Anyway, @zkat warned us. Talking about whether or not AI "works" was a trap, and always was. The ethical component is all that matters, and from that analysis alone, the onus is on all of us to reject and oppose AI.

Getting mired into whether or not it "works" is bad praxis in several ways: it de-emphasizes the ethics, it opens up to goalpost shifting about what it means for AI to "work," and it's easier for the boosters to Gish gallop or overwhelm with jargon.

@xgranade One reason many people want to avoid the ethical arguments is because many people won't actually take any action based on ethics. They may claim to have ethics, perhaps even the same ethics you do, but actually changing behavior, holding others accountable, organizing etc. simply doesn't happen.

These things only happen if other considerations come into play.

I don't know how to save our democracy/civilization/biosphere if we can't get people to act on ethics.