Mastodawn

Trevor Bramble Mar 9

Nicol Wistreich

How many people know that #WordPress was co-founded by a black man, Mike Little?

Or that he's from the north of England? A self-taught coder from #Stockport, just south of #Manchester? Or that he never received so much as a share, cent or job offer from the $7bn+ valued Automattic after spending five months working exclusively with Matt Mullenweg on the B2 fork?

After @bevangelist told me about @mikelittle I interviewed him for a documentary I never got round to making. Back then I was left with two certainties: he's Wozniak to Mullenweg's Jobs. Among other things he added the one-click upgrade that's been central to WP's bonkers 45%-of-the-web-success. And he's one of the nicest people I've ever interviewed, which is also bonkers given that he not only didn't share in WP's financial success, but that he's barely known.

But he should be - so, better late than never - please meet #MikeLittle, perhaps the most-influential-least-known person in #foss… https://25.netribution.co.uk/nic/mike-little-the-british-co-founder-of-wordpress-youve-probably-never-heard-of/

Nicol Wistreich Feb 25

If anyone's struggling with the video embeds on the WordPress site (I am on my phone), there's direct links for both the videos on #PeerTube. If that goes down (and I’ve no reason to think it should) I have got Vimeo links - but 🤞

- Mike Little, Part 1: co-founding WordPress and watching it grow (from afar): https://open.movie/w/hzQjFV6xJF9agsn5ERz4Kz
- Mike Little, Part 2: his life in code: https://open.movie/w/rdot9DoygXTXzLM4ZnJjTf

Mike Little, Part 1: co-founding WordPress and watching it grow (from afar)

PeerTube

candide.xyz Feb 25

@nicol I had some trouble streaming it from Peertube, so I tried to download the file to my device, and ran into issues there too... It looks like my phone's media player has trouble determining the duration.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 25

@candide thanks for the report.. @ozoned - would federating help with this?

@[email protected] @[email protected] i can watch the videos without issue.

I'd always suggest federating your Peertube, for instance my TubeFree.org asked to follow yours, but I don't think it it would solve this issue.

I'm guessing a client side issue or ISP block. Maybe try a VPN or switching to cellular or WiFi.

Nicol Wistreich (@[email protected])

835 Posts, 1.27K Following, 830 Followers · Digital governance, community/civic tech, CSS, indie-media and the funding/tools/etc that supports it. Co-founded Netribution.co.uk in 1999, co-wrote 3 editions of a long book on indie film finance. UI designer for CiviCRM behind the new River theme framework. Dad, sleep-deprived, lapsed filmmaker, wannabe vegan, take the train whenever I can.

social.coop

candide.xyz Feb 26

@ozoned @nicol It's working now! I turned off the sharing system, and that seemed to help.

@[email protected] @[email protected] "turned off the sharing system" do you mean the P2P? I had that on mine by default, and while I love the idea, as well as others being able to replicate videos through Peertube, we found that it causes too many issues. You can't count on the quality of connection of anyone else and then folks pulling from flakey connections only see issues and think it's the video.

Also I was wrong about the follow. I hadn't followed open.movie on my tubefree.org. I do now though! 😄

candide.xyz (@[email protected])

870 Posts, 236 Following, 308 Followers · ✨ Creative Technologist. ✨ Passionate about accessible media production and storytelling using open source tools. My creative practice explores memory, identity, and virtually-mediated human connections between people of #African descent. https://justmytoots.com/@[email protected] #searchable

vis.social

candide.xyz Feb 26

@ozoned @nicol Yes, P2P, but the platform's settings calls it "sharing system": https://open.movie/w/rdot9DoygXTXzLM4ZnJjTf?modal=quick-settings

@[email protected] @[email protected] No. That's not what I'm thinking of. I'm thinking of Video Redundancies. Do you have that enabled and another Peertube is serving the content instead of fetching from yours?

candide.xyz (@[email protected])

870 Posts, 236 Following, 308 Followers · ✨ Creative Technologist. ✨ Passionate about accessible media production and storytelling using open source tools. My creative practice explores memory, identity, and virtually-mediated human connections between people of #African descent. https://justmytoots.com/@[email protected] #searchable

vis.social

Rashunda Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle #blackmastodon @blackfedi

Matt Mascarenhas Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle What on Earth? I'm from Stockport too, and sorry to say this is the first time I've heard of you, Mike!

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@miblo that's crazy! I also feel I should know the answer to this, but what does a video indexer do? Is it creating time-synched metadata? Transcriptions?

Matt Mascarenhas Feb 26

@nicol Hehe, ikr! Further parallels with Mike's story: ZX Spectrum was very first computer I used; typing BASIC in from magazines (although it didn't sink in for me, probably too young); and later the continuous-upgrading in my own software works exactly as Mike describes WordPress's. Really beautiful interview!

Aww, cheers for asking. Yeah, time-synched metadata is bang on, I'd say. Example of it at https://guide.handmadehero.org/code/day667/

There's the basic textual summary, but also categories and references.

Simplified Tile Occupancy Checking — Handmade Hero — Episode Guide — Handmade Hero

Nicol Wistreich Feb 27

@miblo I remember typing it in from an Usbourne book I think but I never had much patience!

That’s really interesting about the indexing - the other two interviews we published this last month I used Hyperaudio on for time-synchro metadata, and it was quite a faff. First getting the subtitles file via Vimeo, then correct, then converting it, then going thru and making the questions bold with breaks and paragraph returns as needed.. https://25.netribution.co.uk/nic/cath-le-couteur-on-digital-utopias-closing-shooting-people-film-collectives-the-future/.

Must have taken me near a day - so I didn’t do it for Mike! A long time ago I used Pocorn.js to add all sorts of synched info to some vids, that seemed to go out of fashion, but was useful.

Web pioneer Cath Le Couteur on digital utopias, closing Shooting People, film collectives & the future.

> "I'm not an anti-tech person. Shooters was built on technology. But I am mindful that we want technology that doesn't extract, technology that enables people." Long before social networks and smart phones in the mid-90s, Cath entered the world's first cyber-cafe in Soho, London to message a cyber

Netribution @ 25

Matt Mascarenhas Feb 27

@nicol Ooh yeah, very cool! Transcription actually came up in my degree, and I seem to recall activities taking me 10× the material's duration! (Pic attached.)

Last I knew Vimeo actually had built-in support for chapter points – just the basic textual summary – which I guess you may add for Cath's interview based on all the timing you've done. And, btw, if you fancy my stuff I'm very available to do it for you! Vimeo supported.

(Also, the photoed BASIC book lives in my peripheral vision!)

Nicol Wistreich Feb 27

@miblo nice! I didn’t realise the history of BASIC till much later (tbh I thought it was a BBC Computer thing!). And that spreadsheet looks a lot of headache.

This is what I did with Popcorn for a family video https://visuali.st/bin/ewa/ - amazed it still works after maybe a decade. Always seemed like it would be good for tutorials or any lesson with accompanying text notes, but it never really took off it seems.

Who do you index for mostly? Podcasters?

Matt Mascarenhas Feb 27

@nicol Aww yeah, really nice, and cheers so much for sharing such a personal video!

So far, it's all been for programmers. Handmade Hero-style live programming streams; conferences; more information-dense programming / presentation videos; a CAD project; we've had the odd interview too; even one "Book Club" project which was just a read-through of a book.

Oh yeah, now you mention this about BASIC, I actually recall spotting with curiosity that we could write it on both the Spectrum and 386.

Sam Izby Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle

Skin color doesn't matter. And gender too. Just do the right things and be a good person.

your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦Feb 25

if skin color didn't matter, he would be a multimillionaire.

don't parrot the ignorant moderate white man bullshit.

in a racist societ, the color of our skin matters. to deny this is to side with racists.

instead of negating the racism, the correct thing to do would be to ensure his name is not only forever said BEFORE Muhlenberg’s, but make it your business he gets paid reparations for these sins of omission BY ALL MEANS NECESSARY.

@izby @nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle

Stefan Scholl Feb 25

@blogdiva @izby @nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle not everybody lives in the USA.

ccarlson71 Feb 25

@Stefan_S_from_H @blogdiva @izby @nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle I’m not sure how to interpret this other than that you think racism is present only in the USA. Surely that’s not the case, though…

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby @nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle or interpret it as writing something like https://mastodon.social/@izby/116132724713095405 makes people angry in the USA.

Benjamin Braatz Feb 26

@Stefan_S_from_H Writing ignorant stuff like that makes me angry in Germany. @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby what’s the goal?

Benjamin Braatz Feb 26

@Stefan_S_from_H The goal of what? Of mentioning the fact that he is black? Maybe to highlight when someone is not from the traditionally privileged background?
What's the goal of whining about it? Why do the racists' work if not a racist? If you are not interested, you are always free to ignore. @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@izby
@HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva
@izby obviously "do the right things and be a good person" is a great principle to live by. But *many* people do that yet still suffer prejudice because of race, gender, sexuality, religion, ethnicity, etc…

The reason I flagged that Mike is black, as well as that he's British, from the north of England, didn't go to university – is because these are things we don't hear about much in tech founders (even if they drop out of Uni, they still go). And maybe they played a part in why no-one's heard about him and he didn't even get a job interview at Automattic.

There is a scandal here. But (maybe bigger) there's also a chance to point out not all tech pioneers are white Americans. I don't know why that seems triggering for you @Stefan_S_from_H?

Trying to counter mainstream narratives isn't to attack white guys, as some racist agitators would try to have you believe (one is trying to get elected today v near where Mike lives). But it needs doing.

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@nicol @izby @HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva don't insinuate what's triggering me.

What's triggering me is that people who say, “Skin color doesn't matter. And gender too.” get attacked and met with hate.

If someone doesn't see a skin color as a negative, this person is on your side. And pushing people away isn't helpful.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@Stefan_S_from_H @izby @HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva

suggested correction:

"What's triggering me is that *WHITE MEN* who say, “Skin color doesn't matter. And gender too.” get attacked and met with hate."

Can you imagine a Brit at the height of the British Empire going around India saying 'nationality doesn't matter'?

Still, I'm not attacking you and have no hate for you. You started this by making a post here - https://mastodon.social/@Stefan_S_from_H/116133261766805256 - a statement which makes no sense other than you objected to me mentioning Mike is black (among other things about him, like where he lives and what his education status is). Maybe you didn't object to me saying that, and just randomly tell strangers what you know and don't know, in which case, sorry to have misinterpreted you.

Sam Izby Feb 26

Hey, I am a Slav, Slavs are not white. Slavery in my country was abolished 3 years earlier than in the USA, and all slaves here were "white".

Are you sure I have any problems with people who have other skin color? Because I think you do. Right now sit here and try to guess who's white, who's black in this discussion. And that influences what you're going to say to us.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@izby My grandad was Jewish - escaped the Holocaust in Poland to the UK. Looking at his photos he possibly had some Slav there too. But I look white, I'm ok to be called white – tho my family experience of persecution based on ethnicity is different to your average white Brit. But I've never had to experience racism based on my appearance, which is why I'm fine with that.

That's just me: I wouldn't tell you how to express your own ethnicity and I'm sorry if you think I am saying you're racist.

How could I know that?

I was answering your statement, and the problem is it's very similar to the 'all lives matter' meme (https://theconversation.com/why-is-it-so-offensive-to-say-all-lives-matter-153188). That's offensive not because it's wrong that every life matters –no-one would dispute that– but because it's trying to hide the original message that was shared (that black people shouldn't be shot by the police). You –a developer– weren't commenting about this story about WordPress's forgotten coder co-founder, but starting a new, unclear point.

Why is it so offensive to say ‘all lives matter’?

Michael McCormack used a phrase that reveals prejudice during his stint as acting Prime Minister.

The Conversation

Sam Izby Feb 26

So, what do we have? The white guy forgot to check his privileges and praised the black guy for such high (for a black guy) achievements and thinks that this is OK. That's not OK.

By focusing on skin color you devalue all his achievements.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@izby but I didn't focus on his skin colour Sam - you did.

I listed a few things about him: his nationality, the region he's from, the city he's from, his higher education status, his race. You had a problem with *one* of those things. Why?

You didn't mention any of his achievements - you started a conversation about skin colour and gender on a post that wasn't about gender and skin colour. You're still doing it.

Maybe you never read the post and the interview it linked. Maybe you're a bot! The story in the post is that the co-founder of WordPress isn't known. He's not rich. And somehow he didn't end up like Walter White full of vengeance - tho he'd have every right to be. That's the post, and because I used the word 'black' in it - which is notable given how few black tech Unicorn founders there are - you commented with a random and not really relevent statement about race and gender.

Sam Izby Feb 26

I don't even know him, but you literally started your story with this: that guy is black, and you don’t even know it!

Dude, next time you want to talk about someone who did something great, just add "for black" to the end of the text: "That was really cool... for black". Sounds offensive, right?

I don't care about your skin color, your gender, your income, your education, the neighborhood you live in, or your CS rank. But I do care that you care.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@izby if you don't like the framing of my post (whose goal was to get more people aware of a remarkable man largely erased by history) – but genuinely care about the subject, then just share the original WordPress post I was pointing to, as it has a different lede: https://25.netribution.co.uk/nic/mike-little-the-british-co-founder-of-wordpress-youve-probably-never-heard-of/

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@nicol @izby @HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva You started with “How many people know that #WordPress was co-founded by a black man, Mike Little?”

I answered the question. A question that sounded a bit like an accusation.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@Stefan_S_from_H goodness no - nothing accusatory meant or implied. The whole point of this story is that (almost) no-one knows who he is. Those who know WordPress (my intended audience) think of it as having one founder - a white moustached Texan, Matt Mullenweg. He’s seen as the ‘founder’ like Zuckerberg is linked to Facebook.

Adding extra info (black, British, Stopfordian) helps establish (to them) I’m not talking about Mullenweg. The British and Stockport part isn’t so interesting to anyone not from there, hence ‘black’. In the interview I don’t talk to Mike about his experience of racism so I don’t say more than questioning if it’s a factor (of several) in his lack of fame or wealth - a fair question that I can’t answer. If I would accuse anyone it’s the companies who’ve made a fortune from his work, and the computing / British establishment for not championing him more. But even then, Mike doesn’t seem to carry anger so it seems wrong for me to add my own on top.

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby the goal of attacking someone who says “Skin color doesn't matter. And gender too.”

So your goal is to fight, to be angry.

Your goal isn't Article 3 of the Basic Law for the Federal Republic of Germany (aka Grundgesetz für die Bundesrepublik Deutschland), written by people who don't want to repeat fascism and authoritarianism.

Benjamin Braatz Feb 26

@Stefan_S_from_H Skin colour, gender identity, sexuality, (dis)ability /do/ matter very much in this world. It is exhausting if people claim otherwise just because (they claim) that they don't matter /to them/. And if this claim leads to running around the Internet and trying to correct people and telling them /not/ to mention those categories then borders on actively harmful and very much /not/ on “my” side of society, but on the side of the racists and fascists. @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@HeptaSean @ccarlson71 @blogdiva @izby https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRzd7SknVrQ

Morgan Freeman - Black History Month - 60 Minutes

YouTube

your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦Feb 26

so fucking what?

don’t be ignorant.

@Stefan_S_from_H @izby

Stefan Scholl Feb 26

@blogdiva @izby what do you want? In which world do you want to live in?

Seth of the Fediverse Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle Mike is a great guy. He doesn't get enough credit. Overshadowed by Mullenweg.

Very well spoken and a decent person.

KawaiiPunk Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle this is awesome!

Dr Susi Arnott Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle
Pi g @CrispinHughes - let's watch this together:)

Mitex Leo Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle Great Work! I never heard of him before.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 25

@ml @bevangelist @mikelittle I didn’t quite believe it at first as I assumed I’d have heard of it. All credit belongs with Mike (and his patience in waiting for this to go up).

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle @cstross @nic damn. Had no idea. Nice to see you on here Nic, been many years…!

Nicol Wistreich Feb 25

@doug you too Doug! (Linlithgow Doug? Grant/Robbie's pal Doug? the cap would fit but the shades leave me non the wiser…)

@nicol yes indeed mate. 😎

Nicol Wistreich Feb 26

@doug niiiiice! how've you been? I think this is only the second time in 9 years I've met someone I knew offline here, outside of work contacts. Are you still in the G? And did I read it right that you founded Amiqus?

@nicol all good man. Yeah I don’t really know anyone IRL that’s on Mastodon. I’ve been living in Lisbon for almost three years now! And aye; one of the founders indeed. Just gone ten year.

@nicol how you getting on? In G still yourself?

Stefan Scholl Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle I don't even know the skin color of the other founders.

Nicol Wistreich Feb 25

@Stefan_S_from_H how many black tech founders can you name?

Stefan Scholl Feb 25

@nicol what kind of question is this? Do you have problems processing what I have said?

Do you think not knowing the skin color of founders means I think everyone is white?

Maybe I think technology gets created by yellow people in Springfield.

Adrian McEwen Feb 25

@nicol @bevangelist @mikelittle Lovely videos! I did know of @mikelittle but it's great to hear him talking about the project.

Also amused to hear an aside about him working for Eden. I interviewed for a job there back in, I think it'll have been, 1996. Had totally forgotten about them.

Patrick H. Lauke Feb 25

@nicol i briefly met @mikelittle at a meetup in south manchester MANY moons ago. lovely bloke.

Acin Fals 💜🏳️‍🌈Feb 25

@nicol @HauntedOwlbear
@dianea @bevangelist

I didn't know that!

@mikelittle Wordpress was my favorite platform or internet service for almost ten years. The changes that happened between then and now were heartbreaking, but those were obviously a result of others' decisions. I would you to know I've been grateful for the good parts through the years.

@nicol Thanks for posting this. I knew @mikelittle just a little because he used to pop over the Pennines to tech community meet-ups in Sheffield sometimes, back in the day. Hope you’re doing well, Mike!