b-rainJun 23
"each individual kid is now hooked into a Nonsense Machine"
Edit: I got those screenshots from imgur. It might be from Xitter, with the account deleted or maybe threads with the account not visible without login? 🤷
2nd Edit: @edgeofeurope found this https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1809325125159825649.html
#school #AI #KI #meme #misinformation #desinformation
Show threadLars Marowsky-Brée 😷Jun 23

@b_rain I've had to explain that LLMs are nothing at all like search engines to friends who are highly educated and, overall, likely smarter and more capable of complex thought than myself.

They're just not computer science educated, and understand computers as good at numbers and large database retrievals.

Which is the exact opposite of #LLMs.

Society isn't ready for them at all.

Show threadCassandrichJun 23

@larsmb @b_rain They're not smarter and more capable of complex thought than you if they get this wrong.

They've failed to pass a very very low bar for intelligence.

Show threadClaudipicpl
@dalias @larsmb @b_rain This!
A key competence is to know which tool to use for which task.
You don't know the purpose of a tool and use it anyway? You are surely not smart.
You know that it is the wrong tool but don't care for its limits? You are surely not smart.
This has nothing to do with some digital understanding. Why would one use a torx screw driver for pozidriv screws? Why would one want to use an LLM as retrieval machine? A smart person knows what their tools are able to do.
Jun 24 at 5:23amWeb
Show threadLars Marowsky-Brée 😷Jun 24
@ridscherli @dalias @b_rain Nobody knows that immediately when confronted with a completely new tool, especially one that behaves very differently to all other tools that looked the same before, and when they've been lied to by almost everyone (not just for-profit corporations) about the capabilities.
I think it is very important that we understand why LLMs are so often misunderstood so we can fix it — not be condescending to our friends is probably helpful in that regard.
Show threadDec (into the void)Jun 24

@larsmb @ridscherli @dalias @b_rain
Replace Torx with Phillips in the example above (talking to anyone who is not an experienced contractor).
It's very easy to get PH (Phillips) and PZ (Pozidriv) cross-head screws confused.
Each type was originally designed for different torque levels.

"To prevent slippage and damaging of screws, you should only use a Phillips head screwdriver on a Phillips head screw, and you should only use a Pozidriv screwdriver on a Pozidriv screw."
https://shop4fasteners.co.uk/blog/pozidriv-vs-phillips/

Show threadClaudipicplJun 24

@dec23k @larsmb @dalias @b_rain
If
1. You have a very big phz screw
2. a small torx manual screw driver which exactly fits into the center
3. do not need much force on the screw
4. and are too lazy to go the basement for some real tools,
this might work. Tested for you :-)

And in my opinion this is a very good example for "knowing the limits of the tools". I know that it's not perfect and accept the limited results as they are without expecting more than possible or blaming others.

Show threadDec (into the void)Jun 24
@ridscherli @larsmb @dalias @b_rain
All of the people I know who learned the PZ/PH difference the hard way (by stripping out a screw, which then had to be extracted) just grabbed the nearest size/type of cross-head bit and used it with an electric screwdriver. Or an impact driver.
Show threadDec (into the void)Jun 24

@ridscherli @larsmb @dalias @b_rain
Thanks for your testing!

I have never tried a Torx driver or bit in anything other than a Torx fastener, but I'll definitely keep it in mind the next time I have a low-torque problem :-)

Show threadClaudipicplJun 24
@dec23k The probability is low, but it might work. But, as mentioned before, don't blame me for broken screws or drivers. You have no reason to assume me being an expert in anything :-D
Show threadDaniel BarlowJun 24
@dec23k @larsmb @ridscherli @dalias @b_rain just going to throw JIS into the mix there (why, yes, I do own a Japanese motorcycle how did you guess)
Show threadClaudipicplJun 24
@larsmb @dalias @b_rain
It's always your own decision when you stop to verifying your source of information. Who told them that the new tool is an answering machine instead of a wording machine? Why did they stop asking another expert?
There is surely a YouTube video explaining how to fix the plumbing installation with tape. Still it's my responsibility if I do this at home.
No matter which education: those who believe rather in PR texts than experts, are missing some kind of complex thinking.
Show threadLars Marowsky-Brée 😷Jun 24

@ridscherli @dalias @b_rain But they *did* end up asking another expert (yours truly).

The problem is that almost all publicly visible insights on it are mostly wrong and misleading, in ways that are not immediately obvious to non-experts (since it's aligned with what computers were previously reasonable at).

I think by dismissing why people fall into this trap with a "they can't handle complex thinking" is ... not constructive and adds zero value to addressing the challenge.

Show threadClaudipicplJun 24
@larsmb @dalias @b_rain Of course there are many questions:
Why do we accept a society in which advertisement is regarded a kind of information?
Why is it possible to get a school or other grade by only repeating some facts and forgetting them afterwards?
Why do we listen to the loud and not to the calm?
But at the end of the day it's always my decision: do I ask the electrician for recommendations on wall paint? Do I use a new software tool based on documentation or on the neighbour's opinion?
Show threadCassandrichJun 24

@ridscherli @larsmb @b_rain The documentation & neighbor's opinion are likely both lies.

The papers by certain Black women experts aren't, and I think we know why folks aren't reading those...

(This is not necessarily an individual indictment, although it is when folks still refuse after becoming aware. It's an indictment of the society that intentionally buries such expertise.)