Rajarshi ParmarOct 15, 2023
Andrew Stroehlein
When I tell people children are being slaughtered, and they want to know which children before moving into outrage mode or justification mode - that mentality, that conditional humanity, is exactly the problem.
Oct 15, 2023 at 12:01pmMastodon for iOS
Show threadAndrew StroehleinOct 16, 2023

I expanded on this thought for my Daily Brief newsletter today…

🗞️ Read in English: https://www.hrw.org/the-day-in-human-rights/2023/10/16?story=paragraph-6765

📰 Lire en français : https://www.hrw.org/fr/news/2023/10/16/se-mefier-de-lhumanite-conditionnelle

🔊 Listen: https://www.hrw.org/video-photos/audio/2023/10/16/beware-conditional-humanity-daily-brief-16-october-2023

Beware Conditional Humanity: Daily Brief

When I post something about children being killed, I see some readers first wanting to know which children, before moving into outrage mode or justification mode. That mentality, that conditional humanity, is a significant part of the problem @astroehlein

Human Rights Watch
Show threadKatjaOct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein 👏🏾👏🏾
Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein I usually ask which side Hamás is slaughtering now. Since regardless of who is the victim, 9 out of 10 times the perpetrator is the same.
Show threadJuneSim63 💚Oct 15, 2023
@AElliotPR @andrewstroehlein So you're asserting that 90% of Palestinians who died due to unnatural causes were killed by Hamas? Is that what you mean?
I abhor Hamas, but I think your claim needs some factual backing. Meanwhile, your whataboutery deflects from Israel's culpability.
Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 15, 2023
@junesim63 @andrewstroehlein Israeli culpability? Yeah, like you talk about British culpability for the rise of Hitler through the treaty of Versailles. Talking about whataboutery. Israel has been attacked. What part of that are you not able to see?
Show threadHeavenlyPossumOct 15, 2023

@AElliotPR @andrewstroehlein @junesim63

Israel was attacked by Hamas, not by Palestinian children, almost 800 of people whom have been killed by the IDF in the last few days. This is not some abstract “root causes” argument; the IDF is choosing to kill those children who did not cause any Israelis any harm.

Show threadFranchescaOct 15, 2023
@AElliotPR @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein Just so we are clear, are you ok with the response being the complete genocide of Palestinians in Gaza?
Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 16, 2023
@Frantasaur @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein No. And it's not. Simple.
Show threadFranchescaOct 17, 2023
@AElliotPR @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein if there is something that this situation definitely isn’t, it’s “simple”.
Show threadNamanOct 15, 2023
@AElliotPR @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein Hamas: Mercilessly slaughters civilians and kidnaps some
Israel: Outraged, acts to avenge its citizens and mercilessly slaughters civilians including its own people that had been taken as hostages. Uses tragedy grab the land it’s been slowly encroaching on for decades.
Show threadori AOct 16, 2023
@AElliotPR @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein netanyahu has been indirectly funding hammas for years in order to divide the Palestinians and prevent a Palestinian state. That's his policy, it's all very public. Saying this as an Israeli. Just a regular co-op between entities with common goals. Until they aren't so common
Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 17, 2023
@ori_a @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein I agree that policy was hugely mistaken. There are many reasons to criticise the Israeli government, not so to deny Israel's right to exist. The US supported Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. The UK, the EU and the US continue to support Saudi Arabia and Qatar. Thanks to Barack Obama, we got the Muslim Brotherhood. Nobody used these facts to justify September 11, March the 11 in Madrid or July 7 in the UK. I'm all for fair criticism.
Show threadori AOct 17, 2023
@AElliotPR @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein I have friends and family in those southern border burnt houses. I am Israeli. Its just that internally people here are also fuming at netanyahu... Because he kind of let it happen
Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 18, 2023
@ori_a @junesim63 @andrewstroehlein I agree. I'm not an apologist for Netanyahu however I feel a lot of the coverage here is incredibly partial and almost pro Hamas and it's important to see both sides of the story. More about balance than ignoring Israel's mistakes. And the US has made huge foreign policy mistakes in the past but it doesn't mean I'm going to protest and burn their flags on the streets of Teheran.
Show threadTexty the BardOct 15, 2023
@junesim63 @AElliotPR @andrewstroehlein "Israel's horrid, right-wing government" is not spelled "Israeli." My extended family--including someone with cancer and a 2 year old--who are currently being evacuated from their home north of Tel Aviv didn't vote for Bibi and his crew of monsters. Why should they be in danger? They did nothing to bring this on.
Show threadAshraf Talib Al-HinaiOct 15, 2023

@AElliotPR @andrewstroehlein

Well , the numbers don't support your 9 out of 10 estimate.

Show threadAdrián ElliotOct 15, 2023
@ashraf_t @andrewstroehlein The numbers? Right. Tell me the numbers.
Show threadDame HollyOct 16, 2023
@AElliotPR You expect this godawful pro-genocide trolling on Twitter. It's really disappointing to see it here.
Show threadJane DoeOct 16, 2023
@AElliotPR @andrewstroehlein What is criticising Hamas going to accomplish here? Their tactics are deeply unethical, true, but they aren’t at the core of this conflict, Israel’s colonialism is. Best case scenario, you eliminate Hamas, other militants supplant them, and the conflict continues with somewhat fewer civilian casualties. Worst case scenario, Israel uses that rhetoric to justify mass murder and dispossession. It seems unproductive.
Show threadPooblemooOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein Exactly. And when I bring up that many of the children and their families caught in the crosshairs of all of this cannot get out feasibly I am met with an exasperated sigh, "Well that's just the way it is, there will be casualties of war." I cannot accept that.
Show thread(((Jann Gobble)))🏳️‍🌈Oct 15, 2023

@andrewstroehlein Sometimes those people are simply asking which children you're talking about to see if YOU have conditional humanity, maybe... Just a thought.

It might not be best to judge others' humanity based on one sentence. Maybe talk with them more...

One sentence is just not enough.

@lisamelton

Show threadPēteris KrišjānisOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein the good old tribal instinct
Show threadOtownKimOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein Some Humans are just a waste of air!!
Show threadFormundZweckOct 15, 2023
@otownKim @andrewstroehlein that would be animal farm: all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others.
Show threadNick's worldOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein The fact that children are being killed at all is a problem. It shouldnt matter if they're born from Israel, palastine, or even Hamas. Kids are innocent.
Show threadLenaOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein no one in their half-right mind wants children hurt, and no one should use children as human shields
Show threadAshraf Talib Al-HinaiOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein couldn't agree more.
This insanity has to end.
Show threadAlexOct 15, 2023

@andrewstroehlein I do not have enough capacity to feel sorrow and horror for every single tragedy going on today, I would go insane.
So when asking for details, it is not because of callousness, but because of need to align to the context of incoming news.

What is going on right now is nothing short of genocide, and the fact that there are so many public and political supporters is beyond insane.

Show threadxs4me2Oct 15, 2023

@andrewstroehlein

Shame on them…

Show threadAlexander Portnoy 🌊 🏳️‍🌈Oct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein
Funny how the "All Lives Matter" crowd is laying low right now.
Show threadIpso FactoOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein Want to really challenge them? Ask them why don’t they care about the rest of the violent conflicts that are taking place all over the world every year. Some of these conflicts have been going on for decades with hundreds of thousands of lives lost, but we barely spend any media coverage on those. I like to do this with pro-lifers who complain about the thousands of abortions in the US but say nothing about the 10s of millions worldwide.
Show threadZZ BottomOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein Indeed and it is frustrating to see that so many still think and react like that. Those never cared about any but themselves.
Show threadTinaQuiltsOct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein I'm trying to listen and read carefully from a range of sources. The politics and history behind this situation is, for me anyway, complex and needs some more research. I'm horrified by actions on both 'sides' and reflecting that there are all kinds of people, many of them young, vulnerable, helpless really, who are being terribly impacted by all this. I'm hoping someone can lead this region to some sort of peaceful solution that is fair.
Not convinced this will happen.
Show threada.d. 🗽🇺🇸Oct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein clearly you’re talking about republican maga people. The pestilence of America.
Show threadKSHernandez ♊(she/her/they)Oct 15, 2023
@andrewstroehlein You're right about that.
Show threadSeth 🎙️Oct 15, 2023

@andrewstroehlein As a Jew and a human, there is not justification for this.

Does Hamas have to pay for what they did? Yes. But this way? No. Come on can't Mossad or Shin Bet go in quietly and get them? Geezus.

Show threadGOct 15, 2023
@pch @andrewstroehlein it would be convenient if we could just invent fantasy to real life problems
Show threadyour auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦Oct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein blow this the fuck up poster size and give it to every one of them. post this prominently EVERYWHERE!!!
Show threadGOct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein Gaza had been and is today again tragedy and the victims that suffer the most in any conflict are the innocent. It's much harder to tell who is to blame and where we went wrong. Especially when so much of the information we see is what it is.
Show threadGatekeeper..Oct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein
The 4 Billion BiBi gets every year from the USA sure doesn't go far does it..12M a day just for security?
Show thread此用户太懒还未取名Oct 16, 2023

@andrewstroehlein I think the problem is the conflicts between Palestine and Israel are too complex, none of them are pure innocent. And if I want to talk this, that means I need to read large amount of history, so I just get confuse (my bad) and don’t know how to comment them.

For example, I think massacre against civilians are unforgivable, but from the message I get so far, both of them are not clean.

Show threadOrca 🌻 | 🎀 | 🪁 | 🏴🏳️‍⚧️Oct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein ​​
https://kolektiva.social/@VPS_Reports/111242130588817372
Vishal P. Singh 🏳️‍⚧️ They/He (@[email protected])

Attached: 1 image The names of the Palestinian children killed by Israeli forces written on a wall in Los Angeles.

kolektiva.social
Show threadTiggerthecatOct 16, 2023
@andrewstroehlein
Show threadAshraf Talib Al-HinaiOct 19, 2023

@andrewstroehlein
What is happening in Palestine is so ridiculous that it is best discussed by a comedian.

https://youtu.be/4idQbwsvtUo?feature=shared

Search for Piers Morgan Bassem interview.
You will learn a lot.

Israel-Hamas War: Piers Morgan vs Bassem Youssef On Palestine's Treatment | The Full Interview

YouTube
Show threadGJ Groothedde 🇪🇺Nov 3, 2023
@andrewstroehlein This is painfully accurate.