Mastodawn

abolitionniste 🇪🇺

As a detour to https://eupolicy.social/@Veza85UE/111688177027828831 @Veza85UE 2.1.2024:
> https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022/03/11/the-versailles-declaration-10-11-03-2022/
I have a question concerning the legal status of such 'declarations'.

More details:
https://trojkatretiho.cz/viewtopic.php?p=242#p242

Or translated:
https://trojkatretiho-cz.translate.goog/viewtopic.php?p=242&_x_tr_sl=cs&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en#p242

@elCelio @pmroman

#MyEU #StatesEU

Veza85UE (@Veza85UE@eupolicy.social)

Attached: 1 image @abolitionniste@bagarrosphere.fr Sure, agreed. Apparently our governments also agreed to a bunch of stuff here, all the way back in March 2022. Everyone can go to their representative in the EUCO and ask them for updates maybe? https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022/03/11/the-versailles-declaration-10-11-03-2022/

EUpolicy.social - A Mastodon server for the EU bubble

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 7, 2024

>> https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022/03/11/the-versailles-declaration-10-11-03-2022/
> I have a question concerning the legal status of such 'declarations'.

What is the 'legal status' of such 'declarations'?

For me with this 'declaration' with the words "informal meeting", the question is, what the legal status of this 'declaration' actually is. Somehow it seems to me, that it is neither part of 'legislating activity'(?) of the European Union, nor is it an "international treaty". It seems to me more like a "letter of intent" of the current rulers...

HistoPol (#HP) 🏴 🇺🇸 🏴Jan 7, 2024

@EU_Commission
@EU_Commission

Good question:

#Legal status of #Declaration of #Versailles in 2022 regarding the #Russian attack on #Ukraine?

https://bagarrosphere.fr/@abolitionniste/111714879996868994

Cc @abolitionniste

abolitionniste 🇪🇺 (@abolitionniste@bagarrosphere.fr)

>> https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022/03/11/the-versailles-declaration-10-11-03-2022/ > I have a question concerning the legal status of such 'declarations'. What is the 'legal status' of such 'declarations'? For me with this 'declaration' with the words "informal meeting", the question is, what the legal status of this 'declaration' actually is. Somehow it seems to me, that it is neither part of 'legislating activity'(?) of the European Union, nor is it an "international treaty". It seems to me more like a "letter of intent" of the current rulers...

Mastodon Bagarrosphère France

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 7, 2024

I now have an confirmation of @elCelio :
> ... the same of the declarations of other intergovernmental meetings such as the G20: no legal value.

So I take the 'declarations' and 'informal meetings' as part of the 'political theatre' and of the 'political socializing'(?), which are important. And I am more interested in the 'formal political acts' such a legislating and money and... There is something called European Council conclusions https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/european-council/conclusions/

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 7, 2024

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/european-council/conclusions/

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2023/12/15/european-council-conclusions-14-and-15-december-2023/

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/media/68967/europeancouncilconclusions-14-15-12-2023-en.pdf

"15. The European Council decides to open accession negotiations with Ukraine and with the
Republic of Moldova.

The European Council invites the Council to adopt the respective negotiating frameworks
once the relevant steps set out in the respective Commission recommendations of
8 November 2023 are taken."

So, here we have "decides"(!) and more opaque "invites"...

Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO Jan 7, 2024

@abolitionniste They have none. The European Council is, however, supposed to provide the Commission with guidelines on policy direction.

Essentially it is equivalent to a Resolution of Parliament, but for member states

el Celio 🇪🇺 🇺🇦Jan 7, 2024

@jmaris @abolitionniste if i'm not wrong, the guidelines for the Commission are the "conclusions" not the "declarations"

Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO Jan 7, 2024

@elCelio @abolitionniste officially, yes. But declarations still serve as de facto guidelines.

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 7, 2024

Would it be possible to separate clearly, what are (1) the 'formal'(?) rules and what are (2) 'informal' or 'de facto' 'influences' or 'guidelines' or 'directions'? I am confused 🙂

Re all this 8 toots: https://trojkatretiho.cz/viewtopic.php?p=271#p271

@elCelio @HistoPol @jmaris @nooartur @pmroman @Veza85UE

#MyEU #StatesEU #EUCO #EC

Evropská rada (EUCO) - Trojka třetího

Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO Jan 7, 2024

@abolitionniste @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @pmroman @Veza85UE formal are legally recognised provisions of the treaties.

Informal are practices built around those provisions, but not formalised.

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 8, 2024

Yes 🙂

So, we have the Treaties. I guess it is this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/collection/eu-law/treaties/treaties-force.html .

So, what the Treaties say about the EUCO declarations and about the conclusions? Or more generally, how the Treaties set the legislative processes and decision making and the roles of the bodies?

Should I study the Treaties or is there a concise and accessible description at the level for, say, students of a secondary school?

@jmaris @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @pmroman @Veza85UE

Treaties currently in force - EUR-Lex

EU treaties currently in force

pmroman 🇪🇺Jan 8, 2024

@jmaris @abolitionniste @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @Veza85UE That's my understanding too.

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 8, 2024

Yes 🙂

So formal is, for example, paragraph 1 of article 15 of #TEU https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A12016M015 :

> The European Council shall provide the Union with the necessary impetus for its development and shall define the general political directions and priorities thereof. It shall not exercise legislative functions.

Shall I study the Treaties or is some concise description of the roles of the Union Bodies available?

@pmroman @jmaris @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @Veza85UE

EUR-Lex - 12016M015 - EN - EUR-Lex

Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO Jan 8, 2024

@abolitionniste @pmroman @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @Veza85UE honestly the issue with being concise in the EU is that involves leaving things out, the treaties are the best place to look.

What is not written: the European Council is also where important issues that could not be resolved in the Council of the European Union are resolved.

In fact, some (me) consider the EC to simply be a special configuration of the Council of the EU

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 8, 2024

Can't find what is "EC TL" 🙂

@jmaris @pmroman @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @Veza85UE

#MyEU #EC #EUCO

abolitionniste 🇪🇺Jan 8, 2024

Well, #I understand that the 27 #StatesEU representatives in #EUCO want to control #MyEU. The powerful want more power or all power. And some people may go with it. May accept it as the only way. For #me , this is a wrong arrangement. Wrong concept. Let us think how #we change it by 12.12.2121 🙂

@jmaris @pmroman @elCelio @HistoPol @nooartur @Veza85UE

HistoPol (#HP) 🏴 🇺🇸 🏴Jan 8, 2024

@jmaris
Thank you for pointing this out.
@elCelio @abolitionniste