Benjamin WittesIn response to a post in which I said that russia is committing genocide in Ukraine, @ViviannaVanGogh asks me the following question. I would be pleased to oblige her with an explanation.
@ViviannaVanGogh The Genocide Convention, formally known as the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, is available here. Signed in 1948, it went into effect in 1951: https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/documents/atrocity-crimes/Doc.1_Convention%20on%20the%20Prevention%20and%20Punishment%20of%20the%20Crime%20of%20Genocide.pdf
@ViviannaVanGogh It contains a rather expansive definition of "genocide" in Article II, one that is based on five possible predicate acts combined with a single overarching mens rea requirement:
@ViviannaVanGogh Note that you don't have to commit more than one of the predicate acts to commit genocide. You do, however, have to do the act "with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such.
@ViviannaVanGogh We will return to the question of intent shortly, but let's start with the following observation: russia has committed ALL FIVE of the named offenses in the genocide convention on a large scale.
@ViviannaVanGogh Let's tick through them individually, just for clarity's sake:
"(a) Killing members of the group;"
No question here. Mariupol, Bucha, etc. Everywhere russian troops have been, there have been atrocities, mass graves, and killings of civilians.
"(a) Killing members of the group;"
No question here. Mariupol, Bucha, etc. Everywhere russian troops have been, there have been atrocities, mass graves, and killings of civilians.
@ViviannaVanGogh "(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;" No question here either. I personally know a great many of mentally traumatized Ukrainians. That russian forces have inflicted physical injury through torture and other barbarities---like shelling apartment buildings---is not meaningfully in doubt either.
@ViviannaVanGogh "(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its
physical destruction in whole or in part;"
I have one word for anyone who doubts this: "Mariupol."
@ViviannaVanGogh "(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;" Sexual violence against Ukrainian women has been pervasive since the full-scale invasion began.
russia might argue that its systematic rapes have not been intended to prevent Ukrainian births---and that this particular provision, which I believe refers to forced sterilizations---technically does not apply. Some scholars have argued otherwise, however, and the UN Security Council has actually weighed in.
@ViviannaVanGogh In UN Security Council Resolution 1820, the Security Council "Notes that rape and other forms of sexual violence can constitute a war
crime, a crime against humanity, or a constitutive act with respect to genocide."
I would not personally want to argue the "systemic rape is not a component act in genocide" defense.
@ViviannaVanGogh Finally, there's "(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."
This has, of course, happened on a large scale. Russia even boasts about it.
This has, of course, happened on a large scale. Russia even boasts about it.
@ViviannaVanGogh So the constitutive acts are all there---with only one possible exception. The remaining question is only whether any or all of them are taken "with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national . . . group, as such."
I would submit that to ask this question is also to answer it.
But if anyone needs evidence of intent to destroy the Ukrainian nation, let's start with Putin's speeches, in which he denies Ukraine's existence, claims that it has always been part of russia,
@ViviannaVanGogh and claims the right to annex its territories. Consider also the long-term war on the Ukrainian language. And consider russian theft of and destruction of Ukrainian cultural artifacts.
Moreover, if you listen to russian propaganda, the erasure of the Ukrainian nation is an overt theme. It's not subtle at all.
In short, I think the mens rea requirement is actually quite easily proven.
@ViviannaVanGogh Bottom line: This is not a close case. It's genocide plain and simple.
End of Thread.
Angry Centrist@benjaminwittes @ViviannaVanGogh
๐ ๐ ๐
And THIS is how you tell a sea lion to STFU. ๐ฅ
Vivian Smotherman@benjaminwittes Ben; Iโm in agreement with all of your descriptions of atrocities. However; let me put the question to you that if Putin had achieved a swift military victory in the first few weeks as he had hoped, would he have then continued bombing hospitals? Raping civilians? Etc. the answer is no. None of that would have occurred. The crimes are there, but before a criminal tribunal of the international court it would be nearly impossible to prove genocidal intent.
TAHinSLC@ViviannaVanGogh @benjaminwittes I have no doubt that he would have outlawed the Ukranian language, purged intellectuals and politicians, and done many many other really bad things to Ukranians even in that scenario.
Stephen K ๐โข๏ธโ๏ธ๐บ๐ฆ 
@ViviannaVanGogh @benjaminwittes Part of his 'victory' plan was distinct ethnic cleansing.
And besides that: How can you POSSIBLY conclude that giving a genocidal bully what he wants is somehow a good thing?
The plan was always genocide. It was always to wipe Ukrainian culture from the Earth, disappear undesirables, and destroy the country.
What would you have had Ukraine do? Hell, you are basically arguing that Poland and Czechoslovakia in World War 2 should've given Germany what they wanted to avoid bloodshed.
This is not how you prevent Genocides. Its how you perpetuate them. The Russian military had lists of who to round up. They had torture chambers. They planned to disappear entire towns. They already have. Where is the positive outcome in allowing a force with those plans victory? A few less people died so that purposeful torture and ethnic cleansing can go forward unopposed?
Ada า.@ViviannaVanGogh @benjaminwittes
Genocide of Ukrainians (and others under russiaโs heel) had been the goal of russians long before the current war. See Holodomor for starters. This is not new, nor would it have ever stopped if putin were appeased. The only difference is that putin would then control the media and the narrative and deny its occurrence.
Genocide of Ukrainians (and others under russiaโs heel) had been the goal of russians long before the current war. See Holodomor for starters. This is not new, nor would it have ever stopped if putin were appeased. The only difference is that putin would then control the media and the narrative and deny its occurrence.
RAK@ViviannaVanGogh: Given that Putin openly, through official channels, denied Ukrainian national identity before the resumption of the war, the only distinction is that the Russians would have been more subtle about it.
Serial Greyhound Adopter@raktheundead @ViviannaVanGogh The argument smacks of victim-blaming.
Bret Mogilefsky@benjaminwittes @ViviannaVanGogh Let's not forget erasing/revising Ukrainian history through the school curriculum in occupied areas. That seems pretty clear!
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-62577314
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-62577314
Wiseoldcrone@benjaminwittes @ViviannaVanGogh and the Russians have stolen Ukrainian children
@adrcatgul @ViviannaVanGogh This is very interesting point I had not considered. But yes, that is surely right.
MtnMermaid@benjaminwittes @ViviannaVanGogh
I believe that they are preventing โpureโ Ukrainian births by spreading the Russian seed by rape throughout the country.
nadezhda@benjaminwittes APโs special report returning to Mariupol today checks almost all the genocide boxes in just that 1 city
โEight months after Mariupol fell into Russian hands, Russia is eradicating all vestiges of Ukraine from it โ along with the evidence of war crimes buried in its buildings, such as the famed Drama Theater where demolition started Thursday.โ 10k+ new graves
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9
Russia scrubs Mariupol's Ukraine identity, builds on death
Throughout Mariupol, Russian workers are tearing down bombed-out buildings at a rate of at least one a day, hauling away shattered bodies with the debris. Russian military convoys are rumbling down the broad avenues of what is swiftly becoming a garrison city, and Russian soldiers, builders, administrators and doctors are replacing the tens of thousands of Ukrainians who have died or left.
@benjaminwittes How the AP estimated 10,300 new graves in occupied Mariupol
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-erasing-mariupol-499dceae43ed77f2ebfe750ea99b9ad9
Russia scrubs Mariupol's Ukraine identity, builds on death
Throughout Mariupol, Russian workers are tearing down bombed-out buildings at a rate of at least one a day, hauling away shattered bodies with the debris. Russian military convoys are rumbling down the broad avenues of what is swiftly becoming a garrison city, and Russian soldiers, builders, administrators and doctors are replacing the tens of thousands of Ukrainians who have died or left.
Erica Eby@thecooltable.wtf @ViviannaVanGogh โ If one chooses to come at @benjaminwittes, one best have receipts.