I have a love-hate relationship with content warnings/descriptions. As someone who has past trauma myself, I know how much I appreciate when others let me know about sensitive topics so I can choose based on where I am both physically and emotionally.
But I also know how hard it is to decide what is a sensitive or triggering topic. Sometimes I forget to respect people’s food sensitivities, and sometimes I probably add content descriptions where I don’t have to, but if I do, what’s wrong with that? Content warnings improve accessibility for those with trauma or sensitivities, so why don’t i use them as widely as image descriptions for others?

Normalize using content warnings!

#accessibility #ContentWarnings

@Justin Crozer @Stefan Bohacek @Lentävä Kalakukko @Roni Rolle Laukkarinen Whenever I see Mastodon users talk about "culture" in a Fediverse context, I have to wonder: What exactly do they refer to when they talk about "culture"?

Is it Fediverse culture? As in, overarching, software-independent Fediverse culture?

As in, taking into consideration that Fediverse server applications that aren't Mastodon, e.g. Misskey or Sharkey or Friendica or Hubzilla, have different cultures than Mastodon?

Recognising a post or a comment from one of these applications, acknowledging that it comes from a place with a different history, a different set of features and thus a different culture than Mastodon and refraining from enforcing Mastodon's unwritten rules against it?

Or does "culture" only refer to Mastodon's culture? Does it reject or completely disregard all cultures in the Fediverse that aren't Mastodon's and demand the whole Fediverse adopt Mastodon's culture and only Mastodon's culture?

Do these "bad eggs" include users who post more than 500 characters at once (which, by the way, is perfectly normal everywhere outside of Mastodon)?

Do these "bad eggs" include users who reply to people who haven't mentioned them first, and whom they aren't mutually following either (which, by the way, is perfectly normal in large parts of the non-Mastodon Fediverse, too)?

Do these "bad eggs" include users who quote-post Mastodon toots that must not be quote-posted (because they've had quote-posts for much longer than Mastodon, but without a no-quote flag so they can't see Mastodon's no-quote flag)?

Do these "bad eggs" incllude users who "misuse" Mastodon's CW field for summaries (because they have literally had the exact same text field as a summary field for seven years longer than Mastodon has had it as a CW field, and because having a summary field makes a whole lot of sense if your character limit is not 500, but over 16.7 million)?

Do these "bad eggs" include users who use more than four hashtags in one post (because, unlike Mastodon, the places where they are have filtering as well as automatically having messages hidden behind CW buttons deeply engrained into their cultures, but this requires the appropriate keywords to be present)?

If so, then this explains why only Mastodon users can enjoy significant reach on Mastodon: Everyone else is mass-blocked for misbehaving by Mastodon's standards.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse #MastodonCulture #MastodonCentricity #MastodonNormativity
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

@Mark Whybird Sounds like @Mona app basically behaves like the Mastodon pre-4.4 Web interface; in fact, I think I've read somewhere that it's still partly stuck on a Mastodon 3 level.

One issue with this is that the Mastodon pre-4.4 Web interface didn't automatically blur images in posts that have CWs. Instead, when you have images in a CW'd post, Mastodon flags the images sensitive. Mastodon's Web interface blurs images that are flagged sensitive, and I guess so does Mona.

However, most of the rest of the Fediverse doesn't support this Mastodon-specific, non-standard sensitive flag for images. In CW'd image posts from somewhere else than Mastodon, the images will generally not be flagged sensitive, Mastodon won't blur them, and Mona probably won't either.

For example, here on Hubzilla, I could make people click up to four times before they see an image. First, if they have NSFW installed, they have to click an automatically generated content warning. Next, they have to click a summary plus Mastodon-style content warning. Then they have to click a spoiler tag that reveals the blanked-out image. Lastly, they have to click the image to unblank it.

Mastodon/Mona users, on the other hand, will see the very same image below the very same post immediately, un-CW'd, unblurred.

This is why I won't go back to posting images here on Hubzilla and stick to (streams) for that: (streams) can set the Mastodon-specific sensitive flag by adding one or two particular hashtags to a post. At least I hope it still does that.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #Mastodon #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #MonaApp
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

@Mark Whybird The whole alt-text would be a bad idea. Especially if showing the whole alt-text under each image is set to on by default or even hard-coded for everyone's "convenience".

Some of us write or have written extremely long alt-texts. All of my most recent alt-texts are either precisely 1,500 characters or only a very few characters short of it. I'll have to limit my future alt-texts to only 512 characters, but I won't shorten my existing ones. And in the rare case that someone decided to boost one of my image posts to your timeline, you'd have a massive block of 1,500 characters of alt-text underneath each image. On a comparatively small iPhone display even (desktop user here).

Do you really want that?

By the way: How does @Mona app handle images in posts with CWs? Does it hide them behind the CW like Mastodon's Web interface since 4.4.0? Or does it keep them visible underneath the CW'd post like Mastodon's Web interface before 4.4.0? Because in the latter case, I couldn't possibly CW long alt-texts away (while I already CW my long posts away whenever I can, namely whenever they aren't replies).

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

@Der böse Hexe Njähähä 🧙‍♀️🪄⚡️ @Mina Es ist eben eine auf Mastodon weitverbreitete Fehlannahme, daß Mastodons Kultur die Kultur des ganzen Fediverse ist. Und daß Mastodons ungeschriebene Regeln im ganzen Fediverse gelten. Und falls nicht, dann hat dieser Zustand aber schnellstmöglich hergestellt zu werden.

Das liegt auch daran, daß auf Mastodon kaum jemand weiß, inwiefern das Nicht-Mastodon-Fediverse anders ist und anders funktioniert als Mastodon. Oder auch, daß es einige Sachen schon deutlich länger im Fediverse gibt als Mastodon. Daß das Fediverse eben nicht mit Mastodon anfing und auch nicht alles, was nicht Mastodon ist, als Extra nachträglich an Mastodon drangeklebt worden ist.

Im Grunde sind sich nur diejenigen dessen bewußt, die schon lange hauptsächlich oder ausschließlich etwas anderes benutzen als Mastodon. Vor allem die, die eben nicht von Twitter über Mastodon ins Fediverse gekommen sind.

Mastodon vs. Friendica


Das läßt sich sehr gut illustrieren im Vergleich zwischen Mastodon und Friendica. Mastodon ist eine puristische, spartanische Microblogging-Anwendung und versucht, ein Twitter-Klon zu sein. Friendica ist eine Social-Networking-Anwendung und Facebook-Alternative und gleichzeitig eine vollwertige Blogginganwendung mit allen Schikanen.

Mastodon ist von 2016. Friendica ist von 2010, gut fünfeinhalb Jahre älter als Mastodon. Als Mastodon startete, hat es sich mit Friendica verbunden und nicht umgekehrt.

Friendicas Kultur ist ungefähr so alt wie Friendica selbst. Mastodons Kultur, wie sie heute existiert, wurde dagegen geprägt Mitte 2022 von denjenigen, die im Februar und März von Twitter abgehauen sind, nachdem Elon Musk angekündigt hatte, es zu übernehmen.

Wagenburgmentalität vs. totale Föderation


Ein Killerfeature von Friendica war immer, daß es sich mit allen möglichen und unmöglichen Sachen verbinden kann. Mit dem ganzen Fediverse sowieso. Aber auch mit diaspora*, mit Tumblr, mit Libertree, theoretisch sogar mit Twitter, früher tatsächlich sogar mit Facebook, per E-Mail, crossposten nach WordPress geht auch und so weiter und so fort. Damit wirbt Friendica ja auch, daß das geht.

So war es schon immer ein bombenfester Teil von Friendicas Kultur, daß man Kontakte überall hat. Im ganzen Fediverse und über das Fediverse hinaus.

Im krassen Gegensatz dazu steht Mastodon, wo buchstäblich jeder, aber auch wirklich jeder Neuling lernt, daß es nur mit sich selbst verbunden ist. Es gibt Mastodon-Nutzer, die erst nach Jahren erfahren, daß das Fediverse nicht nur Mastodon ist und Mastodon mit noch ganz anderen Sachen verbunden ist.

Je länger es aber dauert, bis man das weiß, desto mehr gewöhnt man sich an ein reines Mastodon-Fediverse. Desto schwerer fällt es, sich an ein Nicht-nur-Mastodon-Fediverse zu gewöhnen. Desto eher will man sogar wirklich ein reines Mastodon-Fediverse haben.

Blöderweise wurde Mastodons aktuelle Kultur aufgebaut von Leuten, die selbst zu der Zeit glaubten, das Fediverse sei nur Mastodon. Sonst wäre Mastodons Kultur nämlich für den Rest des Fediverse offener. Und so ist in Mastodons Kultur quasi eingebrannt, daß alles, was nicht Mastodon ist, ein ungewollter Eindringling ist.

Wir waren zuerst da vs. wir waren wirklich zuerst da


Der Großteil der Mastodon-Nutzer glaubt, das Fediverse fing mit Mastodon an. Und so verhalten sie sich auch. Wir waren zuerst da, Mastodon war zuerst da, also ist Mastodon der Standard.

Die Friendica-Nutzer dagegen wissen, daß Friendica schon lange vor Mastodon da war. Viele Friendica-Nutzer sind ja selbst schon seit Zeiten dabei, als es Mastodon noch gar nicht gab. Folglich weigern sie sich, Mastodon als Ursprung des Fediverse anzuerkennen. Die meisten dürften nämlich wissen, daß der Ursprung des Fediverse StatusNet von 2008 war. Damit war Friendica übrigens auch verbunden.

500 Zeichen vs. gar kein Limit


Anderes Beispiel: Mastodon hat ein festgelegtes Zeichenlimit von 500. Jeder Mastodon-Neuling gewöhnt sich da erstmal dran. Wenn man dann erstmals über einen Beitrag stolpert, der länger ist, dann ist das zutiefst (ver)störend, vor allem, wenn man die offizielle Mastodon-Smartphone-App benutzt, die lange Beiträge nicht einklappen kann.

Folglich ist es auf Mastodon in die Kultur eingebrannt, daß Beiträge mit über 500 Zeichen schlecht sind. Und es ist eine ungeschriebene Regel auf Mastodon, Beiträge, die über 500 Zeichen lang sind, in Threads zu zerschneiden. Zugegeben, die meisten Mastodon-Nutzer haben eh keine andere Wahl.

Auf Friendica ist das ganz anders. Da gab es nie ein definiertes Zeichenlimit. Da sind die Leute es seit jeher gewohnt, soviel auf einmal zu posten, wie sie wollen und müssen. Folglich gehen einigen die zerschnipselten Beiträge von Mastodon gehörig auf die Nerven, weil das den Lesefluß stört.

Und so stehen auf der einen Seite Mastodon-Nutzer, die Friendica-Nutzer dazu zwingen wollen, Beiträge, die länger als 500 Zeichen sind, zu zerschneiden. Auf der anderen Seite stehen Friendica-Nutzer, die zum einen genau das eben nicht nötig haben und zum anderen Mastodon-Nutzern empfehlen, wenn sie öfters mal etwas Langes zu posten haben, an einen Ort im Fediverse umzuziehen, wo sie mehr als nur 500 Zeichen haben. Aber sie sollen um Gottes Willen aufhören mit dieser Schnipselei.

CWs vs. Zusammenfassungen plus NSFW


Noch ein Beispiel: das CW-Feld. Allgemeine Annahme auf Mastodon ist, daß es das so im ganzen Fediverse gibt und es somit auch Teil der Kultur im ganzen Fediverse ist, da vor potentiell verstörenden Inhalten zu warnen. Und das Feld im übrigen auch nur dafür zu nutzen.

Mastodon hat dieses Feld seit 2017.

Friendica hat dieses Feld seit 2010, seit es an den Start ging.

Aber: Auf Friendica war das nie ein CW-Feld. Auf Friendica war es schon immer und ist es heute noch ein Feld für Zusammenfassungen. Warum Zusammenfassungen? Weil es ziemlich viel Sinn ergibt, ein Feld für Zusammenfassungen zu haben, wenn man über 16 Millionen Zeichen auf einmal posten kann.

Und so ist in Friendicas Kultur eingebrannt, daß dieses Feld für Zusammenfassungen genutzt wird. Und nur für Zusammenfassungen.

Auf Mastodon ist genau dieser Sachverhalt derweil total unbekannt, auch weil kaum jemand auf Mastodon überhaupt weiß, daß Friendica existiert, und von denen, die das wissen, die meisten sich nicht vorstellen können, daß Friendica mit Mastodon verbunden ist. Also glaubt man, das Feld sei von Mastodon erfunden worden.

Aber wieso nur für Zusammenfassungen? Gibt's auf Friendica keine Inhaltswarnungen?

Doch. Aber die funktionieren völlig anders. Die werden nicht vom Autor eines Beitrags ausgestellt, sondern beim Leser vollautomatisch per Textfilter erzeugt. Auch das ist bombenfest in Friendicas Kultur eingebrannt, ebenso, daß man dann auch im Beitrag entsprechende Schlüsselwörter einbauen muß, damit das bei entsprechend sensiblen Lesern auch funktioniert.

Übrigens: Das kann auch Mastodon. Aber erst seit Oktober 2022, als Mastodons Kultur und Mastodons ungeschriebene Regeln schon in Stein gemeißelt waren. Und im übrigen wissen 99% von Mastodons Nutzern nicht, daß Mastodon das kann, und mindestens 80% nicht, daß Mastodon überhaupt Filter hat.

Folge:
  • Mastodon-Nutzer werfen Friendica-Nutzern vor, keine CWs zu setzen und das CW-Feld zu mißbrauchen (weil die Friendica-Nutzer das CW-Feld entweder für Zusammenfassungen oder gar nicht benutzen).
  • Friendica-Nutzer werfen Mastodon-Nutzern vor, das Zusammenfassungsfeld für irgendwelchen Blödsinn zu mißbrauchen (weil die Mastodon-Nutzer ihre kryptischen Inhaltswarnungen ins Zusammenfassungsfeld packen).
  • Mastodon-Nutzer werfen Friendica-Nutzern vor, unsinnige und/oder zuviele Hashtags zu verwenden (weil die Friendica-Nutzer genau das als Hashtags eintragen, was sie eigentlich ins CW-Feld eintragen sollen).
  • Friendica-Nutzer werfen Mastodon-Nutzern vor, keine Schlüsselwörter zum Auslösen von NSFW in ihre Beiträge einzubauen (weil die Mastodon-Nutzer gar nicht wissen, daß sowas irgendwo im Fediverse existiert).

Solange es Mastodon-Nutzer gibt, die das Fediverse für nur Mastodon halten, solange es Mastodon-Nutzer gibt, die Mastodon als alleiniges Maß aller Dinge ansehen, solange Mastodon-Nutzern beim Onboarding nichts vom übrigen Fediverse erzählt wird (der Einfachheit halber, oder weil diejenigen, die sie einladen, es auch nicht besser wissen), solange Mastodon-Nutzer Nicht-Mastodon-Nutzer systematisch diskriminieren und gleichzeitig vehement abstreiten, irgendjemanden zu diskriminieren, solange wird der Frust nicht abklingen.

Jetzt kann man natürlich als reiner Mastodon-Nutzer, basiert und mastodongepillt, ankommen und sagen: "Die Lösung liegt doch auf der Hand! Friendica muß mehr wie Mastodon werden. Nur 500 Zeichen, Zusammenfassungsfeld in CW-Feld umbenennen, dieses blöde NSFW abschaffen, alle Protokolle außer ActivityPub rausschmeißen, und alles wird gut!"

Tja, dann kommen aber die Friendica-Veteranen. Qua "wir waren schon gut fünfeinhalb Jahre vor euch hier" und qua "Friendica ist objektiv die bessere und leistungsfähigere Software und Mastodon eine künstlich funktionsreduzierte Krücke, die sich nur durch Propaganda, sektenmäßige Gehirnwäsche ihrer Nutzer und vorsätzliche Inkompatibilität mit dem übrigen Fediverse halten kann". Und sie sagen: "Mastodon sollte viel eher sein blödes Zeichenlimit abschaffen, das CW-Feld in das umbenennen, was es schon auf Identi.ca war, Unterstützung für in sich geschlossene Konversationen einführen, Gruppen nach etablierten Fediverse-Standards einführen, volles HTML-Rendering zulassen bis hin zu beliebig vielen eingebetteten Bildern mitten im Beitrag und auch dieses bräsige Folgen-und-Gefolgtwerden durch standardmäßig gegenseitige Verbindungen ersetzen. Dann wäre das ein Gewinn für das ganze Fediverse!"

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Zeichenlimit #Zeichenlimits #ZeichenlimitMeta #CWZeichenlimitMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #NichtNurMastodon #MastodonKultur #MastodonZentrizität #MastodonNormativität
@Mina
Ich meine: So kompliziert ist das mit den Bildbeschreibungen auf Friendica ja auch nicht.
Ganz so straight-forward wie auf Mastodon ist es aber auch nicht. Und Friendica hat auch keine so vorbildlich detaillierte Dokumentation wie Hubzilla (wo das noch schwieriger ist).

Dazu kommt, daß Friendica immer noch zu einer gewissen Isolation von Mastodon neigt. Das wiederum kommt auch daher, daß ständig Mastodon-Nutzer Friendica-Nutzer dazu zwingen wollen, Friendicas Kultur über Bord zu werfen und statt dessen Mastodons Kultur anzunehmen. Wohlgemerkt, Friendicas Kultur ist mehr als ein Jahrzehnt älter als Mastodons Kultur und sehr viel besser an Friendicas Features angepaßt als Mastodons Kultur.

Wenn jetzt also ein Mastodon-Nutzer ankommt und von einem Friendica-Nutzer z. B. verlangt...
  • seine "Tröts" auf maximal 500 Zeichen zu beschränken und längere "Tröts" in Threads zu zerschneiden
  • das Abstraktfeld (das auf Friendica schon sieben Jahre länger ein Abstraktfeld ist als auf Mastodon ein CW-Feld) für CWs zu nutzen und nur für CWs und nicht für Zusammenfassungen
  • gleichzeitig mit Extra-Hashtags nicht mehr dafür zu sorgen, daß Beiträge automatisch hinter leserseitig individuell generierten CWs versteckt werden (was auf Friendica schon zwölf Jahre länger geht als auf Mastodon und wovon auf Mastodon niemand weiß, daß es überhaupt geht)
  • oder gar das Aussehen der Erwähnungen und Hashtags an den Mastodon-"Standard" anzupassen (was gar nicht geht, weil das auf Friendica hartgecodet ist)
...dann wird der Friendica-Nutzer definitiv nicht mitspielen. Wenn er schon dabei war, als es Mastodon noch gar nicht gab, erst recht nicht. Eher wird er dann großzügig diejenigen Mastodon-Nutzer blockieren, die ihn zu solchen Sachen zu zwingen versuchen. Ich kenne sogar jemanden auf Friendica, der jeden, der längere Beiträge in kurze Schnipsel zerschneidet, sofort und ohne Umschweife blockt.

Folglich wird der Friendica-Nutzer noch weniger davon mitbekommen, was auf Mastodon abgeht.

Weil es aber praktisch kein Zeichenlimit auf Friendica gibt, gibt es natürlich auch die super-simple Variante, die Beschreibung einfach in den Text des Posts zu setzen.
Kann man machen. Dann riskiert man aber, auf den Deckel zu kriegen, weil es im Alt-Text keine adäquate (= garantiert handgeschriebene, 100% akkurate und hinreichend detaillierte) Bildbeschreibung gibt.

Früher war es ja auch noch so, daß Mastodon hinter CWs nur den Post-Text verbarg, nicht aber das Bild. Wenn man ein Bild gepostet hat mit CW, dann konnten Mastodon-Nutzer nicht auf den ersten Blick sehen, daß im Post eine Bildbeschreibung ist. Damit gerechnet haben sie auch nicht, weil sie sich nicht vorstellen konnten, daß jemand eher die 500 Zeichen im "Tröt" für die Bildbeschreibung nimmt als die 1500 im Alt-Text, und auch nicht gesehen haben, daß der Post von Friendica kam und eben nicht von Mastodon. Also gingen sie davon aus: Wenn im Alt-Text keine Bildbeschreibung ist, dann ist da gar keine.

Inzwischen hat Mastodon das für sein Web-Frontend geändert. Ich glaube aber, es dürfte immer noch etliche Smartphone-Apps geben, die Bilder nicht hinter CWs verstecken.

Genau deswegen beschreibe ich meine eigenen Bilder auch immer zweimal: einmal sehr umfangreich im Post selbst und dann noch einmal zusätzlich im Alt-Text. Dabei reize ich im Alt-Text die 1500 Zeichen aus, die Mastodon bietet (weil Mastodon längere Alt-Texte abschneidet), auch wenn ich selbst im Grunde auch für Alt-Texte kein Zeichenlimit habe (ich selbst bin auf Hubzilla und poste meine Bilder auf (streams)). Im Post brauche ich mir über Zeichenlimits keinen Kopf zu machen.

Gut, eigentlich müßte ich die Alt-Texte auf 512 Zeichen beschränken, weil Misskey und die Forkeys längere Alt-Texte gänzlich löschen. Aber zumindest Misskey schneidet lange Posts bei ca. 8000 Zeichen ab, und die Forkeys werden ähnlich funktionieren. Das heißt, *key-Nutzer werden so oder so meine Posts an der Quelle lesen, denn 8000 Zeichen reichen mir nicht für einen Bildpost (außer vielleicht, wenn es ein Meme ist).

CC: @Der böse Hexe Njähähä 🧙‍♀️🪄⚡️

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Zeichenlimit #Zeichenlimits #ZeichenlimitMeta #CWZeichenlimitMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #Bildbeschreibung #Bildbeschreibungen #BildbeschreibungenMeta #CWBildbeschreibungenMeta #FediverseKultur #MastodonKultur #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams)
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

Your own posts aren't any better anyway; CW: long (over 1,300 characters), Fediverse meta, Fediverse-beyond-Mastodon meta, alt-text meta, image description meta, character limit meta, hashtag meta View article View summary

@David Mitchell :CApride: On the other hand, when I look at your personal timeline, it's obvious that you've never really arrived on Mastodon. You break all kinds of rules. You break alt-text and image-describing rules, and you break Mastodon's cultural rules.

You write alt-texts in multiple paragraphs. You almost never use CWs, not for posts over 500 characters, not for US or Canadian politics, not for wars, never. You rarely use hashtags, and when you do, you sometimes put them in-line instead of all into the bottom line. In-line hashtags are inconvenient for screen reader users.

You boost image posts without checking whether the images have alt-texts, much less whether the alt-texts are accurate, sufficiently detailed and in line with the existing alt-text and image description rules. You boost posts about potentially disturbing topics that have no CWs.

So don't come lecturing me if your own doings are likely to get you silently muted and blocked by other Mastodon users left and right.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta #MastodonCulture
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

I've described all my images since I've learned about alt-texts, and I put more effort and knowledge into them than anyone on Mastodon; CW: long (almost 8,700 characters), Fediverse meta, Fediverse-beyond-Mastodon meta, alt-text meta, image description meta, character limit meta Artikel ansehen Zusammenfassung ansehen

@David Mitchell :CApride: Now listen here.

Ever since I've learned about alt-texts and image descriptions, I've described all my images. And unlike most Mastodon users, I've improved my image-describing further and further.

Whenever I learned something new about image descriptions, be it a rule, a guideline, a good practice or a Mastodon preference, I used this new knowledge in new image descriptions and declared all my previous image descriptions obsolete. And I've learned a lot over the years.

I've learned from Mastodon that if explanations are necessary to understand an image, they must be delivered immediately with the image post. Ever since, I've explained everything in my images that needs explaining. And since all my image posts are about extremely obscure niche topics, they need a whole lot of explanations.

I've learned from a physically disabled Mastodon user that not everyone can access alt-texts. She, for example, can't. Thus, explanations in the alt-text are lost to her. I've learned from her that explanations go into the post text. I've put all my explanations into the post text ever since.

I've learned from Mastodon that Mastodon tends to love long, detailed image descriptions. Considering how obscure the contents of my original images are and how nobody knows what anything in them looks like if they don't see it, I came to the conclusion that someone somewhere out there might need full, detailed descriptions. I've given my original images full, detailed descriptions ever since.

I've learned from various sources that alt-text must only describe what's important within the context of a post. But judging from my observations of Mastodon, its culture and its love for long alt-texts override this rule. If someone wants to know about all the small details in your images, the context doesn't matter. Thus, how detailed my image descriptions are depends on whether or not I have to expect someone being curious about the details.

I've learned by experimentation that Mastodon truncates long external alt-texts from outside at the 1,500-character mark. Also, Hubzilla (where I am) can only display so many characters of alt-text, and alt-text cannot be scrolled. Since the audience of my alt-texts is pretty much exclusively on Mastodon, I've put the full, long, detailed image descriptions into the post text.

I've learned from a blog post that alt-texts must never contain line breaks. Line breaks in alt-texts have a nasty side-effect for screen reader users: After each line break, screen readers assume that they're reading a new alt-text for a new image. And they start whatever they consider an individual image alt-text with something like, "Graphic." Thus, I write all my alt-texts as one single paragraph.

I've learned from another blog post, as well as personal experience with various Fediverse server applications, that alt-texts must never contain the double quotes commonly found on keyboards. Different frontends may misbehave in different ways, some fail very ungracefully. Thus, I no longer use these quotes in my alt-texts.

I've learned from Mastodon that even if there is an image description in the post text, there must always be an accurate and sufficiently detailed image description in the alt-text regardless. Otherwise you risk being sanctioned. I have described all my original images twice ever since: with a long and fully detailed description in the post text and a shorter description in the alt-text.

I've learned from blog posts and websites about alt-texts that text in images must be transcribed verbatim. However, nowhere that I've seen this rule written down, I've seen it mention text that's unreadable in the image while the author knows what's written there. My conclusion is that there is no exception for these texts. I tend to have many such texts. Thus, I transcribe all bits and pieces of text within the borders of my images if I have a way to read them. And I usually have.

I've learned from other blog posts about alt-texts that colours must not only be mentioned in image descriptions, but they must also be described. After all, blind people cannot be expected to know what e.g. Burgundy red is. Also, dimensions must be given not simply in absolute measures, but relatively to what else is in the image or to something that everyone is familiar with, namely the human body. Unfortunately, I've learned that so recently that I only have one original image post in which I make use of these techniques; hence, all my older original image posts count as obsolete.

I've learned from yet elsewhere that races must not be mentioned, and genders must not be assumed. I abide by both when describing meme images. My original images, on the other hand, never contain actual human beings. Whenever I show an avatar, it's always one of my avatars whose gender I have personally defined, and these avatars can't really emulate real-life human phenotypes.

Most of the above has never been taken into consideration by anyone on Mastodon. I'm literally the only one in the Fediverse who takes describing images to such levels.

But I go beyond alt-texts and image descriptions.

I've learned from Mastodon that if there's something, anything in a post of yours that might disturb anyone in some way, the post requires a Mastodon-style content warning that mentions in which way the post is disturbing. Here on Hubzilla, that's a summary. It's the same thing, and Hubzilla had summaries before Mastodon had CWs.

From observing both Mastodon and the Web outside the Fediverse, I've compiled a list of potentially triggering topics. Even excluding national/state/provincial/regional politics, I've gathered 111 of these so far. I do my best to include each one whenever necessary. On top of that, I add CWs for many things I post about because I guess I go onto people's nerves when I post about them (the Fediverse, alt-text, image descriptions, hashtags, character limits, quote-posts, actual quote-posting etc.).

However, Hubzilla is not a Twitter wannabe. It's more like Facebook or blogging software. It only offers a summary (Mastodon: CW) field for posts and DMs, but not for comments (it has two different editors for when you reply and when you don't). I could try to add a summary (Mastodon: CW) using a pair of BBcode tags, and I've done so here, but I know from personal experience that the summary tags do not translate to a Mastodon CW in comments. I'd add an individual CW to each one of my comments, but Mastodon users will neither get an actual CW nor understand that I've tried.

So I double almost all my CW'd topics up with an appropriate set of hashtags. This is in line with the culture where I am: Here on Hubzilla and in its whole software family, we don't force poster-side CWs upon each other. Instead, we have them automatically generated for ourselves, reader-side, tailored to our individual needs. But this requires keywords to trigger the automated hiding of content behind CWs.

Also, I know just what may disturb people. The best example is eye contact. You think that eye contact can only be triggering in full-face portraits of a person looking directly at the viewer? Wrong! It's triggering if there's at least one eye in the image. I've been told that some people in the autistic spectrum can detect an eye in an image if it's only a tiny fraction of a pixel. I have to expect this to extend to other potentially triggering things as well.

Thus, if it's potentially triggering and somewhere within the borders of one of my images, even if it's hardly discernible or completely invisible to the neurotypical, I still consider the whole image potentially triggering, and I treat the image and the whole post as such.

In fact, I've stopped posting potentially triggering images here on Hubzilla altogether. That's because Hubzilla has no way of making Mastodon blank an image out. And not long ago, Mastodon's CWs only hid the post text, but not the images belonging to a post. I can't rule out that certain Mastodon apps still behave this way. So I can't even use CWs to hide a triggering image. This is why I only ever post images on (streams) now: (streams) makes Mastodon blank images out when a post contains one or two certain hashtags.

Again, nobody on Mastodon goes even only nearly that far.

Please tell me in which ways exactly this is still insufficient.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #Hashtag #Hashtags #HashtagMeta #CWHashtagMeta
Netzgemeinde/Hubzilla

@afreytes, 👁️‍🗨️of🇵🇷 @Author-ized L.J. I always use a lot of hashtags. I have to. But many of my hashtags are not to increase discoverability. They're to trigger filtering, including filters that hide my content behind CW buttons. Such filters have been available on Mastodon since October, 2022 and here on Hubzilla (https://hubzilla.org, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubzilla, https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla) since its inception before Mastodon was even made.

This, by the way, is why some of my hashtags start with "CW": They're only there as content warning triggers/content warning substitutes, also because I have no means to add Mastodon-style content warnings to replies. Otherwise this comment would show the following CW on Mastodon:

CW: long (over 4,700 characters), Fediverse meta, Fediverse-beyond-Mastodon meta, hashtag meta, content warning meta, character limit meta

However, unless I explicitly talk about certain hashtags, they all always go into the last line. And I think that even 20 hashtags in the last line of one of my posts or comments make people less uncomfortable than the post or comment exceeding 500 characters or myself talking about the Fediverse, especially talking about the Fediverse not only being Mastodon.

This comment, for example, would get the following hashtags (normally in the last line, but this time I'm talking about them):

  • Hashtags for content over 500 characters:
    • #Long (= this message is over 500 characters long which makes some people uncomfortable)
    • #LongPost (= this message is over 500 characters long which makes some people uncomfortable; two hashtags because I can't know who filters what)
    • #CWLong (= this message is over 500 characters long which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: long")
    • #CWLongPost (= this message is over 500 characters long which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: long"; two hashtags because I can't know who filters what)
  • Hashtags for when I talk about the Fediverse:
    • #FediMeta (= I'm talking about the Fediverse which makes some people uncomfortable)
    • #FediverseMeta (= I'm talking about the Fediverse which makes some people uncomfortable; two hashtags because I can't know who filters what)
    • #CWFediMeta (= I'm talking about the Fediverse which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: Fediverse meta")
    • #CWFediverseMeta (= I'm talking about the Fediverse which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: Fediverse meta"; two hashtags because I can't know who filters what)
  • Hashtags for when I talk about hashtags:
    • #Hashtag (= I'm talking about hashtags; also for discovery)
    • #Hashtags (= I'm talking about hashtags; also for discovery; two hashtags because I can't know who follows/searches for the singular and who follows/searches for the plural)
    • #HashtagMeta (= I'm talking about hashtags and what I think about them which makes some people uncomfortable)
    • #CWHashtagMeta (= I'm talking about hashtags and what I think about them which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: hashtag meta")
  • Hashtags for when I talk about content warnings:
    • #CW (= I'm talking about content warnings; also for discovery)
    • #CWs (= I'm talking about content warnings; also for discovery; two hashtags because I can't know who follows/searches for/filters the singular and who follows/searches for/filters the plural)
    • #ContentWarning (= I'm talking about content warnings; also for discovery; multiple hashtags because I can't know who follows/searches for/filters what)
    • #ContentWarnings (= I'm talking about content warnings; also for discovery; multiple hashtags because I can't know who follows/searches for/filters what)
    • #CWMeta (= I'm talking about content warnings and what I think about them which makes some people uncomfortable)
    • #ContentWarningMeta (= I'm talking about content warnings and what I think about them which makes some people uncomfortable; also for discovery; multiple hashtags because I can't know who filters what)
  • Hashtags for when I talk about character limits:
    • #CharacterLimit (= I'm talking about character limits; also for discovery)
    • #CharacterLimits (= I'm talking about character limits; also for discovery; two hashtags because I can't know who follows/searches for the singular and who follows/searches for the plural)
    • #CharacterLimitMeta (= I'm talking about character limits and what I, as someone with over 16.7 million characters, think about them which makes some people uncomfortable)
    • #CWCharacterLimitMeta (= I'm talking about character limits and what I, as someone with over 16.7 million characters, think about them which makes some people uncomfortable; hashtag version of "CW: character limit meta")
Hubzilla Fediverse Server and Community

Just the other day, I found something out. Something very inconvenient about Misskey and maybe also the Forkeys.

It should be commonly known that Misskey has a local limit of 3,000 characters for posts (which it refers to as "notes"). What is not so well-known is that Misskey has a limit of about 8,000 characters, probably 8,192 or so, for inbound messages, ironically fewer than this post is long. Also, it has a limit of 512 characters for alt-text, both locally and in-bound.

Mastodon has a character limit for in-bound content, too, at least for Note-type objects (not for Article-type objects because it refuses to render them fully and links to the original instead). To my best knowledge, it rejects messages with over 100,000 characters. As for its 1,500-charater limit for alt-text, it enforces that by truncating alt-text that's longer.

Misskey, in contrast, truncates everything that exceeds its limits while still letting it in. If your post is longer than the inbound limit of ca. 8,000, all excess characters are chopped off and thrown away. If your alt-text is longer than 512 characters, all excess characters are chopped off and thrown away.

I don't know which Forkey behaves how in this regard, seeing as all Forkeys I know about have a configurable local post character limit that can be adjusted to well over 8,000. But even if the inbound limit is configurable, too, I don't think any *key admin cranks it over 60,000 or over 70,000 or over 100,000. It's simply unimaginable that someone, anyone, could ever post that much at once if your idea of the Fediverse is pure microblogging.

Also, I don't know what *key users do when they come across a truncated post or what blind or visually-impaired *key users do when they come across a truncated alt-text. Do they even suspect that it's a truncated copy of something that's longer at its source and then go check the source? Either way, it's very inconvenient.

It's especially inconvenient for me. My longest posts by a gigantic margin are image posts with original images. They always have a long image description block in the post itself that tends to be tens of thousands of characters long. It contains highly detailed visual descriptions of all images in the post. It contains all explanations necessary to understand the post, the images and the descriptions. It contains verbatim transcripts of all bits of text within the borders of the image that I can read, no matter whether or not my audience can.

In addition, each image has a shorter description in the alt-text, along with a bit that announces the long description, including where to find it. I even used to explain how to get to that description for Mastodon users for whom the summary and content warning hides the post text, but not the images, depending on which Mastodon version and frontend they use. This alone took up several hundred characters in the alt-text. All in all, I got to a point in which my alt-texts always ended up either at precisely 1,500 characters or just a few characters short.

I myself am not really bound to character limits. I used to post images here on Hubzilla where I have over 16.7 million characters for the post, including all alt-texts. Now I post them on (streams) where I have over 24 million characters. I could theoretically write alt-texts as long as I want to, seeing as, unlike on Mastodon, they aren't separate text fields; instead, they're being woven into the image-embedding markup code in the post text.

Still, I stick to a maximum of 1,500 characters for alt-text to keep Mastodon from truncating it. If you post images into the Fediverse, the main audience for your alt-text is on Mastodon, and most of them don't understand that there's something, anything, out there in the Fediverse that does not work exactly like Mastodon. And 1,500 characters can be tight already.

But if I have to stay within Misskey's limits, I can hardly post images anymore. At least not with appropriate descriptions and explanations.

Since late 2024, I have been working on-and-off on a series of fairly simple avatar portraits or rather their image descriptions. The idea is for the long description to consist of a preamble that starts with a general summary, followed by explanations, then followed by visual descriptions of what all images in the post have in common. Next come the individual descriptions of each image. Each post shall have three or four images with three or four portraits each, all in the same pose, all with only minor differences in outfits, all with a neutral, bright white background.

In addition, of course, each image shall have an alt-text, and none of the alt-texts shall depend on each other.

Now, the problem is that I have to describe three or four individual portraits in each alt-text. I'm actually struggling to squeeze such a description plus the note that announces the long description into 1,500 characters, especially if I want to fulfill Veronica Lewis a.k.a. Veronica With Four Eyes' requirements for outfit descriptions to a tee in the alt-text as well (https://veroniiiica.com/how-to-write-alt-text-for-casual-outfits/, https://veroniiiica.com/writing-image-descriptions-for-red-carpet-outfits/; see also https://veroniiiica.com/how-to-write-alt-text-image-descriptions-visually-impaired/ and https://veroniiiica.com/how-to-create-visual-descriptions/).

But in 512 characters so that even Misskey users won't get a severely truncated version? This is absolutely impossible. Even if I limit the long description announcement to some 100 characters, even if I didn't walk people through how to get to the long description, I'd have fewer than 140 characters on average to describe each individual outfit.

The long description won't fare any better. Currently, the preamble starts with some 14,000 characters of explanations, most of which are necessary to understand the visual descriptions. But when Misskey goes and truncates the post at the 8,000-something mark, Misskey users won't even get to any visual description because all visual descriptions would be chopped off.

What makes matters worse is that the preamble grows the longer, the easier to understand I make it and the less I leave people with unexplained technical or jargon terms which you shouldn't use in image descriptions at all anyway. So the next time I go through it and rewrite it to make it easier to understand, I'll also make it even longer than it already is.

But what if I simply cut all the explanations? For one, I'd leave people to their own devices to understand extremely obscure niche content. They won't. My explanations aren't 14,000 characters long because I've artificially inflated them, but because there is so much to know before you understand the post and the images and the descriptions.

Besides, the visual descriptions alone won't fit into 8,192 characters either. What I currently have is over 5,000 characters of common visual description for all portraits in all images plus about 2,500 characters of individual visual description for the three portraits in the first image. That's over 7,500 characters altogether already. And I still have to describe nine portraits in another three images. The post will end up with some 15,000 characters of visual descriptions unless they grow longer when I simplify them again.

I guess users of Misskey or any Forkey will still have to put up with truncated alt-texts and truncated long descriptions in the future. But my future image posts will contain a paragraph at the beginning that explains that the post and/or the alt-text may be truncated on Misskey and the Forkeys, and that both are uncut at the source. Still, this means that *key users will have to put up with the extra hassle of opening my original post at a source with a quite cumbersome UI. And I've got my doubts that this UI is really accessible.

Unfortunately, this also means that *key users won't get any hashtags along with these posts. But then again, the handling of Identi.ca-style/Friendica-style hashtags with the number sign outside the link is broken on all *keys and will remain so for the foreseeable future.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Calckey #Firefish #Sharkey #CherryPick #Iceshrimp #Iceshrimp-JS #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #CharacterLimit #CharacterLimits #CharacterLimitMeta #CWCharacterLimitMeta #A11y #Accessibility
How To Write Alt Text For Casual Outfits | Veroniiiica

How to write image descriptions and alt text for casual outfits and fashion posts on blogs and social media

Veroniiiica