Bill in PS-CA.🏳️‍🌈Dec 27, 2022
Mike Masnick ✅
Next time someone criticizes my coverage of Elon Musk and says something along the lines of "have you built the first successful EV company or launched rockets into space? Then you shouldn't comment!" I'm going to point out that the answer is no, but I've also never destroyed this much shareholder value in a year.
Dec 27, 2022 at 10:25pmWeb
Show threadLuke KaniesDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick …has anyone? Ever?
Show threadJxyzn SxyzyxnDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick but but but it's the Fed's fault with the interest rates!
Show threadNLAWScametovisitDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick elon musk hasnt done any of that shit either, he just bought those companies.
Show threadkmetzDec 27, 2022
@NLAWScametovisit @mmasnick the guy actually founded SpaceX (and found a group of actually good engineers), but not Tesla. No defense, just a factual correction.
Show threadNLAWScametovisitDec 27, 2022
@kmetz @mmasnick I appreciate the correction! ❤️
Show threadenmodo ⚛️ 🧬 🇺🇦 🍉Dec 28, 2022
@NLAWScametovisit @kmetz @mmasnick and for every Musk that succeeded financially, even temporarily, there are a dozen or hundred other entrepreneurs that didn't. His businesses were constantly close to failure including SpaceX which was at one point a single failed launch away from bankruptcy. But I don't think you'll ever hear him attribute SpaceX success to some luck and government money.
Show threadMichael GemarDec 28, 2022
@kmetz @NLAWScametovisit @mmasnick He also got involved with Tesla about half a year after its founding, and has been CEO since 2008. It would be hard to argue that he hasn’t pretty much made the company what it is (for good *and* ill). I think it’s a mistake to completely dismiss him as a business person, although it’s clear that his successful companies involve adult supervision.
Show threadJDDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick I think we are seeing the proof of failing up in real time. I think those companies are successful despite EM.
Show threadkmetzDec 27, 2022
@jag0325 @mmasnick Funny thing I heard that at SpaceX there‘s a lot of „Elon management“ happening, like distracting the boss to get actual work done.
Show threadJDDec 27, 2022
@kmetz @mmasnick saw that as well. Pathetic.
Show threadJoeDec 28, 2022
@kmetz @jag0325 @mmasnick Heard there was some of that at Tesla as well... Foremen would tell their workers to go the long way around and not cross Elon's office because if you did, there was a 50% chance Elon would randomly fire you.
Show threadJohn Spounias  Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick My earliest appraisal of this has come to pass, Elon is really good at solving real world problems. Him vs nature. So he can push his engineers to make a better rocket, or a lighter battery, or whatever. That kind of ego can move mountains. What was called for Steve Jobs the 'reality distortion field'. That skill set is very poor however at EQ and social issues. You can't force people like you can force science to launch a rocket. You can blow up a rocket. Iteration here hurts people.
Show threadkmetzDec 27, 2022
@d3cline @mmasnick Musks „reality distortion field“ has no overlap anymore with any reality anybody would want („longtermism“ etc)
Show threadkmetzDec 27, 2022
@d3cline @mmasnick I mean he went as low as praising and agreeing with openly criminal shills like „Dotcom“ Schmitz, or actual genociding neonazis like Putins spiteful puppet Medwedew,. He went below bottom of the barrel. He reached the lowest crust of a russian military latrine that wasn‘t emptied in 70 years level. Literally.
Show threadJohn Spounias  Dec 27, 2022
@kmetz @mmasnick I think he likely has Bipolar II or another mania disorder. I have it. And I can relate to how its possible to get so far down the rabbit hole like this. It doesn't justify his actions, but I see it as a tragic part of these personalities. Sad thing is, he has enough money and time left to live to fix his image. Its going to be depressing to watch. But that is how these things go.
Show threadhstDec 28, 2022
@d3cline @kmetz @mmasnick no checks on his chit show is hurting tesla investors. It will also hurt already divided country even more.
Show threadNick 'The Viking'Dec 28, 2022

@d3cline @mmasnick

But pushing engineers is pushing people.

I'm both.
I don't react well to being pushed.
Most folks don't.

And I'm very skeptical that Elon himself actually pushed any successful team. He pushed a manager that knew how to get his team to do good work, part of being a good manager is protecting them from top-down bullshit that impedes their work.

It's a horrible comparison, but it cuts even deeper because of it....how many sports teams do well when all the players are pissed off and the coach is yelling all the time?

He's demonstrating his complete lack of comprehension of human behavior by attempting to fix a non-technical problem with technical solutions.

Show threadWhiteHatShark🦈Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick such a stable genius! Actually hoped and was expecting this, he made such a huge mistake
Show thread⚳ rapid unscheduled assembly ⚳Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick It's honestly amazing how much money he's managed to lose on a $44 billion acquisition.
Show threadIan McLeanDec 28, 2022
@coregaze @mmasnick Indeed. Us normal people usually can’t manage to lose more than 100% of a bad investment.
Show threadenmodo ⚛️ 🧬 🇺🇦 🍉Dec 28, 2022
@coregaze @mmasnick and he could have swallowed his pride and paid the $1B penalty to get out of the deal. And if he really wanted Twitter bought it for $20B or less a year later after they had done all the hard work of firing people properly. Or you know apparently he could have gotten a few of his Python guys to build a new Twitter from scratch. Right ...
Show threadMike Masnick ✅Dec 28, 2022

@enmodo @coregaze Ugh. That was NEVER an option. I don't know that myth keeps making the rounds.

The $1B was not a "walk away" penalty. He could not just pay it and get out of the deal. The deal called for "specific performance" meaning he had to complete the deal.

The $1B penalty was ONLY in the case that some OUTSIDE factor somehow killed the deal. Not Musk walking away.

Show thread⚳ rapid unscheduled assembly ⚳Dec 28, 2022

@mmasnick @enmodo Honestly, if he'd bought it and immediately sold it for what it was worth he'd only have lost 24 billion dollars, whereas... yeah, he's wiped 800 billion off of Tesla's market cap, ruined his own reputation, burned three major banks, pissed off Saudi royalty and his buddy Larry, and- as if that weren't enough- lost about $150 billion of his own net worth.

Astonishing how he's managed to unbound the downside potential of a deal by flapping his god damned stupid mouth.

Show threadBrian SwetlandDec 28, 2022
@coregaze @mmasnick @enmodo I keep hoping he's going to finally help people figure out that "made a lot of money" does not actually mean somebody is smart, but thus far somehow it's proving difficult for folks to accept that Elon is a fucking moron.
Show threadauthor_is_ShrikeTron🔠💉x5Dec 28, 2022

@coregaze @mmasnick @enmodo He could've just did Bezos of buy it, keep banning Nazis, and shut his mouth.

Advertisers would've stayed, he could transition to Blue with a proper advisory team, etc etc.

Show threadenmodo ⚛️ 🧬 🇺🇦 🍉Dec 28, 2022
@ShrikeTron @coregaze @mmasnick "shut his mouth" isn't the Elon we know. For one it is too full of his feet to shut now.
Show threadenmodo ⚛️ 🧬 🇺🇦 🍉Dec 28, 2022
@mmasnick @coregaze I've never heard that before. The $1B "breakup fee" in the deal was well publicised at the time. All he had to do was arrange to have his financing fall apart. That would have been easy to arrange.
Show threadDanDec 28, 2022
@enmodo @mmasnick @coregaze nope. My understanding is that the only one who had that breakup fee option was Twitter. They could initiate and pay. But Musk was always screwed over. He had no out.
Show threadMike Masnick ✅Dec 28, 2022
@enmodo @coregaze nope. Specific performance meant he'd have to come up with the cash. Financing falling through was explicitly not an out.
Show threadenmodo ⚛️ 🧬 🇺🇦 🍉Dec 28, 2022

@mmasnick thanks for the correction. I found this Barron's article... https://www.barrons.com/articles/semiconductors-geopolitics-taiwan-tsmc-globalization-51671746993 so it sounds like whether the specific performance could be used against him as a person not a corporation was unclear.

According to this Fortune article https://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-did-elon-musk-agree-080448660.html he probably caved to avoid embarrassing discovery revelations, issues around private communications, and yeah a decisive loss on his unsubstantiated bot claims.

I guess he wasn't such a genius in giving himself a solid out.

A Semiconductor Renaissance Is Under Way. It Will Change the Nature of Globalization.

The forces that are fragmenting supply chains are also creating historic opportunities for innovation and growth, writes Alex Capri.

Barrons
Show threadKeith_RDec 28, 2022

@enmodo @coregaze @mmasnick

"he could have swallowed his pride"

He would literally turn himself inside-out if he had to do that...

Show threadThat Anonymous CowardDec 27, 2022

@mmasnick

Tesla Founders Picture dot gif
High school students launch rockets in to space quite a bit these days

I haven't seen a decline in values since Trump was president...

Show threadThe Big FoxDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick tesla is down so much that trump might think it’s one of his casinos.
Show threadhstDec 28, 2022
@Trumptheloser @mmasnick 🤣🤣
Show threadxs4me2Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick
Direction rock bottom!
Show threadComputeforloot Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick 😂
Show threadChad LoderDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick Anyone know which price floor triggers a margin call from his creditors?
Show threadMike Masnick ✅Dec 27, 2022
@chadloder i don't, but it's a good question...
Show threadDanDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick @chadloder a followup - what is the same margin q for all of the board members?
Show threadTallPotatoDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick @chadloder good question? It’s an excellent question!
Show threadsneaky pete jrDec 27, 2022
@chadloder @mmasnick it *has* to have hit it already
Show threadThe Big FoxDec 27, 2022
@chadloder @mmasnick I wonder why the trading bots haven’t been automatically buying up Tesla this low(I reckon that the price target is closer to 50)
Show threadKevin RussellDec 27, 2022

@mmasnick

Have you ever bought a free speech discussion platform used by millions and used it to pump far right propaganda at people? Have you ever hidden tweets complaining about the sudden propaganda? Hidden tweets complsining about the hiding of tweets?

If not, you have history's permission to document and spread information about an active anti American subversive.

Show threadKeith_RDec 28, 2022

@kevinrns @mmasnick

"an active anti American "

It's not just about being "anti American", Kevin.

Big old world out there that *isn't* the US, and his shenanigans are fucking us *all* over.

Show threadKevin RussellDec 28, 2022

@keithreeder @mmasnick

Yes, completely correct, and "all" of us need to find ways to slow and stop him.

I might emphasize his intentions and threats to Americans in part because Americans have democratic protections, powers and rights that Elron is subject to.

Right now for example, his random and far right assaults on the late Twitter platform have piqued the interest of the FTC, and humid musk is demonstrating not an ounce of care for the hole he is digging himself.

Show threadDirk HohndelDec 27, 2022

@mmasnick
Turns out Amazon, Apple, and MSFT have had similarly bad years. Maybe not in the form of such spectacular implosion - and if you take percentage of value lost, not even close...

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/teslas-stock-drop-has-been-bad-but-this-company-has-wiped-out-more-investor-wealth-11671652315

Tesla's stock drop has been bad. But this company has hurt investors even more.

Despite all the pain from Elon Musk’s Twitter distractions, Tesla ranks fourth on a list of the worst S&P 500 stocks of 2022 by market-value decline

MarketWatch
Show threadEmily 🏳️‍⚧️Dec 27, 2022

@dirkhh @mmasnick that article makes the amazing point that 2% of large number is much bigger than 40% of a small number.

Which is the sort of stupid argument I’m sure Elon buys into as TSLA slides past 60% down YTD. ‘I’ve destroyed 60% of TSLAs value in a year, but that’s less cash than Amazon down 4%’ is only a win to an idiot.

Show threadDirk HohndelDec 27, 2022

@EmilyGB20
you already said that Elon would think it's a win 🤷🏼‍♂️

As always, perspective matters. Something like "the largest percentage drop in market cap in nine months for a company worth more than $100B"

@mmasnick

Show threadEmily 🏳️‍⚧️Dec 27, 2022
@dirkhh @mmasnick no, raw percentage I think matters. Nobody would care if TSLA was down 5%. Good and bad years happen, good and bad markets happen. Down over 60% in a year? Catastrophic.
Show threadThe Evil WriterDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick Elon Musk also never did either of those things, so you're doing great so far!
Show threadSanjath SDec 27, 2022
@mmasnick in fairness, it was all pumped up price from post pandemic rally, It was $44 in early 2020. As much as we wish otherwise, it has been quite good for him all the while. His board granting him 50B in stock, endless chatter about all his companies. Even his worst investment in Twitter may not be that bad when you consider that if he had kept TSLA stock he would've lost as much!
Show threadHolly 🚀⚜️Dec 27, 2022
@mmasnick I have launched rockets into space, so I’m gonna be bold and say that this is bad.
Show threadgenewitchDec 27, 2022
@absolutspacegrl @mmasnick not only that but weren't there "successful EV company" back in the late 1800s and early 1900s?
Show threadLizardDec 28, 2022
@genewitch @mmasnick @absolutspacegrl
Yes. This is just few pages of electric cars from a catalog from 1907. There were several dozen models in a range of prices.
Show threadKeith_RDec 28, 2022

@LizardSF @genewitch @mmasnick @absolutspacegrl

What? Musky *didn't* start the whole EV thing?

What a shocker..!

Show threadEllen PearDec 29, 2022
@LizardSF @genewitch @mmasnick @absolutspacegrl That’s fabulous!
Show threadUncle 6 🌁Dec 27, 2022
@absolutspacegrl @mmasnick guffawed and followed
Show threadCalamity Joan 😷Dec 28, 2022

@uncle6 @absolutspacegrl @mmasnick

Literally, same.

Show threadUncle 6 🌁Dec 28, 2022
@clickhere @absolutspacegrl @mmasnick not for nothing but I was doing IT for small spacecraft at Ames in 2008 when everything they put on a SpaceX rocket ended up as hot shrapnel in the ocean, so I have a poor opinion of him acting like “he” launched anything without epic amounts of federal money and patience
Show threadCalamity Joan 😷Dec 28, 2022

@uncle6 @absolutspacegrl @mmasnick

He's an idiot.