Discovery here IS bad, and — I hate to say it — the solution to that is an (entirely optional) algorithm that surfaces potential follows and compelling content right out of the gate.

Algorithms aren’t inherently evil. Hell, “show posts in reverse chronological order” is in itself an algorithm.

What matters are 1) choice and 2) the intention with which the algorithm was designed.

#Mastodon https://mastodon.social/@mimsical/110865836818850808

I was able to bootstrap myself here relatively easily because I was both part of the deluge of Twitter users in November of 2022 as well as highly-motivated to make it work because I hated what Twitter was becoming and inherently grokked the benefit of federation.

That’s not going to be the common case.

If Mastodon is to expand far beyond low-hanging fruit like me it absolutely needs to meet users halfway.

@jeff would it not be enough to ask new people "type in a few hashtags you're interested in or select from this well-curated list of popular hashtags" and then auto-follow these hashtags for them?

Boom, their timeline gets filled out immediately with stuff they're interested in, no need to have any kind of "recommendation algorithm" involved.

Sidenote: this is less of a problem on smaller instances with lively and relevant local timelines, I feel.

@rysiek @jeff No. Its still only sortable by chronology, I dont get to see post from people I follow from other timezones, and there is no real way for me to find people posts or news local to me. Making multiple algorithms available, making them open to analysis, and making them opt in/out sounds just fine to me.

@SarraceniaWilds

> I dont get to see post from people I follow from other timezones

I get such posts boosted into my timeline all the time.

> there is no real way for me to find people posts or news local to me

That's a fair point.

> Making multiple algorithms available, making them open to analysis, and making them opt in/out sounds just fine to me.

I am worried about the power dynamics of this. Such tools tend towards "winner takes all" situations, I feel.

@jeff

@SarraceniaWilds : "there is no real way for me to find people posts or news local to me"

@rysiek : "That's a fair point."

The solution is: hashtags of geographical names.
@jeff

@xdej @SarraceniaWilds @rysiek @jeff Ugh. Freeform geotagging is always an awful solution. If I'm tagging local posts #Ypsilanti, but someone more casual is tagging posts #Ypsi, and someone more formal is tagging posts #YpsilantiMI, we end up with three groups of people not talking to each other, or people filling the footer of every post with multiple similar tags.

@bauser @xdej @SarraceniaWilds @rysiek It’s a general problem with hashtags, really. Though geography presents some unique challenges.

There are other examples. One I came across with a couple months ago was using hashtags to keep up with news out of Apple’s developer’s conference.

We had people using some combination #WWDC, #WWDC23, and #WWDC2023. To get everyone talking together you had to pollute your post with ALL of those tags. It was a mess.

@jeff @bauser @xdej @rysiek Consider also the case of government agencies creating own instances to host accounts to make announcements to locals. No way to find out that this has happened, no way to prioritize the post, no way for the agency to get around this. Use a bot to reboost every hour so the followers lucky enough to find it actually see it? Clunky and inelegant, barely useable, perfect for government implementation and open source collaborative project, drinks all around, ship it.