Brian Hartgen5d ago
Hi everyone.
Today I officially ordered the BrailleNote Evolve. I'm very much looking forward to learning all about it. Not sure when I will get it yet.
Also, I set up a passkey with 1Password for the first time. Now that's an easy way to log into a site!
It is now officially the Easter break. In addition to remembering what the holiday is all about, it will be a good time to relax. Have a good day!
Show threadQuin
@brian_hartgen I'm curious why you went with the Humanware offering over the BrailleSense? Not trying to start an argument or debate, but I personally preordered the BS7 and am incredibly excited for it. The evolve seems like a very cool device, but I'm not sure how much I'd get out of something like KeySoft as a power user and other than KS it's just a 6+grand screenless laptop with a kinda meh feeling qwery keyboard, although way better than the monarch, mid-level battery life for a windows laptop, and all an all-plastic shell. This is far from just a Humanware thing, I wish these AT companies would make their flagship products, worth 6+ grand, out of metal instead of plastic. Honestly if Humanware had the qwerty ready at csun and not just a dummy model they might've got me, but I don't want to code on a braille keyboard or have 40 cells. Once again not trying to start any arguments here, but I'm curious what you see yourself using your Evolve for? I plan on basically entirely replacing my phone and tablets with the BrailleSense, but everyone uses their notetakers differently.
Apr 4 at 2:13pmWeb
Show threadBrian Hartgen3d ago

@TheQuinbox There's a great deal more that I could do with the Evolve. I use the BrailleSense only as a pen and paper substitute for working with notes. I have to use Google Drive to transfer those notes. That's all I do with it. Added to all of that, a lot of the prompts for dialogs etc on the BrailleSense are full of broken English. It doesn't seem to matter how frequently you point out the errors.

With the Evolve, I will be able to have JAWS on there, all my productivity scripts, together with regular apps such as WhatsApp and 1Password that I already know. Even Fast-SM which I am using now. I like the thought of a unit running Windows with an integrated Braille display.
Keysoft doesn't interest me especially. The first thing I'll do is remove NVDA and put JAWS on there.
In summary, for me it was time for a change. I have the BrailleSense system now for six years. I don't like Android apps. Windows is what I know.

Show threadQuin3d ago
@brian_hartgen Totally fair, personal preference and all. I've been a die-hard android user for years, and the thought of a cute little braille tablet with a display, nice keyboard, replaceable battery, and the ability to remotely control my computer through NVDA Remote in addition to my Pixel phone is super attractive to me. Can't say I've seen the bad english anywhere, the only bit I did see on the bs7 was it said "gesture on" and "gesture off" instead of "gestures on" and "gestures off", and that doesn't bug me much, especially since I saw selvas fix stuff like that on the SensePlayer when I first got it. In any case thanks for engaging with me, power users who use braille notetakers outside of the school environment are rare but they always fascinate me because I'm one myself.
Show threadAndrew Hodgson3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen If I were to buy something it would be the BrailleNote as I see more of an upgrade path with Windows rather than Android. If history is anything to go by the BrailleSense devices only seem to get one or two Android upgrades through the lifespan of the product, then you're trading in the unit for the next one. The price of the notetaker even sans Braille display is still too high for most people to do that often.
Show threadQuin3d ago
@andrew @brian_hartgen I think that's a bit unfair, so far Selvas has only put out one Braille notetaker that they claimed would get Android updates, and it's gotten one so far and they're going to continue supporting it. A great example is the BrailleSense U2, the last update for which was released in late 2020. Granted, that ran Windows CE, not Android, so they had maximum control over the hardware and it wasn't left up to Google/etc how long they can update it. I agree that generally speaking the upgrade path is better on Windows than Android, but personally the HumanWare software just doesn't interest me as much. I get a notetaker to be a fast, efficient little productivity device, and IMO Humanware sorta lost that feeling somewhere around the touch, while HIMS has kept it. If I got an evolve, it would be my Windows laptop, but that's it. That's okay, but I don't want my notetaker to be that. I get why people would, but it's just not how I work.
Show threadAndrew Hodgson3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen The BS6 was the second Android device wasn't it? I thought they had done one before called the Polaris? I get what you're saying about the difference between a Windows laptop and a notetaker, its why I use a VarioUltra as it provides a quick way of getting a Braille output device for document reading and simple word processing.
Show threadAndrew Hodgson3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen On another tack though I still wonder if schools will opt for the BS7 over the BrailleNote as its a more locked down package. Wonder how many people in the UK have ordered a BrailleNote, I bet Brian is one of the first. Apparently I was one of the first people to get a BrailleNote Classic back in 2000 when I went to univercity.
Show threadaaron3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen The Braillesense 7 is a seriously interesting device. I can see a lot of uses for it outside of a school environment, considering I already do most of my work from my phone. I do wonder if that workflow would be improved or not by a BrailleSense
Show threadQuin3d ago
@fireborn @brian_hartgen I'm going to wager that mine will be, I love physical buttons, which is one of the main reasons I love the SensePlayer, bu tno Google services hinders it a bit.
Show threadaaron3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen I do wonder how possible it would be to install Google play services on it. I think the braille sense does have the play store, right?
Show threadQuin3d ago
@fireborn @brian_hartgen Yeah, the BrailleSense is a full Google-certified device. A fully functional Android tablet that lets you even put Termux on it. The NVDA remote client really interests me too.
Show threadaaron3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen Is this an NVDA remote client for the BrailleSense, or another one? As far as I know, the BrailleSense has extremely odd keyboard handling, at least the BrailleSense6 does. Using an accessibility service to intercept the keyboard, or a USB keyboard, doesn't work reliably.
Show threadQuin3d ago
@fireborn @brian_hartgen It's for the BrailleSense, and it literally comes with a QWERTY keyboard in the case, so I'd hope the handling isn't bad, lol.
Show threadaaron3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen I can only comment from trying the BrailleSense 6. The QWERTY keyboard handling was... extremely quirky and non-standard.
Show threadQuin3d ago
@fireborn @brian_hartgen I thought I saw them mention in release notes somewhere that they majorly improved this, but maybe that was for the SensePlayer. In any case the one on the bs7 seemed very nice.
Show threadaaron3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen Unfortunately I don't have the disposable income to purchase a Braillesense 7 at the moment, though I do find it an interesting device. The BrailleNote evolve is also interesting, especially if the Optima actually comes out eventually. I do wonder how they will stack up.
Show threadJeffrey D. Stark3d ago
@TheQuinbox @fireborn @brian_hartgen i think it's android based? keyboard nav on an android OS is always a little non-standard
Show threadaaron3d ago
@JStark @TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen Keyboard input on Android is actually pretty uniform. Some manufacturers change handlers, and apps can do their own thing. Input methods are their own circle of hell, with certain IMs (gboard) overriding physical keyboard settings and intercepting keys. When you get to the core of it though and don't use an IM with those abstractions, it's pretty straight-forward.
Show threadYadiel Sotomayor3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen I’m fascinated by this conversation. I struggled to find a reason why I should bother with a note taker…, that’s why I’m super excited for the evolve. I’ll be curious to hear peoples experiences with this new generation of no takers. Maybe it’ll convince me to buy one.
Show threadArfy3d ago
@TheQuinbox @brian_hartgen I'm in a similar boat. i love that we're now getting so much choice in the braille space, but I, too, just don't vibe with android, and I saw my housemate have a bad experience with her senseplayer a couple of years ago, it literally just stopped working out of the blue. Nothing worked. pulling battery, connect to USB via a computer, nothing. I intend to use the evolve as my main windows computer replacement, so I'll definitely be putting it through its paces. Oh yeah, and i work for humanware, too, so I might just be a little biased. But if i get the chance to see a braillesense 7? I'll absolutely play!