Michael W Lucas Feb 4

It appears Linux root-on-ZFS is a mess. No standard way to do it. Kernel updates require recompiling ZFS. Boot environments are a cornucopia of constantly evolving hacks.

If you're actually using #ZFS on root, on #Debian, what's your preferred hack to make that happen? #sysadmin

I suspect #openzfsmastery might need to assume root on extFS and data on ZFS, leaving root-on-ZFS for the advanced user or a terminal chapter. 

Show threadZimmieFeb 4

@mwl Or root-on-btrfs so you at least get CoW everywhere, even if they are managed in radically different ways.

But yes, root-on-ZFS on Linux is absolutely a mess. It’s the biggest reason I don’t consider Linux for anything I build and have to maintain.

Show threadRyan Hamel
@bob_zim @mwl That sounds a bit dismissive for containerized applications and cloud deployments.
Feb 4 at 4:08pmWeb
Show threadZimmieFeb 4
@mrhamel @mwl I don’t do Linux on metal because it lacks ZFS (also for other reasons), so the only containers in which I run things are FreeBSD jails and illumos zones. Why would I build or deploy anything which depends on Linux syscall translation or userspace in either of those?
Show threadRyan HamelFeb 4
@bob_zim @mwl Lacks ZFS? You just said ZFS-on-root is a mess. Please be consistent with your argument.

I have functioning fully Debian installs with ZFS-on-root, in production for a non-profit, with ZFSBootMenu powering everything. I build it once, send the snapshot to storage, boot ZFSBootMenu on another system, and pull that snapshot down. It's very easy to deploy systems at scale.

I stay in the Linux container world because it simply works for my employers needs, and works in on-prem + cloud environments. Also, keeping applications in the Linux world makes hiring candidates far easier.
Show threadZimmieFeb 4

@mrhamel Okay, fine, I left the word “usable” out. Linux lacks *usable* ZFS. Which, to me, is *lacking ZFS*.

I don’t have the patience for the traditional Linux “Tamagotchi mode”.

Show threadRyan HamelFeb 4
@bob_zim How is it unusable? I don't understand what you mean by "Tamagotchi mode."
Show threadRyan HamelFeb 6
@bob_zim Judging by the lack of response, you know that is BS, and for insult to injury, Open ZFS works just as well on Windows. It is nice to have a universal file system that isn't FAT32.
Show threadMichael W Lucas Feb 4
@mrhamel @bob_zim point of order: I said zfs on root is a mess at the top of this thread, not bob.