I want to start Canadian member-owned cooperative to run Mastodon servers in Canada.

Similar to social.coop but Canadian.

Notes here:

https://evanp.gitlab.io/canadian-mastodon-cooperative

Copied in thread below:

@bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

@bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

Canadian member-run co-op

2. 1 co-op membership gets you 1 fediverse account with fixed allowances (uploads, API use, toots per day, etc.) plus a co-op vote

3. has local services per neighbourhood or city, but membership is national

4. run a first emergency server nationally to catch the next wave of Twitter migration

@bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

5. Member run, nobody gets paid for now

6. CAD$60/year membership fee

7. I just registered cosocial.ca so let's use that as a name for now

@bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

- 4 other people to be directors/incorporators. Diverse voices, including women and nonbinary, 2SLGTBQIA+, Black, Indigenous, fr/en, needed up front.

- Someone to fill out the paperwork

- Someone to collect and manage $$

- Someone(s) to set up the server on Canadian k8s service

@timbray notes that we could probably get things going with a Digital Ocean one-click server very quickly.
@evan @timbray highly recommend setting up a loomio server alongside it for coordinating around governance. we have loomio dot friend dot camp (closed to outsiders)
@darius @evan @timbray second this, Loomio is wonderful and underrated.
@timbray @evan I am running a stand-alone instance in DO and it’s great so far. Good advice in using S3 from the start (spaces in DO). This should make it easier to put a load balancer in front of multiple smaller droplets. Also recommend separating elastic search and Postgres.

@evan Betting @timbray is probably right.

If you want another option: I spun up a Linode server with Cloudron (essentially a cloud app store) and had an instance up and running in about 20 minutes.

I used it for testing and then shut it down after a few days but it was quick and painless to get going.

@evan @timbray Also recommend not using the 1click install. Rolling your own is an important learning experience that gives you more flexibility long-term and the instructions are quite good.

@evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

I’m willing to help on the director side and possibly the financial management side (currently doing some work with and making connections in ACFE, though I’m a long way away from that kind of certification)

@Aphrodite would you be game to be the alpha test of this form and see if it makes sense? https://forms.gle/2cCNGSMZGhHED7198
Welcome to CoSocial.ca

This is the future home of CoSocial.ca, an all-Canadian Mastodon cooperative. We will be online by late November 2022 so that you can have your own Canadian home on Mastodon—and help build this community together. We are inclusive and committed to building a diverse founding coalition that will jointly create the community vision, guidelines and moderation policies. If you want to be part of that process—or get notified when the instance is online, and ready for signups—please fill in this form. For more about this effort (including the experienced team of Mastodon admins & coop members who are helping it get off the ground) please follow the #CoSocialCa tag on Mastodon.

Google Docs

@Aphrodite @evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

Note that VanCity is well-set-up to do business with co-ops: https://www.vancity.com/BusinessBanking/Financing/SpecializedSectorSolutions/Cooperatives/

So i'd recommend starting there once incorporation is filed. As I said, happy to do the grunt work.

Co-operatives - Vancity

Vancity invests in co-operative businesses through our high impact lending and investment programs. We support co-operatives to be successful by providing products, programs, and services to help them grow— from early planning to start-up and launch, right through to sustainability and expansion.

@timbray Hot. I was planning to file the papers with my home addy in Montreal as the HQ. Would that be a problem for Vancity? Better to have someone in BC?
@evan I was just poking around the Govt of Canada registration pages and it look s crushingly similar to registering a nonprofit society in BC, which I've done. I could volunteer to do all that paper-shuffling stuff once you've selected directors and so on. Having said that, if there's a national-scope co-op bank like VanCity, might be a better choice? I'll look.
@timbray We've got Desjardins on this side. Similar.
@evan Don't let me get in the way. Happy to help with whatever gruntwork.

@timbray Sorry, I meant, "Desjardins is an option but I'm leaving this up to you".

I'll send drafts of the docs by email

@evan Probably need to move some of this to another channel. Signal, Discored, whatever…
@timbray @evan the channel #mastocan already exists on Libera, reachable by both Matrix and IRC!

@Aphrodite @evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

Urgh, not sure masto is the best place for a threaded organizational discussion. Someone got an idea for a better channel? Anyhow, I've been looking, it's pretty easy and cheap to register a Canada Federal-level co-op.

Um… We have to pick a name and it has to be unique. It costs $10 to check. If we want to converge on a small number of candidates, I can run the checks & will cover costs.

@timbray @evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

Element as an option for async, more secure comms for now..?

@timbray @Aphrodite @bmann @trishussey @blaine @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

I'm working on the paperwork! I figured "Cosocial Cooperative" for the name

@evan Do you know where you'd like to host, beyond "in Canada"? Is AWS's ca-central-1 "Canadian" enough, or were you thinking something smaller/closer/less-international?
@evan (sorry; I see there's a lot of context I missed. I'll read. No need to reply unless it's not there.)
@sean Mixed ideas. Digital Ocean has a Toronto data centre and a 1-click install for Mastodon, so that's probably where we'd start.
@sean What about #OVH? They have a managed #k8s offering and they'd be less of a #GDPR challenge than AWS (surely you'll end up having at least some EU-based visitors).
https://www.ovhcloud.com/en-ca/public-cloud/kubernetes/
Managed Kubernetes Service

Get a free, highly available Managed Kubernetes® service, to orchestrate applications containerised in master nodes hosted free of charge by OVHcloud.

OVHcloud
@evan Can we use #cosocialca as a hashtag for now so folks can find/follow conversation?
@evan happy to help with paperwork or anything else (have incorporated a coop within Manitoba in the past)
@pensato Oh great! I was thinking federal, since we're spread across CA.
@evan of course. Let me know what you need from me to get going.
@evan I don't know how many are running Mastodon at scale in k8s but I found one Mastodon developer who might be doing it:
https://ykzts.technology/@ykzts/109314243046201689
https://opencollective.com/ykzts

@evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

I’m game.

I have a dot-ca domain going spare and I’ve finally got theming for it.

:)

@Aphrodite yay! Esp love that you are coming from chaos.social. CCC was one of the groups I studied for my dissertation a ZILLION years ago.
@trishussey @walkah @bmann @timbray @evan @hypatia @awsamuel @blaine i think this is the first time I seen fixed allowances

@wndxlori @chad for help, support, advice?

There's room for multiple servers in Canada, right?

@evan @chad absolutely. But there’s loads to be learned by cooperating and sharing. And figuring out sustainable funding models 🤞

There are several Canadian Mastodon servers already and a couple of us are looking into starting up some more (for Toronto and Ottawa respectively)— how can existing servers fit into this?

(BTW am formerly of social.coop)

@nev a co-op model could be a single instance co-op (like social.coop) or if we were creative it could be a co-op of servers, sharing resources in some way. Economics of scale would need to come into the analsysis.
@evan That's interesting. Would it support local/regional instance creation and funding? (like geographically-focused instances for big cities or regions/territories?)
@evan that's great! keep me in the loop then. 🙂
We had in the past an instance focused on Quebec (FediQuebec) but after a technical issue it has disappeared. Would love to see that kind of instances coming back.
@evan Very happy to help/contribute in any way I can. Some experience in getting co-ops going!
@evan the more coop-run instances the better!
@evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @timbray @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel I think that is laudable goal! mstdn.ca is well on it's way to accomplishing this. The admin is looking to register a non-profit society in AB and has asked for volunteer directors. It might be worthwhile taking a look.

@5hole @evan @bmann @trishussey @blaine @hypatia @walkah @awsamuel

My impression is mstdn.ca wants to be a free service? I'm dubious whether that's a good idea.