Nic MoeAug 5, 2023
Liam Proven

Get a sense of scale for computer storage...

Byte of data: a grain of rice
Kilobyte: a cup of rice
Megabyte: 8 bags of rice
Gigabyte: 3 container lorries
Terabyte: 2 container ships
Petabyte: covers Manhattan
Exabyte: covers the UK (3 times)
Zettabyte: fills the Pacific Ocean

Original source of the comparison, for the record: https://www.slideshare.net/dwellman/what-is-big-data-24401517

What is big data?

What is big data? - Download as a PDF or view online for free

Aug 5, 2023 at 1:20pmWeb
Show threadskategoat 🐐 πŸ‡΅πŸ‡ΈAug 5, 2023
@lproven for some reason I can only really "get" scales of around 10x. Bigger than that and my brain goes like "reeeeeeally big right"
Show threadSylvia Wenmackers πŸ¦‰πŸ€Aug 5, 2023
@lproven You could also illustrate it with "height of columns of rice on one field of a chess board". The chess board was made by Dutch science teacher Arjan van der Meij https://www.instructables.com/Chess-Board-Full-of-Rice-Exponential-Growth/ I just added the labels after seeing your post.
It shows that, if each byte had the size of a grain of rice, any amount of data beyond an exabyte corresponds to a column of rice that extends in space beyond the farthest removed human-made object (Voyager).
Chess Board With Rice: Exponential Growth

Chess Board With Rice: Exponential Growth: It was probably my math teacher who introduced us in High School to exponential growth by telling us the story of the invention of the game of chess. The king (emperor whatever) who had ordered a new game because of the fact that he was bored by the…

Instructables
Show threadVeronika CheplyginaAug 6, 2023
@SylviaFysica @lproven this is great, I've been looking for something like this for a lecture, but didn't know what exactly to search for
Show threadDebora Weber-WulffAug 6, 2023
@DrVeronikaCH @SylviaFysica @lproven
There is also a National Geographic film on YouTube called the 'Powers of Ten' that shows both directions: down to electrons, up to the Milky Way.
Show threadLiam ProvenAug 7, 2023

@SylviaFysica Maybe it's just me, but they don't help. It's like the post downthread about counting bibles.

Soon, you're just talking about piles of books -- or rice-grains -- to the moon.

Not real, not useful, can't be imagined by most people.

I can't picture vast very narrow columns of arbitrary height & I have no instinctive feel for the distance to the moon.

But a truck of rice versus the Pacific Ocean is something concrete I can grab hold of.

Show threadSylvia Wenmackers πŸ¦‰πŸ€Aug 7, 2023
@lproven Well, it's a reference to an old legend https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambalappuzha_Sree_Krishna_Swamy_Temple#Legend
and the moon example specifically gives a nice twist on another stock example of exponential growth: paper folding. To me, both the rice on the chess board and the paper folding to the moon are more about wonder than practical ways of thinking.
Ambalappuzha Sree Krishna Swamy Temple - Wikipedia

Show threadLiam ProvenAug 8, 2023
@SylviaFysica Yes, I know, I spotted that. πŸ™‚
Show threadPatrick Johanneson πŸš€ πŸ‡¨πŸ‡¦Sep 30, 2023
@lproven @SylviaFysica The one that always works for meβ€”at least if we're comparing "million" to "billion"β€”is that a million seconds is about 11Β½ days, and a billion seconds is a bit more than 32 years.
Show threadIchdochnichAug 5, 2023
@lproven
Better than banana for scale.
πŸ˜‰πŸ˜
Show threadJustin BuistAug 5, 2023

@Ichdochnich @lproven automatic follow on the banana comment because I assume you're a space nerd.

When's Tory Bruno going to jump to Mastodon?

Show threadIchdochnichAug 5, 2023
@justinbuist @lproven
I am just a little interested in topics around space, universe, big bang, et. al.
And good old Star Trek stuff.
Show threadStefan MΓΌnzAug 5, 2023
@lproven Hm, I've got some 8 container ships full of videos over here. But they're easy to navigate, only two small SSDs :-)
Show threadIan StuartAug 5, 2023
@lproven Sorry but I did some math on the byte to kilobyte comparison. 1000 grains of rice is nowhere near enough for a cup. I’m assuming we aren’t talking cooked rice (but even then…). Perhaps if instead a bit is a grain of rice then a kilobyte could be a cup of rice.
Show threadSean BlakeyAug 5, 2023

@IanStuart @lproven Given the other Britishisms, I suspect the original presenter isn't using "cup" as a well-defined unit of volumetric measure, but just as in "a small cup you might have in a kitchen".

But even so, that's a tiny cup.

Show threadJdeBPAug 5, 2023

@lproven @romaindurand @bytebro

Apparently (https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/q/34250/3698) one should be skeptical of this.

Is this measurement of data to grains of rice accurate?

This image purports that you can measure data in grains of rice - one byte being one grain of rice and one gigabyte then being three container lorries. Byte of data : one grain of rice Kilobyt...

Skeptics Stack Exchange
Show threadnytpu the wyvernAug 5, 2023
@JdeBP @lproven @romaindurand @bytebro There's no possible way that something can be not precisely accurate but still be a useful analogy for relative sizes
Show threadJionel Lospin Aug 6, 2023
@nytpu @JdeBP @lproven @bytebro actually there is πŸ€“β˜οΈ
Show threadLiam ProvenAug 7, 2023

@IanStuart Others did the same; note, this is not my set of comparisons.

https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/34250/is-this-measurement-of-data-to-grains-of-rice-accurate

Is this measurement of data to grains of rice accurate?

This image purports that you can measure data in grains of rice - one byte being one grain of rice and one gigabyte then being three container lorries. Byte of data : one grain of rice Kilobyt...

Skeptics Stack Exchange
Show threadBytebro πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡¦ πŸ‡¬πŸ‡±Aug 5, 2023
@lproven Great 'visualisation', thx!
Show threadBlueCoffeeAug 5, 2023
@lproven I have a problem. I have 128 container ships in my hallway....
Show threadTim Ward ⭐πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ”Ά #FBPEAug 5, 2023
@lproven Reminds me of bandwidth calculations we did in the 1980s. We reckoned that at that time the highest bandwidth channel available (with then current technology) between the US and Europe, albeit with a little latency, would be the QEII loaded full of compact disks.
Show threadGary ParkerAug 5, 2023

@TimWardCam @lproven β€œnever underestimate the bandwidth of a van full of DAT tapes” as we used to say when calculating requirements for off-site backups πŸ˜€

As you say, latency is the killer

Show threadLiam ProvenAug 6, 2023
@witewulf @TimWardCam I believe the original quotation is from Dr Andy Tanenbaum, the creator of Minix and the originator of the famous "Linux is obsolete" Usenet thread.
Show threadTim Ward ⭐πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ”Ά #FBPEAug 6, 2023
@lproven @witewulf Trying and failing to remember how I came across Andy Tanenbaum ...
Show threadLiam ProvenAug 7, 2023
@TimWardCam @witewulf Very smart American computer scientist who taught in the Netherlands most of his career. Wrote probably the most widely-deployed FOSS microkenrnel OS in the world, Minix. A forerunner of it was what inspired Linux and Linux was first implemented upon.
Show threadTim Ward ⭐πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ”Ά #FBPEAug 7, 2023
@lproven @witewulf Yeahbut it wasn't in connection with Minix that I came across him, and I can't remember what it was.
Show threadLiam ProvenAug 7, 2023

@TimWardCam @witewulf You need to give some kind of context!

I am aware of 3 claims to fame.

1. Minix.
2. The quotation:

"Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway."

– Computer Networks, 3rd ed., p. 83. (paraphrasing Dr. Warren Jackson, Director, University of Toronto Computing Services (UTCS) circa 1985)

3. His US election tracking website, https://electoral-vote.com/

Electoral-vote.com

Track the 2026 Senate election with a red/blue map of the US updated daily using the latest state polls.

Show threadTim Ward ⭐πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ”Ά #FBPEAug 7, 2023
@lproven @witewulf The only context is that I remember some chatter in the office about "Andy Christmas Tree" some time in the 1980s.
Show threadGary ParkerAug 7, 2023
@lproven @TimWardCam back when Linux was still a terminal emulator on steroids. Linus’s book, Just For Fun is worth a read for those early days.
Show threadGary ParkerAug 7, 2023
@lproven @TimWardCam I first came across it in a NetWorkshop presentation about 18 years ago on how the (then) new SuperJANET4 (maybe 5?) network allowed movement of astronomical telescope data faster than an actual van full of DAT tapes travelling from somewhere in Scotland to London. I think it was something to do with VLBI radio astronomy, iirc
Show threadFrottierAug 5, 2023
@lproven
640 cups of rice ought to be enough for anyone
Show threadJionel Lospin Aug 5, 2023
@lproven Ok but are we talking basmati rice or bomba rice ?
Show threadtextcontainerAug 5, 2023
@lproven Zettabyte = global sushi rice apokalypse βœ…πŸš
Show threadLindasueAug 5, 2023
@lproven
I am enlightened.
Show threadAndreas vom Zwenkauer SeeAug 5, 2023

@lproven Uppps...
I have 20 Containerships....

:-)

Show threadπŸ₯₯ Tucker Carlson's Nuts πŸ₯₯Aug 5, 2023
@lproven
πŸ₯₯ So are you saying, Iproven, that the 2 terabyte M2 drive I put into the #DesktopComputer I'm building will probably be enough for reading emails, surfing the internets, and shit-posting on the #Fediverse? πŸ₯₯
Show threadPeter Gordon πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡¦Aug 5, 2023
@lproven how deep when covering manhattan / the UK?
Show threadLiam ProvenAug 6, 2023
@Lumpbucket I think the only useful answer is "not very"... πŸ˜‰
Show threadAviva GaryAug 5, 2023
@lproven This is both helpful and making me hungry πŸ˜†
Show threadNico Aug 5, 2023
@lproven Wonder how much Meta and the xWanker has collected while I’ve used their platforms moons ago
Show threadKristFistAug 5, 2023
@lproven #perspective
Show threadCandidus DΓΌnschAug 5, 2023
@lproven 640 KB ~ one person can carry. Now the thought of Bill Gates becomes clear.
Show threadGerard Cunningham βœ’οΈAug 5, 2023
@lproven How much in a Gigaquad?
Show threadThe DoctorAug 5, 2023
@lproven "Covers Manhattan" and "covers the UK (3 times)" is a little ambiguous: To what depth of coverage? One layer of single rice grains? 1cm? 1 inch?
Show threadstarblueAug 5, 2023
@lproven Some time around 1970 that was actual size (say as core memory).
Show threadMurray GM - PaperpostsAug 5, 2023
@lproven i love these types of examples to help people understanding the scaling of things, very useful when talking about billionaires. Years ago I made an app to explore forbes rich list. Scaling wealth in relation to physical $100 bills is equally obscene.
Show threadBlauerπŸŽ©πŸ•ΉοΈ KlabauterAug 5, 2023
@lproven but why would you start with a byte for a grain? Should not a bit be a grain of rice?
Show threadπ”Έπ•Ÿπ•”π•šπ•–π•Ÿπ•₯ π•Šπ• π•¦π•Ÿπ••π•€ πŸ”‰Aug 5, 2023

@lproven
In our project final report a way back we thought 1 Library of Congress (non-digital) collection of c. 10 TB was a useful unit for measuring big data

http://www.phon.ox.ac.uk/files/apps/avtools/2006AHRC_Computers_Humanitie_2.htm#_Toc147986750

ICT Tools for Searching, Annotation and Analysis of Audiovisual Media

Show threadШуроAug 5, 2023
@lproven Last analysis of storage at work was showing entire fleet of container ships but their cargo used to be rice but was eaten once.
Show threadtoxtethogradyAug 5, 2023
@lproven The last exabyte tape was not an exabyte of storage. But it sure sounded impressive...
Show threadMostlyTatoAug 5, 2023
@lproven
I used to work with journalists. How does that translate into double decker buses?
Sorry, I'll get me coat 😜
(Seriously, a neat illustration of order of magnitude)
Show threadFlaming CheetoAug 5, 2023
@lproven sounds right
Having lorries of pornography makes me feel rich but I'd feel pervy if I had a tanker ship worth.
Show threadkaiserkiwi Aug 5, 2023
@lproven @tschapajew Sounds like new measurement units the USA wants to use.
Show threadcheetah_spottycatAug 5, 2023
@lproven What happened to the standard unit "libraries of congress" :)
Show threadIan WoottenAug 5, 2023
@lproven There's a great visualisation by the Corridor Crew if you haven't seen it yet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-K2yeQylCk
VFX Artist Reveals the TRUE Scale of Data!

YouTube
Show threadAlisonW β™ΏπŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆβ™ΎοΈAug 6, 2023
@lproven
Peta and Exa are area comparisons not volume (aka How deep?) Zetta fills to what level?
(Tera also open to interpretation; old or new Panamax? Suez? South China?
Show threaddont_panic_42 🌱 #TerranerAug 6, 2023
@lproven i builded 7 years ago 5 Manhattan Cover Servers;) 108 x 10tb Discs per Server (sever+jbod)
Show threadLaureAug 6, 2023
@lproven and DNA data storage?
Show threadBrian DearAug 6, 2023
@lproven Wait, no mention of Yottabyte?
Show threadearthtopusAug 6, 2023
@lproven English is too ambiguous for this; we need a language like Tagalog with its separate roots (bigas/kanin) for uncooked and cooked rice