@kolev

I reject such boycotts on multiple principles. A boycott, in my mind, is a tool used as part of a desire to create change., ie "I won't buy from you until you..."

But then the condition must be achievable. What condition is achievable or not by IBM in 2026 related to their actions in the 1940s?

Are we to boycott Gillette too?

What about Volkswagen?

What about all Germany companies? What about all German people?

I reject the calls to boycott Israel on the same grounds. "What specific action do they want of Israel now?". Is it to create change, or as a means of social isolation?

My American grandfather, who served the US army in WW2 refused to buy a Japanese car for his entire life.

My French grandfather, who lost most of his family to the Nazis in his native Poland, and who was in five concentration camps, owned a BMW.

When people argue about boycotting Israel without an objective, this is one way in which we know it's not a boycott for change, it's discrimination.
@ahoyboyhoy

@serge @ahoyboyhoy Follow up question: What about Mint?

#linuxmint

@kolev

That's a different story for some specific reasons, and I'll explain that it's akin to avoiding an artist due to their views.

In this case of Mint, or someone like JK Rowling, this is a moral boycott not a strategic one.

In both cases, this is about moral harm being done now. I'd argue strongly that if, eg JK Rowling made a public statement denouncing her former views and pledging a billion dollars go towards trans causes, that it would change the situation.

I feel the same way about Clement Lefebvre, Miguel de Ocaza, and Ludovic Courtès.

If you want to argue that IBM is like JK Rowling, then I would say two fundamental issues exist.

Firstly, IBM is not a singular entity. A similar argument could be made of GNOME- it's not one person but an entire group of people, and we must take that group as a whole.

Secondly, everyone who worked for IBM during the Holocaust hasn't worked there in many decades and I'd guess most or all of them are dead.

@ahoyboyhoy

@kolev

To be clear. if I saw any of the FLOSS leaders who expressed antisemitic sentiment or made antisemitic statement openly and clearly outlining their statements with a real apology and commitment to do better, I would feel strongly that we should not only accept that but celebrate and normalize that process.

I have a lot of thoughts on apologies, and I do connect those feelings with ones about boycotts.

But in the case of all the people I mentioned, they're alive and none have offered a real apology that named harm or included commitment to doing better.

@ahoyboyhoy

@kolev @serge @ahoyboyhoy

This seems to me more like Christian teaching.

While I am no expert, I was taught that the Jewish view of forgiveness is more complex. It's not enough for a person simply to ask for forgiveness. They must also take what steps they reasonably can to repair the harm that they have caused, and sincerely commit not to repeat the offence.