Y'all… no. The assumed, unexamined rectitude of the intersection of hegemony, militarism, white supremacy, Western Christianity, in the historical underpinnings of "AI" are PRECISELY where most of our present day problems with "AI" come from:
"‘Judeo-Christian’ roots will ensure U.S. military AI is used ethically, general says"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/07/22/air-force-general-ai-judeochristian/
ALSO also, as others have mentioned, "Judeo-Christian" is not a neutral framing. It has a particular vector of deployment by specific groups who mean it in a very intentional way.
It flattens the concerns of diverse groups and it smuggles assumed Jewish support into areas where Jewish people might and probably do have wildly divergent views from the "Christians" in question.
End of the day, "Judeo-Christian" is almost always used as a euphemis phrase for "White Christian Dominionist Eschalotogy."
"Abrahamically-derived" is more descriptively accurate, but still, if you mean to talk productively, carefully, nuancedly about Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, it's probably better to just SAY, "Judaism, Christianity, and Islam."
@Wolven Ah yes, the concepts of *checks notes*
- Original Sin
- atonement as a personal internal issue between the sinner and Jesus
- stakes of infinite eternal punishment for moral failure
- a view of catastrophic apocalypse that sees it as not only acceptable in comparison to, but a /necessary prerequisite for/, eternal infinitely-good history-erasing utopia
A moral framework that has Never Directly Justified Any Atrocities Ever.
(And of course not any complete moral abandonments in the face of a single non-trivial societal decision.)
@alter_kaker @Wolven יאָ.
But I wanted that the components should be davka enumerated separately, because like, there IS a large internal diversity within Christianity, not every subdivision holds by every one on that list, and they all have different impacts in different combinations.
(I should also have listed
- belief in a Universal Truth/Morality that derives with unique perfection from a single source
- (bit of a hot take but) high valuation of spiritual transformation through emotionally-charged states, especially (a colder take now) in combination with the idea that Justice can be pain inflicted by a moral authority
- the valuation of Simplicity as a quality in ethical systems
)
And in addition to the variation within Christianity, those components also can sometimes come up in more cultural systems, some more distant or entirely separate from Christianity.
@alter_kaker @Wolven I also especially wanted to list them because, like, there are a lot of people (including some of my friends) who get a lot of legitimate personal, communal, and societal good out of their Christianity. And an uncountable amount more who, regardless, will continue on carrying Christianity for generations after them.
And many of those people are smart and passionate, and might be able (or at least might try) to leave their Christianity better than they found it. Maybe not, but if so specifics can help with that. Cultural systems are, over enough time, infinitely maleable and totally unfixed -- moral failings embedded deep at one iteration don't rule out fixing them through slow work.
(Not listed above, but like, can there be sometime in the future a Christianity that doesn't have the antisemitism of the character of The Pharisee/Judaizer embedded in its mythos at fundamental levels? Maybe! I hope so! I hope people are working on it, and I wish them best progress.)
@Wolven WAIT hold up I reacted just based on the context abd the title, I hadn't read the abstracts* and the table of contents and
(* aside: this is the first time I've encountered a "General Audience Abstract" and oh whoa everyone should do this)
hOLY FRICK THIS FREAKING RULES, LET'S GO LET'S FREAKING GO
(As an enthusiastic transhumanist, I look forward to the part about that of course, from the context I'm sure it'll give me a lot of great stuff to think about. And I also have Thoughts about "Computing Machinery And Intelligence" that are kinda off-the-path so I'm not expecting anything, but if you do hit on anything close to them I will fULLY FLIP.)
I've only just finished the forward to far but I am SO HYPED UP FOR THIS, LET'S GOOO
@Wolven "It hurts to think of the consequences of our actions so let's outsource our ethics department to machines"
This is phrenology.
@Wolven phrenology and scientific racism.
"I'm not cruel, I'm *rational*"
OMG,That quote is such a great illustration of just how much "dominance based" leadership HAS to bury itself in denial in order to keep going.
In fact, it's a trifecta of hubristic idiocy (please excuse the pun)
First off: Military true believers believe that "killing for peace" is necessary and just.
Second: True believers in retributive and patriarchally based religions believe -their- imaginary sky daddy (among the hundreds of "one true gods" out there) can provide a great moral compass.
And third: the general dude, ignores the REALITIES that AI not only exploits others, but is rife with huge problems that have real world consequences. In short, it relies on the assurances of AI techbros that they are trustworthy.
This is the level of DENIAL that is typical and necessary for dominance based leadership.
It is rapidly hurtling us toward extinction.
To survive: We will HAVE to become ungovernable by these idiots.
Hey, uh...
How about we just remove the term 'AI' from that and read the article as "'Judeo-Christian' roots will ensure US military is used ethically, general says".
Because that's where the US military is -- you can't look at West Point for more than 5 seconds without seeing a fundamentalist Christian standing, no matter how secular they laughably try to present themselves. And that's just one of many.
The whole basis of the military is rooted in that white-supremacist, hegemaniacal thing of which Western Christianity (in particular Baptist theology, but also Catholicism and most large sects) is a major part.
(And that's without getting into the whole part where Judaism is... not a central part of the theological leanings of the current paradigm.)
SO claiming that this part of it is pure because it's... centered in exactly the same theocratic excesses as the rest, where those excesses were one major cause of those abuses, just sort of kind of rings false.
@Wolven I tend to read that as: 'Judeo-Christian roots will ensure U.S. military AI remains used in accordance with Judeo-Christian ethics'.
Now, as to my estimation of the ethics of a person who would use the term 'Judeo-Christian' and believe they've played some kind of trump card... 🤢
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