spaceghotiSep 12, 2023

Child poverty in the United States just more than doubled. You can thank Joe Manchin.

https://lemmy.one/post/3816360

Child poverty in the United States just more than doubled. You can thank Joe Manchin. - Lemmy.one

The United States’ poverty rate experienced its largest one-year jump on record last year, with the rate among children more than doubling from 2021’s historic low of 5.2 percent to 12.4 percent according to new numbers from the US Census Bureau out today. They’re the latest data to reflect the devastating effects following the expiration of nearly all pandemic-era relief programs. That includes the end of Medicaid rules that protected recipients from getting kicked off because of administrative errors, an end to rental assistance policies, and the restart of student loan payments. These policies might seem like a distant memory at this point. But they’re worth recalling with the arrival of every new report. Each demonstrates what happens when politicians long hostile to caregivers, universal health care, and the welfare state, for a brief moment, acted to create powerful, federally-backed safety net programs aimed at helping everyday Americans. One of the most effective programs to emerge was the expansion of the child tax credit, which provided families monthly checks of up to $300 per child and broadened eligibility rules for qualifying families. In turn, child poverty rates plummeted; the extra income allowed caregivers to quit grueling second and third jobs; parents were able to buy their kids decent clothes and help stop taunting at school. The Census Bureau previously reported that food insecurity dropped dramatically after just the first extended payment, from 10.7 million households reporting they didn’t have enough food to 7.4 million. But as the pandemic receded, Republicans with the help of West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin, who in private remarks reportedly warned that families were using the extra income to buy drugs, appeared to remember the country’s longstanding pre-pandemic hostility. Their opposition ultimately tanked President Biden’s agenda, and along with it, the brief life of the expanded child tax credit. That’s something worth remembering today as the predictable crowd is likely to cry about Democratic-engineered inflation.

Show threadjudgeholden [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
it’s strange how ‘doubling child poverty’ is never on those big lists that redditors post whenever someone asks what joe biden’s done
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023
Wow…your comment is so dumb I was literally left speeches for a while
Show threadTokenBoomerSep 12, 2023
Because of it’s truth?
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023
Most definetly not lol. Because 1. You completely ignored the article and its main point 2. You showed how little you followed/understood of what happened in US politics for the past 3 years and 3. You keep doubling down in your own ignorance, like a proper fool is has no idea of what is going on and yet is dead convinced of his own…let’s call it “reasons”
Show threadchauncey [he/him]Sep 12, 2023

Did Biden fight tooth and nail to push through his agenda? Nope.

So it’s completely reasonable to say that Biden allowed childhood poverty to double under his watch.

Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

See my points above lol they seem to fit you as well.

With the “majority” down to literally 2 people, enlighten me and everyone else: how should have things gone according to you? How would YOU have fought tooth and nail while not risking to lose any practical way to govern? I’ll wait

Show threadjudgeholden [he/him]
make those 2 people vote the way you want?
Sep 12, 2023 at 8:37pmWeb
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023
LMAO How?? You force them with a gun? Lol
Show threadjudgeholden [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
you bring them into your office and say hey, you vote the way I want to or I’m going to destroy your fuckin life. direct the IRS to find any discrepancy in their taxes, direct the DOJ to find any thing they’ve ever done wrong in their life, charge them with one of those bullshit charges like wire fraud. these people are absolute cowards, they don’t care about anything other than protecting their wealth - make that slightly inconvenient for them and they’ll buckle. or honestly just have the CIA kill them, who cares? the CIA is off killing foreign politicians anyway, may as well kill some of our own that are holding things up.
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

I see. So as long as it fits you, you’re OK with literal murder and with the president turning into a full blown dictator. I’m sure nothing could go wrong with that…

I’m done with you and your sad attempts at discussing.

Show threadBelieveRevolt [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
You asked and he answered, sometimes AuThoRiTaRiAnIsM is how you actually get things done.
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023
Not in democracies it’s not. And I’m glad I live in one, so shitty people like you cannot kill others simply because they don’t do what YOU want them to do
Show threadBelieveRevolt [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
Enjoy your democratic child poverty 👍
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

Oh fuck off 🤣 what, now you got your feelings hurt after speaking in favor of authoritarianism? LMAO

I absolutely hate this and them too but you and some other users here think thathe you can just tough guy your way out of complex political cooperation.

Don’t act like I’m in favor of child poverty, because I’m not. I’m simply not as delusional as you are

Show threadBelieveRevolt [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
lol, I bet you think killing Nazis is bad too and there’s some kind of rule that states you have to have reactionaries in your politics instead of just getting rid of them.
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

Again you really like pretending to be a tough guy, don’t you? 🤣 and also putting words in others mouths.

Fuck Nazis and kill them if you see them. I just don’t want unhinged people like you anywhere near actual power since you think you can just force elected representatives to do what you like.

Show threadMelonius [he/him]Sep 12, 2023

you think you can just force elected representatives to do what you like.

Imagine having elected officials doing what you like. Instead they do whatever corporate donors pay them to.

Best to let capital sort it out - wouldn’t want to enforce the will of the people or anything.

Show threadFlinch [he/him]Sep 13, 2023

In freedom democracy burgerland, the average citizen has 0 influence on their elected officials decision making, and must resort to hoping they do something effectual. This is good and rational.

In authoritarian, freedom-hating China, a recall vote can be initiated against a politician at literally any time by their constituents if they feel the will of the people is not being enacted. This is horrible, and bad.

Show threadShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]Sep 14, 2023
Crylaugh emojis are not the flawless cover for being flustered that you seem to think they are.
Show threadAnonTwoSep 12, 2023

Because authoritarian governments aren't known for poverty 👍

I guess at least when you complain about it, you can just die instead of having to live with it.

Show threadAntiOutsideAktion [he/him]Sep 12, 2023

Okay so address the point without latching onto the most extreme conceit they made. God forbid anything happen to a coal baron senator.

With all of the power of the executive branch, the democratic party apparatus, and the leadership of the body they are members of, you can excuse zero attempts to coerce their votes?

Show threadSovietyWoomy [any]Sep 12, 2023
You live in a democracy? When is the last time you and everyone else in your workplace got together to make a decision democratically instead of that decision being made unilaterally?
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ you really like feeling opressed, don’t you?

Things can immensely suck, but don’t act like it’s a dictatorship. It cheaps the word when there are ACTUAL dictatorships in the world

Show threadcombat_brandonism [they/them]Sep 13, 2023
we literally have the largest per-capita incaceration rate in the history of the modern world what the fuck are you talking about ACTUAL dictatorships
Show threadRam_The_Manparts [he/him]Sep 13, 2023

What’s even worse is that the person we’re replying to is likely fully aware of how the US has been sending its military and intelligence forces all over the world for the last 70-80 years to violently crush any movement that opposes it, and yet they still believe that the US is somehow not “authoritarian”

Liberals live in a fantasy world.

Show threadBurgerPunk [he/him, comrade/them]Sep 13, 2023
Not just psr capita. US has the largest pridon population period
Show threadRam_The_Manparts [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
At this point someone should probably dig up that research paper that shows that what the US public wants has no influence on what is carried out by the US state.
Show threadAlaskaball [comrade/them, any]Sep 13, 2023
bud, you could literally rub their noses in the most solid evidence and they won’t accept it in the same way you can drag a mule to water but you can’t make the jackass drink
Show threadRam_The_Manparts [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
Oh I know this clown would never get it, but still
Show threadDoiDoi [comrade/them, he/him]Sep 12, 2023
You live in the US which has the world’s largest prison population by both total numbers and percent of the population. Is this the non-authoritarian democracy you’re talking about here?
Show threadAnonTwoSep 12, 2023
You sound like you want a Mafia family, not a government....
Show threadlamassuSep 12, 2023
We are talking about the US state, aren’t we?
Show threadpingvenoSep 12, 2023
You’ve just described grounds for impeachment and removal of the president. The full House and Senate would turn on them at that point.
Show threadjudgeholden [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
at which point you have the military arrest all of them and establish a dictatorship of the proletariat
Show threadpingvenoSep 13, 2023
No thanks. You claim to speak for the people, but really you only want power for your fringe ideology.
Show threadjudgeholden [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
Show threadThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]Sep 14, 2023
Our “fringe ideology” has the largest political party on the planet.
Show threadpingvenoSep 14, 2023
Only because other parties are banned. Can’t stand real competition.
Show threadThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]Sep 14, 2023
There are little 8 parties represented in the legislature
Show threadpingvenoSep 14, 2023
The other ones are a joke. The largest has 58 out of 2980 seats.
Show threadThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]Sep 14, 2023
Democracy is when no political party dominates, and the more power doesn’t consolidate around a very justifiably popular party the more democratic it is.
Show threadShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]Sep 14, 2023
There are eight politcal parties in the PRC
Show threadpingvenoSep 14, 2023
Oh, sorry. Every party that is not subservient to the CPC is banned. And those that are left are tiny with no real influence.
Show threadShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]Sep 14, 2023

During the cold war, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime’s atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn’t go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them. If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum.

Show threadRom [he/him]Sep 12, 2023
We had a president literally try to overturn an election in his favor and the Senate still failed to convict him. 43 Republicans had their lives put in danger by his actions but still voted him not guilty. If that’s not enough to remove a president from office then what makes you think this would?
Show threadspaceghotiSep 13, 2023
Because they voted that way for tribal reasons. They refused to hold one of their own accountable. Democrats have before and will again. We don’t cover for someone’s crimes just because they belong to the right party.
Show threadRom [he/him]Sep 13, 2023

We don’t cover for someone’s crimes just because they belong to the right party.

lmao remind me again the last time a president was tried for war crimes?

Show threadspaceghotiSep 13, 2023

www.google.com/search?q=obama+hospital+bombing&am…

Just in case your fingers were broken.

Bevor Sie zur Google Suche weitergehen

Show threadbtbt [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
Oh shit, a 6000 dollar payout? That’ll surely make up for their innocent relatives being blown up for no reason!
Show threadspaceghotiSep 13, 2023
Way to miss the point about Obama acknowledging the incident and no one finding any evidence that he deliberately ordered the hospital to be bombed. War crimes are deliberate. Better if we’re not bombing anyone at all, but his actions didn’t rise to the level of criminality which is why even Republicans didn’t try to get him on that. It’s not like they weren’t looking for an excuse to impeach him and put him on trial. They tried really hard with Benghazi, and still couldn’t manage it.
Show threadAdkml [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
So if somebody kicks your door in and shoots you in the head then gives your family $50 that’s all good as long as the murderer didn’t have a handwritten note saying “I know this is an extra judicial killing and don’t care” in his jacket?
Show threadboboblaw [he/him, they/them]Sep 13, 2023
Don’t forget they also have to say the magic words: “I have been held accountable.”
Show threadBurgerPunk [he/him, comrade/them]Sep 12, 2023

Actually political parties can and should enforce political discipline on their members, and there should be reprisals for going against the party and its leadership.

But the reality is, letting Manchin trash this legislation is probably more the plan than an opposition to it

Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

Ffs…HOW do you enforce discipline?? All these people replying to me say the same thing, but you all fail to give examples.

What, you’re going to torture him? Slap him? You think that will change his mind? Biden has nothing against him. If he tries anything, Manchin can simply become a Republican or independent and run on how he “blocked Bowen’s agenda” and lose the Democrats a seat

Show threadBurgerPunk [he/him, comrade/them]Sep 12, 2023

If they can’t control him then they’ve already functionally lost a seat (unless of course, they actually like having him block legislation they don’t actually want to pass)

Parties exert control on their members in this country, they always have, and generally not through violence or torture. Usually its through taking away party support from them and their personal agenda. It could be attacking political pork to West Virginia, close military or other government facilities there, and support challengers/kick him out of the party so he can’t run on their ticket. It could possibly include more strong-arm tactics, not violence, not even anything necessarily illegal, that’s speculative but possible.

What you’re asking people to explain, is something that is the norm. You’re the one actually making an outrageous claim of how do we expect a political party to control and discipline its members. And pretending that the Democratic Party or the President just have no power in this situation is ludicrous

Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023

If they can’t control him then they’ve already functionally lost a seat (unless of course, they actually like having him block legislation they don’t actually want to pass)

Except he still votes for federal judges and for the infrastructure bill. So the seat is definetly not being used how we’d like, but it’s not lost or we wouldn’t even have those.

Parties exert control on their members in this country, they always have, and generally not through violence or torture. Usually its through taking away party support from them and their personal agenda. It could be attacking political pork to West Virginia, close military or other government facilities there, and support challengers/kick him out of the party so he can’t run on their ticket. It could possibly include more strong-arm tactics, not violence, not even anything necessarily illegal, that’s speculative but possible.

Fair enough! You’re literally the first and only person who gave me a detailed and actual example of what could be done. My only comment is that sadly Manchin knows the amount of leverage he has, so until he’s not needed, he can always just block anything ever further. I hate too that we have a democracy that can be taken over by two greedy assholes and that places so much importance on judges, but until something is done to change that, we can only plan accordingly.

What you’re asking people to explain, is something that is the norm. You’re the one actually making an outrageous claim of how do we expect a political party to control and discipline its members? And pretending that the Democratic Party or the President just have no power in this situation is ludicrous

If you read through the replies I’ve received, you’ll quickly realize it’s not that outrageous since most were just saying “you use violence” and failed to give answers. Please, don’t put words I didn’t say in my mouth. I’ve never said the president or the party have no power. The do have it. But it’s undeniable that Manchin (and Sinema) for some twisted, sick fate they have it too. And at the moment we have a slighty centre, centre right president who’s not willing to go above and beyond to push back because he prefers getting by with what he has. Do I like it? Fuck. No. Do I see any other alternative in the current political climate until next elections? Sadly no.

Show threadBurgerPunk [he/him, comrade/them]Sep 12, 2023

I don’t think elections hold a lot of promise of fixing anything. I think Manchin and Sinema are exactly where their party wants them. I don’t think that this legislation failing is something that the Biden Admin or the DNC are against.

I think they’re happy about it, and thats why there’s no discipline exerted on either of them. That’s what i meant by you making an extraordinary claim about party discipline. Theres no party discilple or reprisals because the party doesn’t care about this legislation. They like having these scapegoats. The Democratic Party leadership does not share your view, that these people shouldn’t be there. That’s why elections in this system will not fix it

Show threadh3doublehockeysticks [she/her]Sep 12, 2023
Guy dude pal it was already pointed out to you that he was the cause/excuse for the bill being watered down AND that the bil did not need his vote. Like it wasn’t even close to needing his vote. It passed the senate with double digit votes.
Show threadjack [he/him, comrade/them]Sep 13, 2023

a democracy that can be taken over by two greedy assholes

That ain’t a democracy chief

Show threadAnonTwoSep 12, 2023
I think they're supposed to argue against their democratic/republican nominations in their states or something for future elections, but I honestly could be wrong because It's not something I often think about. Just that there has to be some sort of repercussion for consistently voting against your party....
Show threadowlinsightSep 12, 2023
And I honestly get that reaction of “something should be done”. And I too wish we had a more left wing president who didn’t see these issues as not worth fighting for. But at the moment, we don’t. He’s not willing to upset the 2 people who allow him to say to the majority of voters that at least he still passed something
Show threadSpookyGenderCommunist [they/them, she/her]Sep 12, 2023

I’m gonna put on my political scientist hat, and point out that almost every political party on this planet enforces internal discipline in a multitilude of ways, a handful of which have been mentioned in this discussion thread already.

The idea that parties are these big tents where you can’t possibly enforce any kind of internal discipline is both a uniquely America-brained take, and also not entirely true.

Like, there are literally people called “Party Whips” who’s job it is to pressure the party members vote along party lines.

Show threadh3doublehockeysticks [she/her]Sep 12, 2023

but you all fail to give examples.

EVERYONE HAS GIVEN YOU EXAMPLES. EVERYONE LITERALLY EVERYONE YOU TALK TO GIVES YOU EXAMPLES. WHAT ARE YOU. WHY ARE YOU THIS WAY?

Show threadElHexo [comrade/them]Sep 12, 2023
There’s literally positions in Congress for party members called a whip for enforcing party discipline
Show threadRam_The_Manparts [he/him]Sep 13, 2023

Manchin can simply become a Republican or independent and run on how he “blocked Bowen’s agenda” and lose the Democrats a seat

What difference would that make when the guy is already voting like a republican?

Show threadsilent_water [she/her]Sep 13, 2023

Manchin can simply become a Republican

what would change?

Show threadAdkml [he/him]Sep 13, 2023
He’d be using republican money for re-election instead of taking money from potential progressive politicians before getting elected and voting against the dems entire platform.