LiteralGrillSep 4, 2023

I see people on my timeline now and then grumpy that people are trying to encourage others to use alt-text, sometimes saying people are "too pushy" or they "deserve to be able to post in peace."

So folks actively work together for once to advocate for accessibility for disabled people and your primary complaint is that it's annoying so stop? I hope folks wake up and realize how fucked up that is.

ESPECIALLY when tons of people refuse to wear masks leaving us stuck in our homes where social media is a godsend for having community.

I'd have loved to see these folks' reactions when people in wheelchairs were using sledge hammers to put in curb cuts back in the day. Maybe we gotta bring that kind of energy back. #Disablity #DisabilityJustice

Show threadKat the LeopardessSep 4, 2023

@literalgrill I have also seen people make the argument that the pressing for alt tags is what makes Mastodon full of elitist assholes that wanna be right all the time. (and hence why Bluesky is more attractive)

They argue that asking for alt tags is "tone policing"

Show threadBee O'Problem Sep 4, 2023

@Catwoman69y2k @literalgrill IMO it's how the people do it.

Best folks are the ones who reply with alt text added.

Next are the ones who politely encourage use of alt text and point out how it's done.

The ones I suspect get the "mastodon elitist" label are the ones that are either aggressively demanding, condescending or making harsh accusations of deliberate malicious ableism over missing alt text.

Show threadLiteralGrillSep 4, 2023

@beeoproblem @Catwoman69y2k Let's legit ask a question, why doesn't Mastodon simply require all posts have alt-text? It'd solve the whole problem!

The reality is folks are angry a the implicit implication that people needing "convenience" to grow the platform is more important than having disabled voices on the platform. Which is where the anger and aggression part comes from.

People wouldn't "forget" if they couldn't forget. Older websites required alt-text while uploading pictures, I remember the days of those forums when the net loaded slowly and it was a curb cut effect that helped everyone.

We should go back to that! If everyone has to use alt-text, we've solved this whole problem.

Edit: I've gotten some responses explaining that programming this might actually not be possible and of course, there are folks who can't create alt-text that need to be thought of too. But even letting other users submit alt-text for photos for users to approve would be a cool start!

Show threadKat the LeopardessSep 4, 2023

@literalgrill @beeoproblem I do recall some posts discussing use cases where people might not (be able) to use alt tags (but it's not a matter of ill or exclusionary intent) . I can't pull up these toots just now

if all Fedi apps forced an alt tag to be applied before it would post... would that be going too far by forcing it?

Show threadLiteralGrillSep 4, 2023

@Catwoman69y2k @beeoproblem Yeah, I've seen folks saying that today too, it does sadly create another issue.

I've also been told that programming required alt-text due to the federated nature of Mastodon actually causes issues too from the boring programming side of things.

Maybe we can find a way to have a feature so folks can suggest alt-text for users?

Show threadKat the Leopardess

@literalgrill @beeoproblem I believe that has been discussed as well. Trying to find the post about it.

It was basically a method similar to the "unroll" trigger word that people did on Twitter.

Sep 4, 2023 at 3:42pmWeb
Show threadYingtaiSep 4, 2023

@Catwoman69y2k @literalgrill @beeoproblem

I think this is the thread you were looking for, where @bright_helpings (who is blind) talked about how he challenged hardline stances on alt text. Also ways to request help in writing image descriptions (a preferred term because they don't have to be in the alt text). https://mspsocial.net/@bright_helpings/108219848954173037

Old Erik 👿 (@[email protected])

I'm seeing a lot of proclamations that there should be no exceptions to describing your images or that there's no reason to interact with any that aren't described. I know these mean well, but they are themselves ableist. Disabled people know that access needs can clash. I benefit from described images, but I know some people struggle to write them because of their own disabilities. And that's okay! The culture of image descriptions is great here but it should never be absolutist.

MSP Social.net