Mastodawn

Pete Prodoehl 🍕2d ago

We have received a Copyright claim from Amazon for our @peertube instance videos.trom.tf/ . Hetzner, the hosting company where we have the dedicated server at, gave us 24h to resolve it.

The problem?

The video in question, a documentary about "aliens", a garbage piece of content, was NOT hosted on our instance, of course. But since Peertube is federated the idiots sent the claim to our hosting company. Even if UNDER the video you can see that video is "Posted By:" and the instance and username. It takes a few seconds to see where the video is hosted.

But who cares...maybe Amazon has "AI Agents" employed and they simply find a video of theirs on a URL and see the IP of that URL and submit a Copyright claim to the hosting where that domain is registered?!

Bunch of idiots.

But it is very concerning the fact that they can do these and we, the ones who host (and for free for that matter), need to quickly "fix" these things even if the claim has nothing to do with our server.

We eventually had to block that URL, thanks Peertube for allowing that, else these idiots cannot understand that it was not us who were hosting that video.

#peertube #fedi #fediverse

videos.trom.tf

A trade-free video hosting platform for science/technology/nature videos in the English language. You do not have to trade your currency, data, attention, freedom or anything else, in order to use it.

videos.trom.tf

Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️3d ago

@trom @peertube

So first up, I am not a lawyer, even if I play one on TV. Seems to me though that even if you didn't post the video, that if your server is seeding it, then technically you, among others, *are* hosting it?

Surely in this case though you could comply just by defederating that particular piece of content / user?

It's interesting though that Amazon are recognizing Peertube content, even if just for copyright. That to me suggests they're keeping an eye on it, even if they likely don't consider it a major threat... yet.

#Peertube #Amazon #Copyright

@peertube @Blort Well we are not seeding it, only displaying it. For those who somehow search from our instance that particular content.

@Blort
> if your server is seeding it, then technically you, among others, *are* hosting it?

I don't think that's how @peertube works. Remote videos are discoverable by searching on a PT service, but it's the viewer that's seeding them by watching (because WebTorrent), not the PT service providing the search results.

You're right that copyright lawyers and often judges haven't cared much about such nuances though, or we would have won the CopyWars.

@trom I feel like posting the video as a video comment on an Amazon product.

FinchHaven sfba 3d ago

"The video in question, a documentary about "aliens", a garbage piece of content, was NOT hosted on our instance, of course"

As other have said (and may yet say) IANAL

*That said* there is a vast difference between "hosted on" and "served from"

Your instance may *not* be the sole source for that content, but if a video consumer *gets* it though you, guess what?

It doesn't matter what "makes sense"

This is law, and lawyer-speak

Good luck with it

cc @[email protected]

@FinchHaven It is ridiculous to act as if the content is "on your server" and you have to deal with it. If it is federated, go after the source. Else you swift the responsibility on the TV if one watches "pirated" content on "it".

FinchHaven sfba 3d ago

What you "like" or "think should happen" is utterly irrelevant

And you clearly don't understand the usage of the word "Federated"

Which is super common around here

Being federated makes *every* federated instance the [a] source

There is no one single point source -- the sources are all federated into multi-point "sources"

@FinchHaven If you make the instances that "display" a piece of remote content, liable for the content, you are destroying the internet itself. I cannot be responsible for a remote content. Federation cannot work if this is the case. It is utterly insane to do that. It is like making your Browser responsible for the content people display on it.

Maddad ☑️3d ago

@trom @FinchHaven

That's a good analogy re the browser...👍

jeSuisatire neindochohh ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ 2d ago

@maddad
If a forum page embeds a YT video isn't it displaying just a link?

Anyway, if we become relevant they will drown us in lawsuits, not because their claims are reasonable but because we can't afford the lawyers to prove that.

That's how the justice system works.

I guess only #EFF could solve this by defending some cases to establish a rule of law.

@trom @FinchHaven

@FinchHaven @trom

The way Peertube federates is different from how Mastodon does its federation. As long as the video in question is not stored on your server and is just streamed from a different instance then that instance should be contacted for the removal - that's what any competent lawyer would do. But now what they've achieved is merely made us put up a curtain to hide the video from their view, a video that still exists on the original instance and free for anyone to watch.

(1/2)

@FinchHaven
> And you clearly don't understand the usage of the word "Federated"

You probably intended this as a nonchalant segue into your next point (I've done this). But FYI it comes across as quite patronising and out of context. @trom is hosting a PeerTube server. Chances are they have a pretty good understanding of the range of things "federated" can mean in this context.

(2/2)

You're not wrong that a lawyer might see a search result as a 'source' for copyright purposes. This is exactly what they've done with TPB et al. But ...

@FinchHaven
> federated makes *every* federated instance the [a] source

On Mastodon et al, yes. Because text posts are automatically delivered in full to everyone following the account that posted it. But PeerTube doesn't work that way, it just sends a title and a link to followers (or the wasted storage and bandwidth would be extreme).

RodolfoRG 2d ago

@trom @FinchHaven I think this is like the gray area of Torrent file server. It does nota host the file itself, only points where to get from

Birdhouse in Your [Redacted]3d ago

@trom @peertube definitely sounds like everyone is an idiot but you ✅

@peertube @coolandnormal Right?! :)

@trom
Well. I think this is analogous for holding torrent tracker owners liable for torrent content.

The contents of torrents tracked by a tracker never go even near the tracker. The tracker only helps leechers find seeders. But still, somehow, magically, the tracker owner is doing the copyright infringement.
@peertube

@trom @peertube

Gossi the dog had a similar issue, but from a Microsoft linked company.

Reponse was to reply to the email saying we are launching at you hete on the internet. Because Microsoft don't understand how the internet works, then a link to the discussion thread.

Father Hardstone 2d ago

@trom @peertube could have said all this without labeling it as 'garbage'

@harib_murshidi @trom @peertube

I'm guessing it was probably some conspiracy theorist nonsense about aliens, or else he wouldn't describe a documentary as garbage.

People watch documentaries to learn about something real and true, but if it's full of misinformation then it is not only a garbage film but also harmful to society.

@peertube @harib_murshidi Yah it is this documentary en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Age_… .... we don't need more confusion and nonsense in this already upsidedown society.

The Age of Disclosure - Wikipedia

@trom @peertube
Despite any right or wrong. That's how power works. And the fediverse is not save from oligarchs and/or their power.
We should keep this in mind. And hopefully find a way to avoid such threats somehow.

No one/admin can risk any lawsuit were the other side is something like A.

@trom @peertube This story is dumb, but the first thing I saw on PeerTube cracked me up https://peertube.tv/w/cFBgusJfcLw6yUfE7j1nLt

ASMR windows screensaver going fast to relax you faster

PeerTube

@trom @peertube we have recived insane amounts of false / fake takedown notices. While in the US his is illegal and you can sue (and even get ppl in jail for this) in Europe this is not illegal. There is nothing you can do about.
If Hetzner causes you issues DM me i am sure we can find an easy solution.

@peertube @frelsisbaratta Thank you! I saved your contact and will DM you if I need to. Much appreciated!

DFX4509B (Joshua Mason)2d ago

@peertube @trom I hope this doesn't mean PeerTube is going the way of YT where you don't own your content anymore, because a big part of PeerTube is actually owning your content and not being at the mercy of an evil megacorporation.