Mastodawn

It's nice that #Unity3D walked back to terms that don't apply unless you use their latest engine, but that's the take-away: you need to not use their latest anymore. Finish your game. Find another engine. This is just an escape clause.

Anyone who sticks with them will get screwed the next time their c-suite wants to goose their stock price.

If you can find a way to keep making games on old Unity versions, that works too probably. But. You'll hit issues if you want to target consoles. There is no porting path for most (any?) Unity versions more than 2 years old at time of port.

EDIT: (but really even old versions, they already changed their minds once on that, so assuming they won't again is foolish- find a new engine after you finish out current projects)

AyotoCorp Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg Assuming that they don't decide to retroactively change things again. There's nothing in either of their posts saying that they can't do that, and it's far from being any kind of legal document. Literally nothing stopping someone from just shoving everyone into a sacrificial lava pit for $3.50 and a bottle of soda in the future.

Charlie R Sep 22, 2023

@AyotoCorp @glassbottommeg Yeah, no doubt they will change the terms again when another quarter is looking down.

They want everyone transitioned to the runtime fees eventually. So they can slowly raise the fees over the years and find new ways to track end users for their ad business.

I still recommend dropping them and investing knowledge into other engines. It's never too late.

Matt Wells Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg the letter is so confusing. I'm not even sure what they're trying to say, though you've hit the subtext on the head.

Dan Johnson Sep 22, 2023

@mattwells @glassbottommeg

TLDR:
1) they killed the $0.20/install for Personal projects over $200k; instead, Personal plans must upgrade to Pro if they pass that threshold.
2) for Pro+ projects over $1mill, fee schedule unchanged but capped at 2.5% rev.
3) Policy applies to Unity 2023 LTS and onward.

The requirement to upgrade from Personal means a $2k/y expense for projects over $200k, but $2k is just 10k installs at $0.20 each. So a net positive for $200k-$1m revenue projects.

Dan Johnson Sep 22, 2023

@mattwells @glassbottommeg but as Meg and others point out, there's no reassurance they won't try something like this again down the road. So Meg's advice to finish what you're doing and then change engines is spot on.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@djdesign @mattwells @glassbottommeg
Small correction:
The next version that ships in 2024 is 2023 LTS

Also, splash screen is optional and Plus is still discontinued (but for more please see the FAQ)

Personal opinion: the last 2 weeks will probably not be forgotten for quite a while. I am hopeful that the memory of them plus the ToS non-retroactivity clause being back will hold for the foreseeable future🤞.
Yes I can be an idealist sometimes 🤷.

Megan Fox Sep 23, 2023

@MartinTilo @djdesign @mattwells they've literally said the ToS can't be changed retroactively before. They just deleted it for this. What they brought back was the thing they deleted.

They can just do this again next year. Nothing prevents it.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@glassbottommeg @djdesign @mattwells
I'd say a forum thread of more than 300 pages prevents it, as it is part of the public record that an action like this will have outsized negative consequences compared to anything that could be gained that way.
In this way the last 2 weeks do not even come close to 2019.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@glassbottommeg @djdesign @mattwells
But yes, trust has to be regained first.
For my part, I've shifted focus for the last two weeks and did stuff that was not just way outside of my job description but also my pay grade, because I am part of the community since long before I joined the company, and so did (and feel) lots of my colleagues.

I'll now refocus on doing my best with making the Profiler as awesome as I can make it, but I will also not let these weeks be forgotten.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@glassbottommeg @djdesign @mattwells also how I hear this, the repro was removed because someone thought that a history of ToS versions embedded on the website was more the norm than a GitHub repo.
Correlation != Causation

... even if that may be hard to believe in this case.

Dan Johnson Sep 23, 2023

@MartinTilo @glassbottommeg @mattwells intended/connected or not, the initial announcement absolutely included both released and currently in-development projects.

I respect the employees working their asses off to try and repair the damage, but if Unity wants me to believe they'll honor their own TOS without exception, they need some ironclad proof.

TBH the only thing that came to mind was to put management of the TOS in an independent trust, with all alterations approved by both parties.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@djdesign @glassbottommeg @mattwells
I agree. Though there is also never going to be a 100% guarantee. That's not a world we live in. Regulations, Unions, Courts of Law or other Institutions can offer some recourse but nothing can reach 100% ironclad security.

And if one thing is somewhat ensured, another thing might change next. Like Airport security, you can only ever do some form of security theater based on previously known threats. It's a fundamental aspect of life and society.

Martin Tilo Schmitz Sep 23, 2023

@djdesign @glassbottommeg @mattwells or as I've just recently learned, this is sort of where the concept of having to stay "woke" comes from (coming out of black culture in the US, see my boosted toots). Any form of "progressiveness" that had to be fought for can be undone again.

ClutchAbuse Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg really this is a wakeup call for any developer relying on a commercial engine. Something like this will happen to Unreal at some point. Maybe not anytime soon, especially with the massive pr dumpster fire Unity caused. But C level people come and go and the MBA hubris is really ratcheting up in tech in general. I'm hoping in a few years engines like Godot mature to the point where they really can be viable for medium sized teams and larger commercial projects.

@ClutchAbuse @glassbottommeg not that I like unreal either but with unreal at least due to the license they can only change going forward, not already licensed releases. Unity gets away with this because their license agreement allows them to retroactively change it later.

It would still suck for devs to have to migrate away, which is why I advocate for never building your base on someone elses proprietary software, but at least they can't bankrupt you years later for something already released

Roknrol Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg When someone shows you who they are, believe them.

I wish internet people had staying power though. In two weeks time this will be mostly forgotten.

rubikcuber Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg I have "perpetual" licences for 4 and 5 and I'm sure last time I went to install them I couldn't. Or I couldn't release the license from an old defunct machine. I might have been able to muddle around it with some work, but certainly there was some friction there. Basically you are dependent on them still serving and activating legacy licenses. And all the trust that they will do that is gone.

paint-goblin 🐀Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg don't forget that the engine version seem to magically disappear from download servers pretty often

Sauce; I came back to a new role with an old group, and, couldn't get the exact version of 5 leading to a lot of messages that may have been hiding actual problems

Nikki Sep 22, 2023

@glassbottommeg yup

Basically "we figured out that breaking into your home and shitting on your sofa was a bad idea. We will not do that. But the next sofa you buy will arrive preshitted."

Tacitus 🇮🇪

@glassbottommeg

Right. This is the second time they tried to weaponise their EULA with retroactive changes. There will be a third time, and that might be when they get away with it.

Matty Roses Sep 23, 2023

@glassbottommeg it's silly to not use open source if you don't want to he a victim of owners

Anis Sep 23, 2023

@glassbottommeg n'utilisez pas unité 3 ce n'est qu'une question de temps avant qu'il revienne sur cette décision ce serait juste une question de temps le temps que la polémique passe