Luci Rockslike, what really irritates me most about linux is the casual expectation that it’s okay to require the terminal to do certain things. until someone is willing to build a UI that does a full mac classic style lockdown of everything, and make it just work without needing to configure it, linux is not taking general appeal seriously.
i am not gonna set up my dad with linux if I have to walk him through compiling a kernel module or editing the x11 configuration file with vim over the phone.
unspeakablehorror (Reinstated)@zensaiyuki I mean, there's room for improvement in linux uis, but I don't recall ever doing any of those things on my home linux machines, and I've been using linux for well over a decade as a power user. Also there are plenty of text editors besides vim available for linux. What linux environments are you familiar with?
@unspeakablehorror you must have somehow avoided the more advanced tasks such as “installing apps” or “playing a sound file”
@unspeakablehorror i have not encountered a version of linux that does not require the terminal for basic setup, and I usualy stick to the versions that are supposed to be “easy”
@unspeakablehorror so, y’know, i have to wknder if you’re lying or somehow don’t remember using the terminal
@zensaiyuki you mentioned installing a driver and using vim to edit a file. Was just responding to those statements. Yes, I use the terminal all the time.
hef@zensaiyuki @unspeakablehorror I remember being able to do both of those things in ubuntu a few years ago without difficulty.
@hef @unspeakablehorror ubuntu does the most to make the experience seamless, but it ultimately couldn’t help me install the right driver and right settings for my videocard without me needing to donk around with apt and config files for entire weekends with no success.
@zensaiyuki @unspeakablehorror
Not wanting to ever have to burn a weekend configuring hardware is a big factor in me deciding to get a mac. iterm2 being really nice is another.
@zensaiyuki @hef one important thing to keep in mind is that some hardware is...not very compatible with linux. I feel you on the videocard issue. Those I have seen issues with from time to time. Hardware support with Linux isn't as reliable as on Mac or Windows for a number of reasons...unfortunately I don't think better UI is the solution to that issue.
@zensaiyuki @hef Ubuntu has a GUI for graphics driver install. If the GUI failed you, the problem is not simply the lack of a GUI (though it's fair to criticize the GUI for any features it lacks), but the fact that Linux support is considered secondary to graphics driver hardware companies, so their Linux drivers are often buggy and inferior to the Windows or Mac ones. Better UI won't fix that.
@zensaiyuki most linux distros have a GUI install manager which I sometimes use. Though I prefer copy-pasting into the terminal to install apps, yes. I haven't had problems with sound in linux for over a decade now. I remember back in the day I had trouble with it not being set up for sound by default, but haven't had issues with that in a loooong time.
@unspeakablehorror @zensaiyuki
I think I'm seeing more of this in windows land too. The "Advanced feature" menus in windows seem to keep changing or getting buried further. a "copy and paste" solution is starting to seem elegant.
@hef @unspeakablehorror well, look, I don’t know what ro tell you. if you can’t see the problems they’ll never get fixed.
@zensaiyuki @hef No, I agree. It would be better if using the GUI package manager was possible for every install. I was just saying that I haven't had problems with sound and even moderately user-friendly distros don't push vim as the default text-editor.