Reddit mods are calling for an ‘affordable return’ for third-party apps

https://lemmy.world/post/664378

Reddit mods are calling for an ‘affordable return’ for third-party apps - Lemmy.world

Some of Reddit’s most popular communities have posted open letters to the company with a series of requests regarding many key issues at the heart of the recent protests on the platform. They want a response by June 29th.

I'm sure reddit will get right on that.
Let’s see them deliver on those promised moderation tools by end of month. If they can’t or won’t hit that milestone then I have little faith in them doing anything else. (Not that I have any faith in them any more, just, you know.)
Dude reddit isn't for you. It is okay. It is a business and they have a right to do whatever they want with their business, but IDK how many more ways they can say "You aren't important to me" before people stop saying "But I should be important to you!"
I don’t think that the people who provide the content and the people who moderate the content are wrong in thinking that they should be accorded some respect by a site that would be worthless without that content.
They're not wrong at all, but Reddit aren't going to change their mind and grant them their due respect. Like with Digg before it, the userbase will slowly migrate away if this keeps up.
Are you by any chance active on the WA discord?
I am indeed! And a lot of other places. Good to see you around the net.
This might be the first time I've seen someone I know from one place on the net and recognize them on another part of the net. Haha, small net!

It's fun, right? That's actually part of why I use the same name everywhere - I've had friends from a decade ago find me on Twitter and go "hey, did you play Runescape..?"

Makes the world feel a little less lonely when you find the faces and names you know!

What does the green tick next to your name mean?
It's way past this point now. Had reddit done this back when the shutdowns were first planned that would be one thing, but at this point they've demonstrated they can't be trusted, they don't care about their users or mods, and they're only interested in anything they think will increase the their profit margins for the IPO. If you aren't an investment firm they don't give a single shit about you past whatever damage you might do to their IPO plans.

I've already moved on from Reddit. I've deleted all of my content and unsubbed from about half of everything I cared about. My feed is completely pruned and even then only about a quarter of it is OC not posted by bots or click bait titles.

Plex just recently reopened it's sub for another vote to reopen or go restricted and the amount of support to stay open is sickening. Everyone left has become so dependant on the platform that they can't see leaving it, which is exactly what Reddit was hoping for with this.

¯_(ツ)_/¯

In the internal letter to their employees, spez said :

We absolutely must ship what we said we would.

The way I see it some promise has been done by spez and they definitely won't change their minds.

Third party apps are just dead that's just how it is.

Sounds like the kind of thing you’d say with the expectation, and I dare say, hope that it would be leaked.
"The Chinese that bought our company demand we track everything. They gave us until July first to close down 3rd party apps or they pull our funding and reddit is dead. " Probably what is going on.

im confused why people a. think spez had enough control to make these decisions. b. that killing the 3rd party apps wasnt the point.

almost zero notice, exorbitant costs for stripped access...

there was never going to be a compromise. 'they' want to wall their garden, and thats all she wrote

Because they don't want it to be true.

They just need time to go through the stages of mourning.

The RIF subreddit has been marking each post with its stage of grief since this began. Most were at acceptance last I checked.
These people invested so much time and effort into their communities, I understand why they are doing all this to keep them
Mod of /r/homeimprovement here. I don't know that "keep" is the right word but we have built an amazing community over the years. The API changes rubbed us all the wrong way (as we all mod from third-party apps) but what really clinched it was the utter abhorrent treatment of us after we shut down. We are still shut down, and reddit continues to actively threaten UNPAID VOLUNTEERS. The free content and moderation is literally the only thing keeping reddit relevant. We are actively going to force reddit to replace us or backtrack. It will likely be the former, but at least we have made them work for it. It's sad really...I love the community but I'm not going to continue to be free labor for a company that simply doesn't give a single shit about us or their users.

<3 yous. a lot of people now on lemmy are like "whatever I don't even remember reddit what was it even" because their minecraft memes or whatever have moved here or elsewhere. personally I found reddit the most remarkable for the non-tech subs. I am not worried about being unable to post to a linux forum because there are a bazillion of them. I do really mourn the DIY subs and other niches and hobbies. /r/homeimprovement was a great sub along with the constellation of related subs. I doubt /r/askanelectrician or /r/hardwoodfloors or /r/redneckengineering will be reestablished here even if a general /r/homeimprovement could find a footing. And they mutually feed into each other as communities. /r/homeimprovement wouldn't be able to thrive in the same way without the smaller subs and vice-versa. The large numbers of users who can easily discover new forums once they get into things in some way. That's how I got involved anyway so just extrapolating. :D

I noticed on the verge articles about reddit they have an open call for reddit mods to contact them. I would really love to see some coverage of non-tech subs and how this all is shaking out for them. I really do not think is is just OK to say "well, whatever" and just move on. I think people like you made reddit a fantastic place especially for the non-tech stuff. It is really really sad to see it all destroyed. I think at the very least the full carnage should be examined. Please pass tat thought to anyone else who might want to share. (There might be a better place to share than the verge; I don't follow tech news usually so I don't know it.)

But either way <3 yous. thank you for your service

Anybody trying to save reddit at this point is a fool.
Reddit wants to kill 3PAs. What I don't understand is why they're going through the whole act of pretending that the API is going subscription when they're making it prohibitively expensive and only giving them a month to put it in place. Why not just be honest and shut it down to third parties entirely?
I mean Spez was ghost editing comments at one point and is trying to blackmail the creator of Apollo. He’s not a person of good character.
Yep. Even if Spez rolled everything back, he destroyed all trust we had in Reddit. No going back from that...
For sure. Now we just have to wait and see how the community reacts July 1st.

I do not share this sentiment. Even if Reddit turned a full 180 and allowed third party apps to work exactly like before, I'm not coming back, and I'm not moderating any of my subreddits again (400k+ users).

Spreading misinformation, accusing Christian Selig of blackmail, banning mods, changing the rules on the fly, threatening mods via a new "code of conduct" account, violating GDPR/LGPD requests, restoring deleted comments and posts, subscribing users to subreddits without their consent to boost numbers.

I could go on and on. Reddit is a cesspool.

Honestly it's too late to turn back.

The apps have already announced they are shutting down. Any attempt now to reverse course and beg the app developers to not leave would be making them return with a Damocles sword constantly hanging over their head.

Reddit showed their hand already, and it's just all Wild Draw 4s. They are here to ruin everyone's day and they cannot be trusted.

undefined> Reddit is a cesspool.

I totally agree with you. In my case, I did not realize how much of a cesspool it was. I just got used to sifting through trash. I started using this platform and it has more interesting content. It has less content, but I think that's OK. Sometimes less is more. I don't feel like I'm scrolling endlessly through posts that are either lazy, superficial, or just not worth reading. Over here I've decided to avoid communities that look like they are migrations from subreddits because, low and behold, one of them had the same low-quality content with the same users posting the same kind of crap. For me, Lemmy is refreshing.

Bad idea, this looks like Stockholm syndrome to me.

Reddit has already shown they will screw everyone over, and no amount of blowback so far has gotten them to change course.

Leave (and optionally try to give Reddit as much hell as possible on the way out). That's the only answer now.

I don't think there is any redemption either, even if u/spez is removed. He's not the first bad head of the company, if anything the company has never had any good heads.

I made a script that changes all my old comments to gibberish, but I haven't used it yet. I can't decide if it's a good idea or not. I'm not saying that my old comments are extremely useful, but I wouldn't want to prevent people from reading or having context or any help I've given.

If you want to do that you might try doing it very slowly as minor edits. Like swap, add, or delete a couple of words in several posts per hour, and just let the script run for long periods, gradually degrading the usability of your comments over time.

I don't know if that would trigger whatever process Reddit is using to restore comments when users delete them, but there's got to be some detection algorithm they are using that could be avoided while also, eventually, nuking your content.

Thanks! Good suggestion, I will consider it.
Sometimes if you get it to go too fast subs will ban you thinking you've used a bot so don't let it go wayyy to fast also.. what if you just change them all to say random stuff which changes periodically but all of the also say fuck u/spez because my understanding is that comments containing u/spez are being auto deleted by bots at this point.. maybe that's the most effective way to make that content actually disappear without repopulation
The open letters showed me those people only cared about their position in the first place. Otherwise they wouldn't be bargaining, knowing it's useless, they'd leave like the rest of us did

those people only cared about their position

probably not. This ain't Star Trek, we don't know how to disintegrate a community, beam it down, and reintegrate it in the same shape in a different place.

the fall of Reddit implies the demise of many communities that called it home.
maybe it's fine in the long run, new communities form elsewhere and some of the people in the former end up in the latter, but it the short to mid term, it's traumatic for anybody that was emotionally invested.

I see those open letters as last ditch attempts to preserve a status-quo where maybe people can pretend a little longer that everything's okay.

in the end, everybody's gonna grieve this differently. I don't think it makes them bad people.

I don't think it makes them bad people, either, but this letter is so vague it sounds like begging.

Yeah, they just don't have a lot of leverage with Reddit in this struggle.

It's spez' sandbox, and it's our own fault for building sandcastles in it.

Some of them believed that their free labor was somehow irreplaceable or maybe just worth something, and that should mean they had some leverage, but Reddit's answer has been a resounding "lol no."

But that's the reason it's an open letter. Not to convince Reddit to stop being shitty, because they've been rather clear that they're committed to this, but to convince anyone else that Reddit is maybe not good, which might in turn impact whatever metrics they care about, and maybe finally provide some sliver of leverage.

I don't like their odds, but they're trying.

My answer was stopping modding, stopping posting and now a data takeout and GDPR deletion request (and a complaint because they will fail to honor it) on the way out. I would have done it years ago if there was a place to migrate to.
  • Stopping modding: Cool, scabs will take your place
  • GDPR: Reddit don't care. They'll refuse and then restore all your deleted content
  • Stop posting: look at twitter where a common refrain is "Look, my pipeline only has a bit of child porn and bestiality in it. It is mostly fine and the people I like still post there so I'll keep using it"
It's gonna take a GDPR request on legal letterhead...
Why do the mods care so much? Can anyone point me to an explainer of how can mods monetize their modding? I also don't understand why I see people here on Lemmy modding dozens of communities or looking to be mods of communities their posting history says nothing of.
Why do you think it needs to be able to be monetized for people to care about modding? I would imagine that most good-faith mods are passionate about the communities they're modding and the subjects they're about, and they care about them because they want to see them thrive and not be overrun by bad actors.
It's too late, and the damage has already been done, and not just because of the pricing. Reddit's outright manipulative and malicious treatment of devs has already driven most of them to shut down their work with the company. I certainly wouldn't want to work with a platform that treats me like that, profitable or not.
Couldn’t care less. Lemmy is already so much better than that cesspool. Reddit has been circling the drain for years.

Just stop moderating them already. Don't go dark. Reddit will revert. Don't make it NSFW to stop ad profits. Reddit will revert. Just. Stop. Moderating.

Let it fill up with nudes and hate speech and then sure, let's have Reddit forcibly remove you. They'll pull in a new team of mods but if they're just picked out of the blue, they're unlikely to find the time and energy necessary to do it well because this takes passion and many teams were assembled carefully over time with votes and selection processes for a reason. It's often a team effort of passionate people. Moderating poorly risks putting the subreddit on collision course with the community but hey that is Spez and gang's problem, not yours.

I don't think there is any other language that Reddit understands than this. Mods -- take a breather and see what the world has to offer. It's not just all about Reddit.

Exactly. Stop moderating and remove any auto moderating bots. That's it. Let Reddit self destruct.

Interesting how the first thing I felt when I read this was, "I hope Reddit doesn't".

Incredible how fast my fondness of Reddit went away in 1 week.

It's a platform whose time to die has arrived. The corpos are getting their hands on it, and nothing punk can be done with it anymore.

Fuck corpo shit. Burn corpo shit.

My hope is that all this drama makes the IPO not happen.

My hope is that all this drama makes the IPO not happen.

Nah, it would be better if IPO happens and the company's value evaporates overnight.

Probably wouldn't happen, but one can dream.

Hi look at Robinhood's stock chart since its IPO.

Robinhood got on our bad side, remember? We did some hella punk shit on Reddit.

Nowadays you can't use reddit like that. Bots, paid shills, shadow bans, silenced subreddits, co-opted mods, and now you can't even take your sub dark in protest. You're either a profitable end user or entirely unwelcome.

It’s too late. Hopefully Reddit dies.

I see where you're coming from but I hope Reddit doesn't die. Yes this situation sucks, but there's a lot of valuable information on Reddit after years of indexing everyone and anyone's questions. Killing Reddit is akin to burning down the library of Alexandria (Not nearly as sever, but I'm sure you get the picture.)

At least before Reddit dies, I hope we find a way to archive at of that user data.

Idk, the pure volume of content could outweigh the library of Alexandra and Bagdad. Its not just memes, but every from text support, ask historians and pure input from people.
I think there should be archives available until march: https://archive.org/details/pushshift-reddit-2023-03/
Data hoarder, let's go! No one knows how long, till Reddit sues archive org using DMCA

It would be preferable, if the idiots stay at reddit.

reddit took a downturn when Digg imploded. Now reddit is a lot like Digg was back then.