Do Americans realise how absolutely insane the very concept of “purging a voter registration list” is? You have to *register to vote*? What are you even talking about?
Are you a citizen? Then you should automatically get a vote. There isn’t anything to administer. You live there. The government serves you; not you it. Voting isn’t supposed to be a privilege, or reward.
The obvious abuse vector that any system other than “all citizens vote” becomes is astounding.
“Well what about XyZ?”
Did I stutter? *all* citizens. You all pay taxes, you all live together, choices made by gov effect all of you. So you all get a say. Automatically. Nothing should make any persons voice not count. Yes that includes criminals. ALL get a vote.
For a self proclaimed world leading democracy, so many of the systems in play seem very far removed from that bold claim and much more “keep the current rich white guys in power” encoded in the system as a whole.
@aslakr @mattwilcox They can in Minnnesota, now.
ST. PAUL, Minn. (AP) — At a celebration of Minnesota’s new law that restores voting rights to people who have left prison, Democratic Secretary of State Steve Simon registered newly eligible voters Thursday, when the law went into effect.
@janisf @mattwilcox It's good that they can vote after having served, but they still can't vote while in prison:
> The new law allows people with felony convictions to vote as long as they are not currently incarcerated
Being able to vote while incarcerated seems to be the exception:
> In some places — including Maine, Vermont and the District of Columbia — people with felony convictions can vote while they’re still in prison.
@damkina @mattwilcox in GB local authorities maintain electoral rolls, which list voters at an address, and can be quite painlessly updated via a central website (using what's analogous to a ‘society security number’).
Assuming you don't move (or change name) you won't have to ever do anything, and at least once a year the local elections officer sends a list to each address of the voters recorded at that address, along with their contact details et al, as a reminder should any corrections be needed.
VoterID is sadly a whole other problem, though still more manageable than in the US.
@kcoyle @purple @damkina @mattwilcox How it's done in Canada is that information is updated/harmonized with your tax filings.
While there are still bobbles in practice -- and about four ways to correct them both pre-voting and at your polling station on the day of, for all kinds of situations, including homelessness -- file your taxes annually and you're all good by and large. Current address, name changes, if someone died, the works.
Source: Have poll clerked multiple elections at all levels.
@leahbobet @kcoyle @damkina @mattwilcox yeah as I alluded to we primary use NI numbers for maintaining electoral rolls — which is basically a tax number* and is automatically issued to you age ~16
Sadly it's not as joined up as yours sounds to be, but still things like death should be picked up in typical cases
*: Yes I've skipped over quite some nuances and yes it's quite confusing that the UK of GB & NI includes a country called NI whilst also having part of taxation called NI and bizarrely the tax came first
@kcoyle @damkina @mattwilcox in theory death is handled automatically via a death certificate being issued, and as I said you do have to manually add/remove addresses (you can actually have more than one) :)
And hence the at least annual letter — giving households the chance to notice and rectify mistakes, including unnoticed deaths or permanent address changes
Not quite sure what you mean by ‘state mandated identifies’?
@damkina @mattwilcox 4/ In the end, the goal in democracy is to have a fair, but popular election - we want to get as many people to vote as possible. Policies that seem normal in the US are outrageous if you look at it from this perspective.
And if that sounds weird, in Belgium you're forced to vote - if you don't, you get a fine.
@mattwilcox I guess, then that, instead of registering to vote, Americans need to have some sort of "citizen identification card" or "system of citizenship tracking" to serve as an entry ticket to the polls?
Or does "citizen" = "resident"? Because we DO have a lot of non-citizens who pay taxes, live together, who are affected by gov't choices, but aren't allowed to vote.
@Bodling I think many of the current people in power won't because it's a threat to their power - but as with so many things, "stuff should change" because the morality is obvious and different to the accepted past.
Eventually it will change.
Eventually.
@mattwilcox No. you didn’t stutter. You just missed the valid reasons. people die and should not be left on the rolls to reduce the temptation to commit identity fraud based voting fraud. People move and most elections have residency requirements.
Sure, both of those might be resolved differently but the mechanisms to do so are not in place.
The problem is not purging the rolls per se; it’s using purges as a voter suppression tactic.
@mattwilcox
Frankly, you shouldn't even have to be 18. Youth don't get the credit they deserve for how much they understand the world and are impacted by it.
And you shouldn't have to be a citizen, either, just in the the country in some capacity other than as a tourist. Anyone in the United States has a stake in the outcome of its elections, whether or not they themselves are American.
@mattwilcox I think one practical consideration is, you vote in a different jurisdiction depending on where you live and you need to notify the relevant authority when you move—there’s no concept of “registration” like there is in many places in Europe. And frankly as an Australian I consider that itself a foreign concept.
(But also as an Australian I think voting should be ranked choice and compulsory…)
@ratkins 100% for the “use ranked choice and make sure everyone votes”.
Maybe *then* politicians would also consider proper education about all this stuff at school too, if they suddenly realise that “the uninterested masses” will vote rather than remove themselves from consideration by not voting.
@mattwilcox we have automatic voter registration in Germany for citizens. However, the government or to be more precise the local municipality needs to know where they can send the voter info before the election and - if you do want to vote via mail - an address to send you the ballot.
To be able to do this, you have to register with the municipality once you move there. This address is also used for all other affairs with the state, like taxes, trash collection, etc.
@mattwilcox
After all, in Germany some people even argue "every citizen can vote" is not enough because actually more people live in that state and are affected by its rulings than just citizens.
IMHO it's hard to draw a line though, but worth a thought.
@DiogoConstantino @ColmDonoghue
Also changing the address records in Germany is as simple as going to city Hall, to the correct office with data of the new address, like a rent contract, utilities bill, or a witness. And it is done in 5 /10 minutes.
@ColmDonoghue @Ductos @mattwilcox in most of the EU we have mandatory national ID which includes centralized records of some personal data like address, and all citizens are required to keep records updated when data changes marriage, change of address, etc...).
Usually being a citizen, and being of age, are the only requirements to be allowed to vote. All those things are on the centralized records.
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