Timon 🏳️🌈 🐻
PulkoMandyI have just realized a very annoying thing: the "Austr-" in "Austria" means East, from German Öster. The "Austr-" in "Australia", on the other hand, means South, from Latin Australis.
Thank you, have a nice day.
arcepi@pulkomandy I always wondered... East of what?
@arcepi apparently there is a Wikipedia page entirely dedicated to it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Austria
If I understand well, it originally was the eastern border of whatever stood at its West at the time.
Which also reveals: the Romans called it Noricum, 'according to Heer, no- or nor- meant "east" or "easterns"' (and not North, of course)
So it looks they have just been trying to confuse people about cardinal points for 2500 years...
"This has led to much confusion [citation needed]"
Deb4+ aka Deborah DT 🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️English enjoys messing with our heads
Newro@pulkomandy @arcepi "This has led to much confusion [citation needed]"
Did it?
The only people I've ever seen confused about it were American geography bloggers.
We all learn about the Romans in primary school and it never confused anybody here. They went north until the river Danube, which was a natural border and easy to defend. Where my home town of Linz (back then Lentia) was founded in 799AD.
Same way a 1000 years ago the Danube flowing to the east was used for trade.
@pulkomandy @arcepi so the Latin speaking people were in the "South" of the danube. The Germanic speaking people were in the west. When they colonised the area they called it "Ostarrichi" (996AD), simply empire to the east. Because they didn't speak Latin anymore.
If you think that is confusing read up about the name Deutschland aka Germany aka Allemagne
David@arcepi @pulkomandy Österreich means the Eastern Country/Kingdom. East of the German-speaking countries.
East the Danube. Which confuses a lot am American geography nerds still to this day. As Upperaustria is northwest of Loweraustria as the name follows the river Danube down stream. Has nothing to do with the position on a map.
Çağatay Yiğit Şahin@pulkomandy It seems like these two intermediary roots may be sharing a common Proto-Indo-European root:
https://www.etymonline.com/word/austral
https://www.etymonline.com/word/austral
Hugh Young-Bish
Tim Bray@pulkomandy Wouldn't be surprised if there's a common root in Proto-Indo-European
@timbray yes, it seems Latin was confused about where the East is for a variety of hypothetical reasons: https://mastodon.social/@cagatayy/110865078639729196
Nik@pulkomandy @timbray https://youtu.be/B14Gtm2Z_70
My apologies for the hours you're about to lose going through their video back catalogue...
Why is North up?
Renée@nikclayton my fav is still The West Wing "the maps are wrong" but this is also great 😂
Eta: the embed (mind the commercial fade break)
Gall--Peters Projection
Pidj@nikclayton love the map men so much!
Luo Binghe baculum truther@pulkomandy @timbray thanks, I hate it
Rihards Olups@timbray @pulkomandy In Latvian (considered to be an “archived” language with a lot of old structures) east is “austrumi”, to rise is “aust”.
No clue what exactly to make of it in this context :)
No clue what exactly to make of it in this context :)
rag. Gustavino BevilacquaAnd Austrasia had nothing to do with Austria, Australia and Asia:
(((Klefstadmyr)))@GustavinoBevilacqua @pulkomandy Stop this! Please! My head is gonna explode!
Ángela Stella MatutinaYep, our defunct "Austral" currency had nothing whatsoever to do with Austria.
Unrelatedly: we liked the name.
Landurologe 🔬🚲@pulkomandy so better call it "Mozart-Austria" and "Kangaroo-Australia", Just to make Sure.
Sylvia Wenmackers 🦉🍀@pulkomandy In the Belgian capital, there are three main train stations, one of which is called Bruxelles-Midi and it's not the middle one (which is called Bruxelles-Central), but South. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brussels-South_railway_station
Since this "Nord-South" connection is actually oriented Nord-East to South-West on the map, it is also used to connect East to West. I grew up in the East, so for me, Midi was the last station, meaning South, but actually gate to the West parts of Belgium. 🙃
n3wjack@SylviaFysica @pulkomandy I always find the Midi confusing, as I think it's the central one. 😁
meduz'@SylviaFysica @pulkomandy They took the “midi” as in French, meaning “the moment of the day when the sun is the highest”, which in Europe means the South. :p
It’s just that the Belgian railway company never use Brussels South to name it, even in English (they use Bruxelles Midi/Brussels Zuid), although South is apparently the official name in English.
I guess they don’t want people to mix it up with the Brussels-South airport (which is in Charleroi, 50 km South, and where there’s no train).
@SylviaFysica @pulkomandy Talking about Charleroi, they recently renamed the main train station from Charleroi-Sud to Charleroi-Central, despite the fact that the station is at the South of the city center. 🙃 Thou it’s no big deal since the city center is small (you go through it in a 20 min. walk), buuuuut there’s also a Charleroi-Ouest station (Charleroi-West) that is accordingly located West, and only deserved by 1 line if I’m correct.
@SylviaFysica @pulkomandy In Trondheim, Norway, two parallel streets are called Southern (Søndre) and Northern (Nordre) Street. And as you guessed, they both are aligned North-South. I.e., none of them are more North OR South than the other. Nobody knows why.
Kevin@pulkomandy honestly the öster would make more sense meaning South considering its position in German speaking countries.
MizzBassie@pulkomandy @boisdevache
That’s how it goes with language. Doesn’t always have to make sense in the most straightforward way.
That’s how it goes with language. Doesn’t always have to make sense in the most straightforward way.
essjax
dyke dragon 💜@pulkomandy adding more detail for whoever might be interested:
Dave Irving@pulkomandy
It's unfortunate that we englished Österreich to Austria.
It's unfortunate that we englished Österreich to Austria.
Edelruth, PBS Passport HolderI did not know (either 🤔) of those, and I am delighted that now I do!
Gurre Vildskägg@pulkomandy That's nothing.
September means the seventh month
October means the eighth month
November means the ninth month
December means the tenth month
Now you'll be confusing the names/numbers of the last third of the year, you're welcome.
Mori@pulkomandy Direction is a human construct, brought about by the collapse of quantum change by our indirect observations. East and West are the same thing! Go physics
Virginicus@mori @pulkomandy No, East and South are the same thing.
Simon dē Gulielmō 🐧@pulkomandy To frustrate you even more they come from the same Indo-European word meaning 'dawn'. Aurora comes from the same word, too. I think a group of people in ancient Italy had a poor sense of direction.
Joshu@simonwilliamson @pulkomandy Yeah, my best guess here is that the south wind was associated with the dawn?
aaron
Janne Moren@pulkomandy
"Austerity"?
"Austerity"?
gullevek ☢️ 🇯🇵
nev@pulkomandy thanks, i hate it
they both come from the same root though, which does mean dawn rather than south https://www.etymonline.com/word/austral
Quinn 🌸🏳️⚧️@pulkomandy @meulop They both come from the same origin ("dawn"). There's a hypothesis the reason it means "south" in Latin but "east" (the actual direction of dawn) in the Germanic languages is because of the southeast orientation of the Italian peninsula https://www.etymonline.com/word/austral
llewelly@pulkomandy twisted, isn't it?
Inken Paper 🇵🇸@pulkomandy the German name for Austria is "Österreich", literally "eastern kingdom".
@pulkomandy
But it is funny when they get confused, with kangaroos in Austria, and Australia as a land of snow-capped peaks.
But it is funny when they get confused, with kangaroos in Austria, and Australia as a land of snow-capped peaks.
Danneau@pulkomandy No, Thank You! This is a lovely detour from the mainstream of tonight's symposiumm.
FiXato@pulkomandy
looking up the etymology of "orientate" / "orientation" might also be interesting ;)
looking up the etymology of "orientate" / "orientation" might also be interesting ;)
Juan Rafael Fernández@pulkomandy
The problem with the meaning of auster is older than that https://www.etymonline.com/word/auster
The problem with the meaning of auster is older than that https://www.etymonline.com/word/auster
Lstn2urmama 🇨🇦@pulkomandy ...all goes different just like where moves in reverse as well down there...🤣