Roo79 🇦🇺May 24, 2024
mhoye

I think it’s important to repeat: you don't "have something to hide" when you put blinds on your windows or close the door when you're on the can or wear clothes.

Privacy isn't about having something to hide. It's not about keeping secrets. It's about you being the person who chooses what you reveal about yourself, and when, and to who, and the other word we have for that is "dignity". Your inherent dignity, as a human being.

Your privacy is the agency you have over your dignity.

Dec 22, 2022 at 2:43pmWeb
Show threadmhoyeDec 22, 2022

Everyone who's ever said "if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" is somebody trying to bully you into giving them the power to strip you of your dignity at a moment's notice.

On a whim, whenever it's convenient for them.

That's the fight. It's not about privacy, it's not about secrets, and it never was. It's about power.

Show threadsteve mookie kongDec 22, 2022

@mhoye

When some says "If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear", I always reply with, “that’s awesome! Here’s a pen and paper, write down your logins for your email, storage and social accounts. I’ll be visiting them tonight.”

Show threadArtemisDec 22, 2022

@mookie @mhoye

"I have nothing to hide

But they don't have to know that"

——
ref: https://mastodon.social/@artemissian/109558019739074095

Show threadPete Alex Harris🦡🕸️🌲/∞🪐∫Apr 19, 2023

@artemissian @mookie @mhoye

Maybe I do have something to hide, so what? It's not in general illegal to have "something" to hide. If anyone suspects you're up to "something", it's on them to articulate the specifics clearly enough to get a warrant.

Show threadSad TomatoDec 25, 2022
@mookie @mhoye superb answer.
Show thread💀CirclingTheDrain💀 ✊🇺🇦Dec 26, 2022
@mookie @mhoye also "show me your browser history" is usually good to get the colour draining from the complexion.
Show threadSibrosanDec 28, 2022

@mookie @mhoye

Or ask them to tell you their address and during which period they will be on vacation

Show threadMichał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦Dec 22, 2022

@mhoye 💯

What's too often missed is that this is also contextual and context changes with time.

Some piece of information that is "benign" today might turn out to be life-threatening tomorrow. Or in five years. Or in ten.

People keep missing that. And that's such an important aspect of why we need control over our personal data.

Show threadSoozcatDec 25, 2022
@rysiek @mhoye There are period and fertility trackers that people were using online. Then Roe got overturned. That info was never anyone else's business, but now that it could be weaponized against people in many states, nobody should be able to access it without an individual's express, unpressured permission.
Show threadpdp11hackerDec 26, 2022
@rysiek @mhoye I saw someone else frame it that it’s not that I have anything to hide, I just don’t trust you/your bad faith interpretations
Show threadJohnWJul 5, 2023

@pdp11hacker @rysiek @mhoye

This is the one I like best.

"I prefer to hide my personal information from 'you' because I believe you could either spam me with advertisements that I don't want, or refactor groups of data to potentially make it a damaging situation for me".

Show threadMorganDec 26, 2022
@rysiek @mhoye people/companies/govs knowing my assigned sex was benign until that info started exposing me to transphobia. People/companies/govs knowing I'm queer now is benign, but it won't be if I move somewhere (or somewhere is moved around me) where it's illegal or highly dangerous to be
Show threadMichał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦Dec 26, 2022
@raphaelmorgan @mhoye …or if the situation changes where you live (as it did around queer folk in Russia or Hungary over the years).
Show threadEsther Payne Apr 19, 2023

@rysiek @mhoye its one of the other issues with the consent-o-matic nature of alot of websites collecting data for marketeers. Or browser finger printing.

You don't know down the line where that data will be used or the consequences down the line to the people who gave permission.

It's not really possible for someone to consent to possible consequences. Ultimately those sites shouldn't be collecting that data if you need a pop up Web form to get "consent"

Show threadRené Dec 24, 2022
@mhoye in the #Zcash community, we say #PrivacyIsNormal
Show threadAviva GaryDec 24, 2022

@mhoye "If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" sounds innocent until you realize there are whole groups of people who could determine you just existing to be enough of something for THEM to fear.

That's when its a party.

Oh. FWIW most anything is about power when you scratch the surface hard enough...

Show threadC0unt WAVnsteinDec 26, 2022

@Aviva_Gary @mhoye

That's the problem with humanity. We're all so fuckin' terrified of each other that we hide behind imaginary lines and point weapons at each other.

On the wider point, if anyone thinks if they have nothing to hide, how about their bank details or their wife's sexual fetishes? @mhoye is 100% right; its about dignity and the freedom to choose what to reveal and to whom, rather than having Mark Zuckerberg et al choose for you, and for their gain.

Show threadAviva GaryDec 26, 2022

@C0_WAV @mhoye Indeed... there is that moneyed aspect of it.

And the right to choose (most) anything is pretty important for humans and their lives.

Show threadDaniel BarlowDec 25, 2022
@mhoye "if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" do these people not have doors on their toilet cubicles?
Show threadanders.infosec 💬Dec 25, 2022
@mhoye Well put!
Show threadklondikeDec 25, 2022
@mhoye yes this 1000%
Show threadTakel Dec 26, 2022
@mhoye "Cheery was aware that Commander Vimes didn't like the phrase 'The innocent have nothing to fear', believing the innocent had everything to fear, mostly from the guilty but in the longer term even more from those who say things like 'The innocent have nothing to fear'."
-Terry Pratchett
Show threadThe WubsterDec 26, 2022
@mhoye I can’t stand when a person says “if they have nothing to hide,they have nothing to fear.” I especially despise it in a case of a POC who was stopped by police, unarmed, fled from the police, and was murdered by the cop. A young black male probably has either been harassed by the police himself, or seen what the police have done to unarmed POC. If I stood in his shoes, I’d probably do the same. But, you always hear some people utter that self righteous phrase. #BlackTruth
Show threadEdDec 26, 2022
@mhoye this is exactly why the GDR’s zerzetsung operations included going into a person’s home and leaving “clues”. It takes away your feeling of security and dignity to know that someone can enter your home at will and do what they want.
Show threadLilith Ashley Nyx Arson Dec 26, 2022

@mhoye

“Without privacy, you can't have anything for yourself. Saying you don't care about privacy because you have nothing to hide is like saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say.”
— Edward Snowden, NSA Whistleblower

Show threadJediLeah the Lesbean Lover🏳‍⚧Dec 27, 2022
@mhoye i used to think this then i began to question why and now i hate the idea of constant monitoring
Show threadAral BalkanApr 19, 2023
@mhoye This.
Show threadPaul Wilde  :dontpanic_nobg:Apr 19, 2023
@mhoye the fun fact is, the people that say that still shut their bathroom doors when they go for a poo 

Edit: I missed that you said this in your first post, sorry. But I'm leaving it here anyway because I like saying it :-D
Show threadAngus Marshall  Jul 5, 2023
@mhoye If I've nothing to fear, why are they so interested me?
Show threadyayaNov 13, 2023
@mhoye i keep on being genuinely surprised that this (and some more similar ones, usually about freedoms, choice, rights, privacy) is still a topic to discuss.
didn’t we clear this out back then?
how come same stupid ‘arguments’ are brought up over and over again?
how come there is no progress in development of thinking and understanding what-this-is-about-actually?
yeah, i know - stupid me.
Show threadIrenes (many)Oct 28

@mhoye we agree with this for sure

and, also, we would add that everyone does have something worth hiding, it's just most don't realize it until too late

Show threadb3nDec 22, 2022
@mhoye Real patriots poop with the door open 🙈
Show threadManchDec 22, 2022
@mhoye yep. Privacy is all about having control of the information about yourself. Being able to make an choice. Transparency in privacy is about the people collecting the information giving you the information you need to decide if you want to give your information to them.
Show threadAvis JayDec 22, 2022
@mhoye "It's not that I have something to hide, It's just that I don't have anything to show." Quote from the movie Anon. Can recommend watching it.
Show threadrobrykDec 22, 2022
@mhoye What's the difference between keeping secrets and choosing what and when to reveal?
Show threadmhoyeDec 22, 2022
@robryk what’s the difference between fasting and starving?
Show threadrobrykDec 22, 2022

@mhoye

That one of them is voluntary and the other is not. I fail to see the connection.

Show threadmhoyeDec 22, 2022
@robryk that’s clear.
Show threadrobrykDec 22, 2022
@mhoye Huh? What is?
Show threadAppropriate TributesDec 23, 2022
@mhoye HUMANS FOR THE HUMAN POTENTATE
Show threadTed UnderwoodDec 24, 2022
@mhoye This is deeply true on a philosophic level and also reminds me that I need to put up a curtain rod on one of our bathroom windows
Show threadzeruchDec 24, 2022

@mhoye Agreed. I personally think the concept needs to be taught at the elementary or secondary school level. Some kind of distillation of Daniel Solove's seminal paper on it would be nice: https://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~ccpalmer/teaching/cs55/Resources/Papers/Solove2011.pdf

People in general seem to really understand the idea (or the more paranoid maybe project their darkest fears onto, well everyone and everything and react accordingly)

Show threadmmokhi 🇫🇷🇪🇺Dec 24, 2022

@mhoye @lolautruche
Very will said 👏
I make the same analogy with toilets (we close the door, but we all know how we look like or how we do in there, “nothing to hide”)

Yours is better worded and better articulated 🙌💯 bravo 😊

Show threadNathanDec 25, 2022
@mhoye The sense of entitlement to my information makes me so angry. For the most part, I choose #FLOSS and #privacyrespecting tools out of sheer spite. A company has absolutely no right to know me better than my friends and acquaintances.
Show thread🚴 maricn ✊Dec 25, 2022

@nathanu
@mhoye

That's the point - perhaps I'd share some information about myself to a friend or some photos of me for an artist project, but defaulting access to some irresponsible LLC also being held to no responsibility by the legal and political system that values progress, exploitation and value generated more than personal dignity is what pisses me off.

Show threadTed CutezynskiDec 25, 2022
@mhoye This makes me think of partners that feel entitled to your nudity.
Show threadLapo LuchiniDec 25, 2022
@mhoye I'm not so sure about the "dignity" part myself (I'll think about it 🤔), but I strongly agree on the "privacy isn't about having something to hide" part.
Show threadAdam RoachDec 25, 2022
@mhoye In my long-neglected backlog of blog posts I’d like to write, I have a “explaining why privacy matters even if you think it doesn’t” title, and honestly you’ve done a better job in under 500 characters than I think I’d do with a long-form post. If I ever get around to it, I’d like to quote these words. You good with that?
Show threadBrian ADec 25, 2022

@mhoye my sister once said to me "I'll believe you're secure in your masculinity after you send me a picture of you in a dress and makeup".

First, I don't need to prove anything to her. Second, why does she get to be the arbiter of what security does and doesn't look like?

Show threadBlack Cat RanchDec 27, 2022
@killermonk @mhoye I think your sister needs to go hang out with my sister yes
Show threadHistoPol (#HP) 🏴 🇺🇸 🏴Dec 25, 2022

@mhoye

Absolutely!

Show threadMartin Vermeer FCDDec 25, 2022
@mhoye This 👆️
Show threadJessDec 26, 2022
@mhoye i put up blinds so i can sleep properly at night :)
Show threadBeckyDec 26, 2022
@mhoye I like this. I agree with this

I also think wanting privacy is sometimes about wanting safety too, when people would actively use things (like, for example but not limited to, mental illness) against you or make snap judgements about the kind of person you are based on simple information about you that doesn't necessarily imply what it might to some people
Show threadCyberSecJamesDec 26, 2022
@mhoye I like the line "it's not that I have something to hide, it's that I don't have anything I want to share"
Show threadericse Dec 26, 2022
@mhoye "I need privacy, not because my actions are questionable, but because your judgement and intentions are."
Show threadMatDec 26, 2022

@mhoye

Well said.

Show threadundead enby of the apocalypseDec 26, 2022
@mhoye this, and sometimes people have good reasons to hide things. Not everyone who hides things does so for a nefarious reason and to say otherwise strikes me as deeply authoritarian
Show threadAppropriate TributesDec 26, 2022
@enby_of_the_apocalypse AUTHORITARIANS FOR THE AUTHORITARIAN LORD
Show threadmʕ•ﻌ•ʔm bitPickupDec 26, 2022
#privacy #internet #freeSpeech