Ciara
This pedestrian crossing is on a hill. I’ve noticed that everyone who uses it does the same thing. Car coming? We step into the road so the driver must stop. Bike coming? We step back from the kerb, showing the cyclist that we’ll wait until they’ve passed. Like an instinctive social contract. Cars block public space, bikes share it. Cyclists are either whizzing down or puffing up that hill so it’s a tiny courtesy to let them pass. Often with a mutual smile or wave. Urban in-this-togetherness.
Sep 14, 2025 at 7:55amWeb
Show threadPatrick HadfieldSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi there's a pelican crossing on the hill near my flat - I always wait for cyclists to pass before pressing the button! :)
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@patrickhadfield That's a nice gesture :-) An instinctive camaraderie between pedestrians and cyclists when we share public space.
Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@patrickhadfield @CiaraNi as someone who lives in the Netherlands, I'm confused by these hills you speak of. As a cyclist who lives in Amsterdam, I'm really confused by this idea of cyclists stopping for red lights... :p
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek #NotAllCyclists :-)

@patrickhadfield

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi @patrickhadfield Amsterdam has a very specific cycle culture. When I had newly moved here. I stopped for a red light, 5 cyclists crashed into the back of me...
Show threadMaki 🔻 🌹Sep 14, 2025
@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield I half-choked laughing at how true this is, darnit. I sometimes wonder if I'm the only one stopping for red lights...
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@RandamuMaki You're a pioneer. Showing the rest of them a glimpse of a better kinder more considerate world! @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

That's really weird. I live in #utrecht and I would say 90% of cyclists stop for red lights except in exceptional situations. I have developed the habit of always waiting for the light, because as a foreigner I am not skilled enough at anticipating what could go wrong to safely decide when to run the light. I've never been rear-ended by another cyclist.

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@abhayakara @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield I have been learning from this thread that Amsterdam seems to have its own Big City ways when it comes to obeying, or not, bike rules :-)
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@CiaraNi @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield

I have yet to attempt to cycle there. :)

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@abhayakara @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield Good luck when you do!
Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi @abhayakara @patrickhadfield happy to show you round...
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@CiaraNi @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield

I do want to bike up the Vecht at some point, and that will necessarily involve a trip to Centraal so I don't have to bike back, but haven't found the time yet on an appropriately cloudy day. :)

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@abhayakara @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield and a day with a southerly wind...
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

To get in some hills?

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@abhayakara @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield no. So you have a tail wind...
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

Oh, hah, I guess that means from the south. But where's the challenge in that? One of these days I want to bike across the Afsluitdijk... Apparently you can get some really fun winds there.

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025

@abhayakara @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield Afsluitdijk with a headwind is a personal nightmare. It's 32km with no shelter and no break. I've cycled across it once, with a wonderful tailwind.

Cycling's supposed to be fun, no point making it harder than it needs to be.

Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

I used to live in Vermont. After a while the hills get good to you. So I actually enjoy headwinds. You may think I'm crazy, but I'm not lying. :)

Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

(And yes, it is nice to ride with the wind on the way back, assuming it hasn't reversed in the meantime... :)

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@abhayakara @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield I've cycled into a headwind for 600km over 4 days. The novelty long ago wore off. If I can avoid one, I will...
Show threadTed LemonSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

I can see where that would wear you down. But now you can tell the story... :)

Show threadPaul SchoeSep 14, 2025

In The Hague, also in the Netherlands, police actually hand out tickets (€180!!) when cyclists go through a red light, EVEN WHEN THE CORRESPONDING PEDESTRIAN'S LIGHT IS ALREADY GREEN. (geen broodje aap)

Explanation for non-Dutch: Pedestrians' lights usually turn green 2 seconds before the general traffic light turns green, so they can already get on the crossing.

@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@paulschoe I like that two-second system! (I wonder if we have it here. Which I probably shouldn't say out loud, because I should know this, cycling and walking everywhere as I do, clearly just paying random attention to the rules.) @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield
Show threadHarmSep 14, 2025
@paulschoe @quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield That has a lot to do with traffic fines being used as a source of income. It's a broken system.
Show threadAgnieszka R. TurczyńskaSep 14, 2025

@paulschoe @quixoticgeek @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield I've seen an explanation of that. The Dutch traffic engineering includes not only clearance time of a conflict zone, but also entering time. So, the green signal is being put for pedestrians earlier because they are slower, and they need more time to reach the conflict zone. On the bicycle you need to wait those two seconds extra to make sure you are safe to enter because the other traffic has passed.

Speaking of, in Eindhoven red signal for bicycles is considered rather like a guidance. However I am not going to verify that running the red light in the front of a police car.

Also, I'm driving other vehicles and I would rather not get into the habit of running red light driving (or riding) them 😊

Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@agturcz @paulschoe @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield on a group ride in Zwolle once I blasted through a red light, my friends behind me yelled "You're not in Amsterdam any more!!!"
Show threadAgnieszka R. TurczyńskaSep 14, 2025
@quixoticgeek @paulschoe @CiaraNi @patrickhadfield This is not the Oz we were looking for 😂
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025

@quixoticgeek Haha - bringing your lawless capital city ways to other places.

@agturcz @paulschoe @patrickhadfield

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025

@agturcz Interesting. The thinking behind the seconds-differences seems solid. I also like the term 'conflict zone' in this context!

@paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield

Show threadIsocatSep 14, 2025

@CiaraNi @agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield If you like 'conflict zone' in this context, just wait'll you hear what it's called (maybe only in North America?) when all the pedestrian signals are [WALK] and all the traffic lights are red in all directions!

They call it a "pedestrian scramble".

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025

@isocat Oh my. 'Pedestrian scramble.' I both like and do not like that all at the same time, as a pedestrian!

@agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield

Show threadIsocatSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi @agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield Right? Like "Y'want coffee with that, shug?"
Show threadGalbinus CaeliSep 14, 2025
@isocat @CiaraNi @agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield We do? I haven't heard that.
Show threadIsocatSep 14, 2025

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia6vefr-aXw

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedestrian_scramble

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/scramble-crosswalk-downtown-vancouver-1.7284341

@GalbinusCaeli @CiaraNi @agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield

Introduction to Pedestrian Scrambles

YouTube
Show threadCiaraSep 15, 2025
@isocat Thanks for the link!
Show threadGalbinus CaeliSep 15, 2025

@isocat @CiaraNi @agturcz @paulschoe @quixoticgeek @patrickhadfield
I am amused that the video is from the very city that I currently live in.

Thanks

Show threadPatrick HadfieldSep 14, 2025
@quixoticgeek @CiaraNi a lot of them don't! It is another stick with which motorists beat them.
Show threadQuixoticgeekSep 14, 2025
@patrickhadfield @CiaraNi except in Amsterdam, cyclists out number motorists. And even then almost every driver is also a cyclist. There's a lot less "us and them" mentality about it.
Show threadjackSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi I like how the crossing marking has worn away in the bike lane but not the motor lane - that must be a lot of bikes!
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@jackeric Haha - that's a great observation. I never noticed that! Yes, a lot of bikes are ridden up and down that hill all day and night. It's a main road in the city centre with lots of apartments and houses and then the big university campus at one end.
Show thread😀🚲Sep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi bonus if you stop a car right after someone on a bike goes by, so they get a break from the lurking threat for a minute. Many pedestrians here are just drivers walking their dog though.
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@enobacon Nice bonus :-) To be fair to the council here (Aarhus), cars are not an especially lurking threat on this road because the bike lane is real and clearly separated. And they have recently restricted car traffic in the general area to one-way, which limits car encroachment on the rest of us.
Show threadTim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPESep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi Some pedestrians also ride bikes and are well aware of the investment in momentum that doesn't want to be thrown away if this can be avoided.
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@TimWardCam Yes, this is true. This is why it happens naturally, I think. Most of us walk sometimes, ride a bike sometimes, so we know that it can make a nice difference. Especially on a wet or icy day when I'm saying Wheee! as I free-wheel down that hill, I'm grateful to be waved through the pedestrian crossing instead of having to do a sudden hard brake that could get slippy.
Show threadSerge DrozSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi maybe we step back, because we know the bicycles won't stop i don't have a car and ride my bike every day, bit cyclists often are way ruder than cars
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@sergedroz The city seems to make a difference, depending on the actual infrastructure and urban design. I don't know where you are. In our city, I see many cyclists and pedestrians waving each other through in shared spaces, no matter who has the official right of way. This seems to tie in with the development of shared-space streets where cars are '15 km guests' and street surfaces slow bikes down around pedestrians. Once cars don't dominate, people mostly work it out. (Yes #NotAllCyclists)
Show threadSerge DrozSep 14, 2025

@CiaraNi I'm in Switzerland. Don't get me wrong: I think there is little justification for personal cars in cities, and it's horrible what we sacrifice for cars in terms of space, pollution, noise etc. But I do have the feeling that a lot of cyclists have a similar mindset to car drivers that feel public space is their space. But public space is just that: Public, for every one.

I'm in Zurich, BTW

Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@sergedroz One of the problems with cars, though, is that a person in a car demands personal use of more public space than everyone else. It's not equal public space, 'public, for every one'. One person in a car on a shared street takes up many square metres of public space. They force 10, 20, 30 pedestrians and cyclists in the surrounding space to get out of the way, to squeeze off to the side, to stop and let the car pass, just because of car size and might. It's not equal use of public space.
Show threadSerge DrozSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi agreed
Show threadMicroblog CastellanoSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi
When a bike comes, I step back not because I feel it has the right to pass, but because I know it won't stop.
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@microblogc That's sad, that it's a negative culture where you are. I hope the culture, and if necessary, the cycling infrastructure, improves. We are lucky to have some well-designed shared spaces here that put pedestrians and cyclists ahead of cars, which improves the culture and makes it easier to cooperate instinctively. When cars don't come first, I find that most people mostly just work it out, no matter who had the legal right to pass. (Yes #NotAllCyclists)
Show threadsubgenius 🏴‍☠Sep 14, 2025
And as a cyclist, I avoid pedestrians. It's mutual respect. Remember the last time a car waved you to go ahead? I do, because it's incredibly rare.
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@subgenius 'Mutual respect' - yes, agreed. That's what makes it work, and with eye contact, nods, smiles too
Show threadsubgenius 🏴‍☠Sep 14, 2025
Totally. The little wave or nod is the difference between "you're in my way" vs. "Cheers mate!" 🙂
Show threadCiaraSep 15, 2025
@subgenius It is! So much tone and communication just in a passing nod.
Show threadIan K TindaleSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi except for e-scooters, because e-scooters don't have any kind of speed control or brakes, apparently
Show threadCiaraSep 14, 2025
@u0421793 Perhaps
Show threadxs4me2Sep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi 👍
Show threadDennis MansellSep 14, 2025
@CiaraNi I live in Amsterdam. It's a cultural norm that stepping onto a zebra crossing in front of a bike means you are either weary of living or some kind of masochist. Thinking you might be given right of way is sweetly naïve.