@grimmiges @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

Pd.D. students definitely (often) work hard. But if that was reason enough, grammar and high school students should be school employees too, and be paid for attending classes, and get overtime pay for homework and exam cramming. And piano teachers should pay the students, rather than the other way around. >>

@freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @grimmiges @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

"deserve a living wage, as does everyone"

One reason why PhD student grants are so low is that the relevant policymakers often fall, consciously or unconsciously, for a "market" approach.

Say they decide that the country must support N PhD students on astroentomology. If they set the grant pay to $X, and all N grants are taken, they will usually conclude that $X is quite enough. >>

@freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @grimmiges @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

But unfortunately there are many students who apply to PhD programs not because they have the vocation and potential to be researchers, not even because they think that an academic career will be less stressful than one in industry, but only because they like being students and don't want to get a job. >>

@SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @grimmiges @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

I met several of them both as colleagues during my PhD and as advisor here. And I am afraid that I was one of them myself...

You must agree that a student's life IS more pleasant than a worker's life, in may ways...

@JorgeStolfi @SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

A bit of 21st century reality:
In STEM, in the WEIRD world, I need three papers in 2–3 years (five would be better), one in a Q1 journal as first author, otherwise my career ends with the graduation.

In Germany I do this for a net-income that is (if having that 50% PhD position) about 1/3 of what a worker makes at ALDI. Who gets any overtime paid. A PhD doesn't.

@grimmiges @SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

The demands by PhD students, especially married ones, that their GRANTS be enough for decent living, is meritorious and I wish them all the luck.

But they will not get anywhere as long as they start from the wrong premise that a PhD is an employment relation, and that the grant is payment for the work they do for the univ, advisor, or the state. That is just not true. >>

@grimmiges @SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

Univs DON'T create PhD programs, and hire profs to advise in them, because they want the research and papers. If they did, they would have staff to assess the benefit that each paper or discovery brings to them or to humanity, and reward students and profs accordingly. And they would not care whether the students finish their PhDs or not. >>

@grimmiges @SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

The goal of PhD programs is not to do research, but to TRAIN FRONT-LINE RESEARCHERS. Univs demand that PhD students publish papers in good journals because that is the only way the students can learn how to do and publish research -- and prove that they have learned it. >>

@JorgeStolfi @SteveCooke @freyablekman @SerhatTutkal @anne_kreft @jocelyn_etienne @academicchatter

You are free to remain in your ivory tower until you get your well-merited state-funded pension.

Meanwhile, others, especially PhDs, will have to deal with reality in their respective fields.

But I take great comfort in the knowledge that PIs of my age think like me, not like you.