HalvarFlakeOct 31, 2023

A quick thread on the intensity of Israel's invasion of Gaza. Language about "precision strikes" can distract from understanding just how intense the aerial campaign was.

Strategic bombing of civilian infrastructure was a staple of the Allied WW2 strategy. The estimated death toll among the civilian population was 350k-500k, on a population of 80m, so about 0.4-0.6% over a period of 3 years.

If the Gaza death toll is ballpark accurate, 8000 deaths on 2m inhabitants is 0.4% in *three weeks*.

David ManheimOct 31, 2023
Show threadHalvarFlake

Even if you were to discount the official death toll by half we are still speaking about a devastation that took years of bombing in WW2 in 3 weeks.

This is a reminder that *there are no precision strikes in a densely populated city*. While I appreciate Israel's efforts (lawyers overseeing strikes etc), the truth is: If the strategic bombing campaigns of WW2 were terrible, this is the same terrible, at a faster rate.

Oct 31, 2023 at 8:13amWeb
Show threadNfoonfOct 31, 2023
@HalvarFlake 99,9% of germany was never bombed you are comparing an urbanized area with a with a rural agricultural state. to mean anything you should compare to a city like hamburg or berlin. even then what would be the benfit of that? hamas gets its legitimization from civil casualties. it needs them, and it will always take measures to keep them as high as possible.
Show threadNfoonfOct 31, 2023
@HalvarFlake hamas and iran are the only geopolitical ruling bodies, that put their geopolitical goals (the destruction of israel) before their interior politics. even in relative peaceful time, iran takes bigger measures to supply hamas with scarce products like medical supplies than it takes to supply their own people.
Show threadNfoonfOct 31, 2023
@HalvarFlake this is the problem we westerners have with hamas and russia at the moment. russia does not care about death toll of their soldiers, which makes it hard to fight. how do you defeat an opponent that does not care about its own soldiers? same wirh hamas. Hamas declares in its carta, that death is a sacrifice that every inhabitant of gaza must be willing to bring at any time and any age. so how do you fight a war there?
Show threadHalvarFlakeOct 31, 2023

@Nfoonf the statement that "99.9% of Germany was never bombed" is simply false when measured by population (which you have to do because nobody cares if you bomb an empty area). It's *even false when measured by area*, which is an achievement.

The Ruhrgebiet alone harbored more than 5% of the German population and *was* carpet bombed.

I know it's difficult to engage soberly with the facts in these heated times, but please try.

Show threadNfoonfOct 31, 2023
@HalvarFlake i stay corrected the 99,9% was BS and you are right. yeah arguing soberly became more difficult in the last few years. I should have thought a few seconds more to make a valid argument.
Show threadHalvarFlakeOct 31, 2023
@Nfoonf thank you. *Hug*. I am sorry for the terrible situation. Let's hope there's a better future for everybody in our lifetimes.
Show threadGOct 31, 2023
@HalvarFlake doesn't that depend on what fraction of the alleged 2000 were combatants?
Show threaddr2chaseOct 31, 2023
@stark @HalvarFlake Depends how you define "aligned", doesn't it? You're trying to turn a squishy word into a number. (This is why we often see counts of dead children, to neutralize attempts to make some deaths not matter.)