Shoonya
BodhipaksaReposting this with alt text. In fact the entire description is in the alt text.
Please use alt text. Otherwise you're issuing a mighty "fuck you" to every visually impaired person on Mastodon.
Bunninsula@bodhipaksa Alt text?
@Bunninsula On Mastodon it's also known as an "image description." It's text describing an image so that people who are visually impaired can understand what the image is. When visually impaired people use Mastodon, their computers read the text out to them. Usually it's not visible until you tap on the image or hover your mouse over it.
You have the opportunity to add this text when you add an image to a post.
There are a lot of blind Mastodon users and they really appreciate alt text.
@bodhipaksa Thanks for the information! I now have a good reason to add descriptions. ^^
Ed Yother 
โ@Bunninsula @bodhipaksa I enjoy adding additional info to the alt text. A sort of bonus for the people who use it.
Here's the artist's description of the installation. http://www.michaelrakowitz.com/plot-proposition-i
Dr. Brad Rosenheim has moved!@bodhipaksa Brilliant. Excellent description too.
@Brad_Rosenheim Thank you. I like a good alt text description.
Marcel Gitlab ๐๐ค๐๐ค@bodhipaksa @Brad_Rosenheim I think it would be better by saying the tent is in the shape of a car.
@MarcBrillault @Brad_Rosenheim Yes indeed! I'd meant to do that and have now edited the alt text. Thanks!
Dr. Young-Leslie ๐จ๐ฆ@bodhipaksa @MarcBrillault @Brad_Rosenheim
I think a good image description is an art! Doing it exposes how much is implicit in an image.
I'm still new to it, but I've found myself adopting a format similar to the starting scene description in a play, eg:
"daytime; setting; characters (number, sex, age, ethnicity); how they're dressed (colours, styles) what they're doing; facing/looking away from camera; mood; background"
Do you have a syntax/system for image descriptions?
#AltText #Images
@HyL @bodhipaksa @Brad_Rosenheim I usually skip all that's irrelevant to the understanding of the message. For instance, if the clothes of the protagonists have no significant meaning, I won't describe them. I try to be as concise at possible while explaining enough for the visually impaired to understand.
@MarcBrillault @HyL @Brad_Rosenheim I tend to err on the side of abundance as far as alt text is concerned. Many visually impaired people can see some colors and shapes, so describing the color of clothing can help them appreciate what it is they're seeing.
Exactly. And many blind people were sighted at one time. They remember colours & shapes. If an image is used, I like them to get the experience that image is there for.
mirth@bodhipaksa I hear the sentiment but as far as I know Mastodon doesn't display the alt text.
@mirth If you mean the website, it does; just hover over the image. If you mean the app, virtually any alternative to the official app has better features, including the ability to see alt text.
@bodhipaksa I'm using the official web app on a phone, I don't think I've ever seen alt text. I guess not a priority for them?
joep schuurkes@mirth With web app, do you mean you're using your phone's browser? I think in that case the browser has to support it.
I'm on Android and can see the alt text by first clicking on the image and then hold-clicking it. Works both in Firefox and Chrome.
It's a shame though that neither browser displays an "alt"-label on the image like the Android Mastodon apps do.
@joeposaurus Yes. Agreed, and even if clients have a way to display alt text with a few taps or other interactions that's a lot of friction to put in front of it. I always assumed the alt text was only to be presented if the image was unavailable or unsuitable (like for a screen reader) but that may not be a widely shared view.
Negative12DollarBill@mirth @bodhipaksa
Even if you, a person with no visual disabilities, can't see it and can't figure out how to get your chosen mastodon interface to show it, that's not the point.
Even if you, a person with no visual disabilities, can't see it and can't figure out how to get your chosen mastodon interface to show it, that's not the point.
@mirth That's a very good reason to find an alternative app.
@bodhipaksa @mirth yup. I use Tusky, and the alt text / image description / caption appears when you tap the image.
Rupert Reynolds@mirth @bodhipaksa On Android, the app "Tusky" by author "Team Tusky" does the trick.
Good web browsers tend to show it with a hover, right click or whatever.
Perhaps more importantly, people with reduced eyesight can choose software that uses the alt-text in a way that works for them.
hรถmma
deewani@bodhipaksa Looks like my Mini Cooper car cover.
Zillion@bodhipaksa Are these for sale somewhere? We need a fundraiser to donate them. I suppose if they became too common it might stop working, but still โฆ.
Not a Spring OnionWhile the tent is certainly practical from a portability perspective...
Depening on your legislation (and/or practical experience), there are a number of alternatives:
Put a couch on a parking spot. Maybe with some decoration.
Only vehicles are allowed? Vehicles are things with wheels? No problem, but wheels on your couch.
Park your bicycle. The couch is only standing on the side, since you are not sure how to "load it properly" onto your bicycle.
Rent/build a small trailer. It's like a tent on wheels.
Raccoon ๐ณ๏ธโ๐ 
@bodhipaksa
This is a good reminder of how many Americans have lived out of a car in the past 20 years...
This is a good reminder of how many Americans have lived out of a car in the past 20 years...
gavinisdie 
@bodhipaksa you have mobile homes, mobile homes, and MOBILE homes
Lukas Burgstaller@bodhipaksa Imho the fact that the tent looks like a car would be important information in the alt text too.
Other than that ๐
@voidstern Ha! Good catch. That's what I'd intended to say in the first place. The alt text has now been edited accordingly.
dok@bodhipaksa I recently saw the same concept when I discovered Timo Noko's blog https://timonoko.github.io/
photos of the tentcar can be seen here https://imgur.com/a/4DMGB
photos of the tentcar can be seen here https://imgur.com/a/4DMGB
MettEagle
BronMason For Kamala 2024I love this idea! Housing people while taking space away from carbon pollutersโ WIN-WIN!!!
David Kirlew-Morris@bodhipaksa Sorry, but this is selfish. It's not thinking of others who are looking for a space to park in a crowded city. That person maybe wanting to do a big food shop, get to an interview or something else important.
There are other public spaces for art that aren't valuable parking spaces
@davidkirlewmorris I think this is the kind of thinking the installation wants us to question. Any car that's parked is taking space away not just from other drivers, but from pedestrians, cyclists, public transport, and the potential to have gardens or trees. So by the logic you've used, any driver could be described as selfish.
Also, this installation was hosted by a museum, so it's quite likely it was in a space outside their building, although I don't know for sure.
Galen@bodhipaksa huh, it turns out we don't have a housing problem, we've just decided to give that space to cars....
Zed Not Zee โ
@bodhipaksa just goes to show you how much space cars take up
Colin ๐ด๓ ง๓ ข๓ ณ๓ ฃ๓ ด๓ ฟ๐ณ๐ฟ@bodhipaksa It would be easier if Android users, like myself,could see our alt text efforts.
@ColinW Most Android apps will let you see the alt text. Often you have to tap on the image to make it the focus first.
Really, any app really ought to allow you to see it, but a few don't. That's a bit of a red flag, and a good reason to look for a better app.
etym dubI recommend @apps
shows alt-text, reminds you to add it, &... translates it when you need that too ๐
Kevin Karhan 
@bodhipaksa Sadly that would still be accounted as "illegal camping" or "loitering" as only "road-legal vehicles" are allowed to "park"...
Needless to say I've seen people taking a Piaggio Ape 50 tricycle scooter with boxtruck back and literally turned the back into a camper...
@kkarhan This was an art installation done in collaboration with a major museum (actually more than one โ it took place in different countries). I think we can assume they went through the proper channels.
@bodhipaksa yeah, and I know they wanted to criticize the fact that we allocate space for cars if not made it mandatory but not housing, which is an actual human right...
GreenSkyOverMe (Monika)@bodhipaksa As alt text is not always fully accessible to people who do not use screen readers please put descriptions for sighted users in the body of the message, not in the alt text. This applies to the artist, location and the commentary in the last sentence.
- Mobile web users often do not know how to display it. (Tap, then long-press.)
- For gifs/videos itโs not possible. (Not applicable here.)
- Long text is cut off. (N/a here.)
- Font size may be too small, cannot be enlarged.
@GreenSkyOverMe "Mobile web users often do not know how to display it."
I'm happy to accommodate people with disabilities, but ignorance does not qualify as a disability.
@bodhipaksa It is not intuitive that, in contrast to elsewhere, on Mastodon one has to tap to pop it out and then long-press.
Even that one can display it with long-press on other websites is not a well-known fact, and it doesnโt work for images that link somewhere, animated gifs and videos.
As alt text is not meant to convey additional information for sighted users there is no reason to expect users to have learned this.
So donโt mis-use alt text for this.
@bodhipaksa Accommodating different levels of technical knowledge is also important and itโs rude to cast it away as "ignorance".
@bodhipaksa There are also two groups of disabled people who are affected by this:
- Sighted computer users who navigate with the keyboard because their hands do not allow mouse usage (the keyboard may be triggered by a stick in the mouth, head or eye movements or the remaining hand use). As they cannot "hover" the mouse-over text is never shown to them.
- Partially sighted users may be able to see or easily enlarge the image, but not the font size of the alt text.
- Sighted computer users who navigate with the keyboard because their hands do not allow mouse usage (the keyboard may be triggered by a stick in the mouth, head or eye movements or the remaining hand use). As they cannot "hover" the mouse-over text is never shown to them.
- Partially sighted users may be able to see or easily enlarge the image, but not the font size of the alt text.
Steffi@bodhipaksa @GreenSkyOverMe Putting the whole text in the alt might feel like it is even more inclusive.
But the alt text is really only meant to describe the picture. For someone who doesn't use a screen reader but relies on magnification, this makes it very inacessible. Also people with screen reader might opt to only read the posts, thus missing the whole context.
If we use acessibility features, we *have* to use them as intended. Only then can the reciever make the most use of it.
@stefanie @GreenSkyOverMe This is the one and only time I've put all the text in the alt text. I didn't do it because it was "more inclusive," but just because I could. It's interesting to learn that people who rely on magnification can't access the alt text. Why is that the case? Does the alt text not magnify?
@bodhipaksa @GreenSkyOverMe Just try it. If you just use Ctrl+Scroll wheel to zoom in, it zooms in the text and pictures, but not the alt text.
@stefanie @GreenSkyOverMe I don't have a mouse with a scroll wheel, but I'll take your word for it.
Claire Barnes@GreenSkyOverMe I didnโt know that, thank you! This works on iPad for the images in this post, but the alt-text for some other posts is more severely truncated & it does not seem to work with Firefox on Android. I agree, have not previously seen alt-text on either of these devices, and I often donโt see the images either due to a slow internet connection.
Thanks @bodhipaksa for interesting photos, & the commentary now seen thanks to GreenSky.
Thanks @bodhipaksa for interesting photos, & the commentary now seen thanks to GreenSky.
PLASTIC = DEATH@bodhipaksa Great for the homeless
James Henstridge@bodhipaksa Now you've got a different type of accessibility problem: information is conveyed in the alt text that is not apparent from the images themselves.
If you want to convey information that a sighted reader wouldn't get from the image alone (here, the name of the artist, location, and commentary), that would go better in the post.