case, the dead woman’s family supported him. Even though he took their survival supplies. Very odd situation.

givesomefucks 5d ago

Her mom’s issue is the media and courts treated her daughter like a lost sheep led up a mountain.

She was an experienced climber and they planned their trips together.

He didn’t take the emergency supplies, he just didn’t swaddle her like a baby in her own.

The helicopter call stuff was kind of shady tho, and rightfully why he was found guilty.

But it’s not like the mom said he was innocent, she said it was likely an accident, because procedure in climbs like that is to leave someone behind, and she knew that because her daughter had been doing this long before the boyfriend.

But her comments got misrepresented for the headlines.

It all makes logical sense, it’s just the people telling us about it care more about drama and clicks than informing people.

If you understand it, it becomes an incredibly boring story that doesn’t stand out. Which is why TikTok went the complete opposite direction, and mainstream media is reporting on their nonsense for the clicks.

Quick edit:

Specifically for the emergency blanket part, the last stages of hypothermia makes you feel insanely hot.

The early stages cut off circulation to limbs to keep the torso warm, that’s why frostbite effects the extremities, it’s a trade off. When you’re going to die from it, you’re body can’t squeeze you’re arties off and all that “warm” blood floods to your limbs, causing them to quickly rise in temp while the vital parts get cold.

So she likely was bundled up just fine when he left her.

That’s all normal stuff climbers know, but the media/courts seemed to be willfully ignorant of.

All the articles I’ve read say he never applied the emergency blanket, it was still packed away. Nor did he make her safe by building any kind of shelter or securing her against wind.

And then he also did not call for help until three hours after they decided they needed help, and rejected the helicopter rescue. None of those are normal things. Those are the actions of someone abandoning someone to die.

givesomefucks 5d ago

None of those are normal things.

Which is why he was found guilty of manslaughter

And those bad decisions may likely be due to stress/incompetence. Something that happens, but again that’s what makes it manslaughter.

Those are the actions of someone abandoning someone to die.

If you’re ignorant of the realities of alpine mountaineering I could understand why you believe that.

The dead woman’s mom wasn’t ignorant of it tho, that’s why she keeps saying it wasn’t murder.

How experienced are you with cold weather mountain climbing?

I grew up doing it.

givesomefucks 4d ago

Well, then you don’t have an excuse

HellsBelle 4d ago

Neither do you.

ChonkyOwlbear 5d ago

I don’t care who you are, you should never go to a place with someone that you are not capable of leaving alone.

So should everyone bring their own rope/tent/boat/… to any activity where they are usually shared?
How about activities where noone can safely leave on their own?

TrackinDaKraken 5d ago

I’m just gonna say it, if you want to break up with your girlfriend don’t be a dick about it.

“Don’t go on a hike with someone you don’t trust.” All you little boys in here victim blaming need to be checked.

And some men wonder why some women would choose a bear.

CanadaPlus 4d ago

TBF bears are pretty great. Bears probably win over women, too.

BarneyPiccolo 5d ago

People are so weird. I once worked closely with a single woman, and the boss had a big Christmas party for the managers, and she brought a guy that she’d been dating for a couple months, and was getting close to.

For some reason that none of us ever learned, he decided to completely ignore her that night. He knew nobody at that party but her, and yet he pretended like he’d never seen her before. It wasn’t a big party,maybe 20 people, so we ALL saw what was going on. Eventually, he took her home, but they never went out again.

I asked her about what happened, and he wouldn’t discuss it. He dropped her off at home, and they never spoke about it on the ride home or after. The guy just decided to turn into a different person that night.

BTW, she was a really cool person, pretty, fashionable, great hair, super smart, funny, great job, owned her own house, etc. The loss was entirely his.

ParadoxSeahorse 4d ago

Astounding that there are men in here defending these dickbags left right and centre. And presumably other men just like yep good point bro, technically correct. Please dump me and run off a fucking cliff you spineless turdweasels

Lemmy is better than Reddit but there are still terrible trolls and awful people here.

Walk_blesseD 4d ago

I’m willing to accept that it’s better in ways not relevant to this discussion, but tbh the ubiquitous casual misogyny is far more inescapable here imo

dandelion (she/her)4d ago

yes, I feel like Lemmy has a misogyny problem :-(

TubularTittyFrog 4d ago

Nothing is behind it. It’s another dramatized thing that people are using for social media clout to score points, and people lap it up. This is manufactured rage bait.

We are also only getting one side of the story. I know for a fact a few of my breakups where the other party completely warped the story to make me into a villain. I had one incident where I was teaching my gf to snowboard and she broke her wrist on the bunny slope, a super common injury. I spent all day with her in the hospital etc. We broke up 6 months later and started telling people I had shoved her to the ground and broke her wrist on purpose because I was jealous of her success as a pianist or something and was trying to sabotage her life . It was insane and her story got worse as time went on post-breakup.

90% of these are probably just unhappy people on a bad day who are re-writing the story into some elaborate narrative of evil and abuse because they know it will do well on social media. And a lot of tiktok/social media people are very unhappy people. And unhappy people do a lot of lying and exaggerating for attention. well-adjusted people aren’t making teary faced videos on tiktok about their breakups.

HellsBelle 4d ago

Do you have proof of any of that or is it simply your opinion?

ExLisper 4d ago

This is so fucking sexist.

Hey everyone, women are just as capable of surviving in the mountains as men!

There’s some safety and ethical rules in the mountains. You don’t leave your hiking/climbing partner unless you both agree it’s fine. Gender of this partner doesn’t matter. Guy leaving another guy is equally bad as guy leaving a woman. Women are not inherently more prone to dying in the mountains than men. The fact that everyone treats this as someone abandoning a helpless person is infuriating. It’s shitty behavior but it would be equally shitty if this guy left his male friend or if she left him. It’s 2026, this is fairly progressive space and still everyone looks at with “women need protecting” mindset. It’s mind boggling.

When I see women in the mountains I don’t think to myself “oh my god, they are here without supervision? hope they will be fine!”. Am I the only one?

You’re overlooking that men tend to be attracted to this sort of activity more and may have greater experience. When they invite their inexperienced girlfriend, they have a duty of care towards them. You’re right, sex doesn’t matter and this could be reversed, but you need to ask yourself where the statistic lie.

This is not sexist. You’ve found the wrong conclusion.

ExLisper 4d ago

Yes but the story of MJ doesn’t talk about experience. It’s just talks about gender.

TubularTittyFrog 4d ago

because it’s rage bait. It’s not about hiking, it’s about men being awful to women and fanning the flames of gender war rage.

HellsBelle 4d ago

fanning the flames of gender war rage.

Seeing as that’s you doing it I would think it’s only you who can stop it.

TubularTittyFrog 3d ago

You spam shitty news articles all over lemmy dozens of times per day. 12 in last 24 hours alone. Most with horribly editorialized headlines that are straight up misleading.

You are the problem. But you don’t see yourself that way, you think you’re standing up for justice and informing the public of the ‘evils’ of the world that they must stand against, no doubt. You aren’t part of the problem! No, it’s anyone who points out how shitty the articles you post are.

HellsBelle 3d ago

Poor you. Why don’t you just block me then? It might help with your rage problem.

TubularTittyFrog 3d ago

The fact you think calling people out on their shit is rage, is very telling.

Disagreement isn’t rage, but when you live in a world of sensationalized articles for ‘news’, no doubt that is the lens through which you view the world.

HellsBelle 3d ago

So is calling yourself tittyfrog.

non_burglar 4d ago

Yes, it is ethically wrong to leave anyone behind in the wilderness.

What has surfaced in the news more often recently is men doing this to women. Was that not clear from the article?

Reddfugee42 4d ago

How did they establish it’s not also happening at the same rates in other-gendered situations? Seems anecdotal and contrived.

non_burglar 4d ago

Sounds a lot like whataboutism.

This the same reaction as “men also are abused!”, which is obviously true, hut at much, much lower rates than women.

There is no requirement to establish a pattern of women abandoning men for this article, because it’s not about that.

Mulligrubs 4d ago

It’s not whataboutism, even if it sounds like it.

Primus “I want chicken”

Secundus “What about salmon?”

Primus “Whataboutism! Your claim is invalid you have lost the debate.”

Pro tip: We’re not locked into one topic. We’re allowed to make comparisons, we all do it every day.

Yes, I know you will now say I a gaslighting. You win

webadict 4d ago

It’s sexist in the way that it might depict only women suffering from this type of behavior, but I think that women do tend to be the major demographic that suffers from this type of behavior, which, to me, is a type of sexism that is nowhere near as harmful as the behavior it condemns. It’s not saying they can’t hike.

This type of abuse can happen literally anywhere. You’re out in the city and you’re not walking fast enough? Get ditched with no warning. And that’s the problem. There is usually some modicum of control that the people ditching (you can read this as men) have over the situation that leaves the partner in a vulnerable state. Sometimes they drove. Sometimes they know the way. Sometimes they have the experience. It’s an abuse tactic to do something like that.

So, idk man, calling this sexist and then pretending there’s some unrelated problem to address is a weird take.

InTheNameOfScheddi 4d ago

Thank you. Weird ass take, I thought we left this shit on Reddit?

HellsBelle 4d ago

When I first moved to Lemmy from Reddit it wasn’t this bad. Now it’s no fucking different than when I worked in a sawmill, surrounded by shitty men.

I recognize your username now that I’ve been on lemmy for a minute and I always appreciate your contributions here <3

This place has a misogyny problem and looks no different than 4chan or early days of Reddit.

HellsBelle 4d ago

Right back atcha Velma. Always good to have comrads fighting beside you. :)

Donebrach 4d ago

Maybe “MJ” herself is a shitty person, and roped some equally shitty dude into a shitty time and he decided on the way up “fuck this lady” on a probably very easy day hike and ditched her.

Doomsider 4d ago

Maybe she was shitty, but we know he was. You never abandon your hiking partner under any circumstances.

Reminds me of people going out and drinking and abandoning their friend who then gets SA. It is import to go out with good people not superficial cunts.

If you don’t like them then don’t hike with them again. It is that simple unless you are a sociopath.

Donebrach 4d ago

The fact that he was reported to “hike down with some other woman.” And that she was able to complete the hike herself tells me it was a very easy trail and heavily populated. Just a dumb story of two assholes one of which decided to make her shitty date into an avenue of internet content for the hopeful attempt at gaining some influence. The dude was probably just annoyed and childishly trying to cause an issue with her and was like “I’m gonna walk the half mile down the 0 grade dirt path to the car with Stacy, babe.”

Doomsider 4d ago

You don’t abandon someone period unless you are a sociopath. I get that you would abandon someone and let them die, get raped, assaulted, etc.

Choose your friends/partners very carefully.

We are just built differently I guess.

dandelion (she/her)4d ago

it’s not like the article or the phenomenon of “alpine divorces” rests on this single story, either, there were many stories shared in the article:

an amateur Austrian mountaineer was found guilty of gross negligence manslaughter for leaving his exhausted girlfriend behind on his country’s highest peak while he went in search of help. The man, a Salzburg chef identified only as Thomas P, said he was “endlessly sorry” for her death, and his lawyer called it a “tragic accident”. But Thomas P could not explain why he failed to wrap his freezing girlfriend in her emergency blanket before heading down the mountain without her. Earlier in their trek he had also told a police officer over the phone that they did not need any help, even though a rescue helicopter was made available to them.

A former girlfriend testified that Thomas P had left her behind on a trail during a hike in 2023 – “so that was the last mountain expedition we undertook together”, she said.

or

A few years ago, Naomi was hiking Arches national park in Utah when her group noticed a woman lying on the ground in distress.

The woman told them she suffered from severe vertigo – not ideal given the park’s topography – and her date had gone to retrieve his camera after she accidentally dropped it into the bowl near Delicate Arch. “There was no way she was going to get out by herself, and we hiked with her back down to the trailhead,” Naomi said. On the way, they learned that she was on a “second or third date” with the man. “We were asking her, like, ‘So … this might be the last date, huh?’”

This last one really confuses me. Like if somebody knocked my camera down some rocks, I would go down and get it unless I thought they were experiencing a medical emergency of some kind.

Is Vertago a serious condition? I thought it meant getting dizzy when you’re afraid of heights. I suppose if I were in that position I would want to sit down with my hiking partner and make sure we had a plan like hey I know you’re feeling uncomfortable, but it doesn’t look like you’re in any danger. I need to get that camera back because it is expensive. I’ll meet you back here and we can hike down together.

Also, and I’m asking this out of pure ignorance, If someone has vertigo, at what point is it their responsibility to turn back rather than put themselves in an uncomfortable position? Maybe they shouldn’t have gone up where the camera got knocked down in the first place. But on the other hand maybe it happens by surprise and there’s no predicting it.

dandelion (she/her)3d ago

vertigo is very dangerous on a trail with heights and steep drops like that, because you can’t balance yourself - it’s very scary and dangerous in a situation like that.

Hell, even in my house I’ve had vertigo I was worried would result in my hitting my head or falling, just trying to navigate getting to a bed. Severe vertigo can additionally cause lots of distress, I can understand someone not wanting to be left alone in the middle of an episode.

That said, I understand wanting to go get your camera - I just think it is clear he prioritized the camera over her. The point isn’t that the camera is worthless, or it’s always wrong to look for the camera - but that you probably shouldn’t prioritize the camera over the well-being of another person who probably shouldn’t be left alone in that moment, and who has no independent way to get back to the trailhead without you.

A lot of this has to do with the dependence they have on the person, and the person’s responsibility to care in that moment.

TotallynotJessica 4d ago

Looking at this comment thread, I’m beginning to think the real shitty people of this story are those who think the wilderness isn’t dangerous. The only saving grace is that your opinion doesn’t seem to be the majority.

The wilderness is dangerous, and the red line for me is leaving without making sure everyone in your party is making it back safely. There can be exceptions to this rule, but none applied in what was presented. There were plenty of stories in the article and in these comments where predominantly masc- folx were being jerks.

TotallynotJessica 3d ago

They’re probably the same dudes who go on hikes without enough water or wearing proper clothing because they “don’t want to be pussies.” Mfs think nature is conquered and is now as safe as an amusement park.

jefferyjefferson 4d ago

Women need to stop putting their faith in shitty men.

God forbid shitty men are told to be less shitty.

jefferyjefferson 4d ago

They’re told that all the time and they don’t listen or care because they are shitty.

Everyone who rewards their shitty behavior encourages it.

HellsBelle 4d ago

As does everyone who ignores their shitty behaviour.

I will say that us women get pretty fucking tired of often being the only ones to speak up tho.

GreenBottles 4d ago

Articles like this are 99% trash