@elCelio @pmroman
I agree that the majority have 0 interest in making the EU work better (it would be a perk, if only someone else did the work and the vision thingy and ONLY as long as it doesn't inconvenience them)... BUT. That might turn out for the better under the right circumstances (and with vastly improved personnel - but that's on us, the voters).
I think we NEED more, not less, politics. Not the way Orban does it, but these clashes of interests are normal.
@pmroman I've had this open in another tab for 3 days. I'm not even sure I want to read it, I may need to buy alcohol first.
https://legrandcontinent.eu/fr/2023/12/13/lallemagne-contre-leurope-1/
Le plus grand paradoxe de l’Union se trouve en Allemagne. Alors que le pays est l’un des plus attachés à la construction européenne, il est aussi l’un des plus grands adversaires de ce processus. De ses choix budgétaires à sa diplomatie, cette perspective nourrie retrace l’histoire de politiques qui ont affaibli l’Union et l’Allemagne. En creux se pose une question : est-il encore possible de changer de trajectoire ?
@pmroman oh dear oh dear. I'm not a fan of this article at all. The German Constitutional court's rulings, while not ideal, are the least of Europe's problems.
The Conseil d'État deliberately misinterpreting CJEU rulings, however, is.
Moreover, the general attitude of France (my home country) is majorly problematic : essentially, it is their way or not at all.
We've seen this with Ukraine aid, where France has insisted the aid we provide should be made in the EU to boost fr defence industry.
https://legrandcontinent.eu/fr/2023/12/13/lallemagne-contre-leurope-1/
@jmaris wrote:
> oh dear oh dear. I'm not a fan of this article at all...
#GermanyEU #FranceEU #StatesEU... #MyEU #GeoEU... #WhatAreWeDoingHere?
Le plus grand paradoxe de l’Union se trouve en Allemagne. Alors que le pays est l’un des plus attachés à la construction européenne, il est aussi l’un des plus grands adversaires de ce processus. De ses choix budgétaires à sa diplomatie, cette perspective nourrie retrace l’histoire de politiques qui ont affaibli l’Union et l’Allemagne. En creux se pose une question : est-il encore possible de changer de trajectoire ?
@abolitionniste @jmaris @ashtime @OBabasch @pmroman
Whatever about the article (yes, it's very French, yes I laughed by the end when évidemment France is a total failure in the EU and the national navel stinks). I hadn't even read it, I was responding with it as a read I wasn't looking forward to to this:
"the "no debt" obsession is irrational."
No amount of whataboutism about France or Poland or Malta will ever make that statement (and the 1 consensus paragraph in the article) less true.
@Veza85UE writes:
> why delusions grip entire political cultures
What if "common delusion" is normal / usual state of big human societies? What if things like plurality, alternatives, rational discourse or politics thrive only in special circumstances? What if to keep these #ValuesEU #we have to do something different than what #we have been doing until now. My suggestion: continute conversation with @abolitionniste @ashtime @elCelio @jmaris @OBabasch @pmroman @Veza85UE
@pmroman, yes.
For #me, a fundamental fact / truth is that the #EU exists and as you put it:
> ...find a way, they always did.
For me, the EU is a miracle. I am lucky I am an element of it. I want to know it. I want to take care of it. I want to "speak about public policy" with other elements of it. I want to delegate a lot to other elements of it. (I am aware of the role of the member states.) Long thrive the EU 🇪🇺.
Veza85UE
pmroman 🇪🇺
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
abolitionniste 🇪🇺