ZerushGiant Study May Have Found The Ideal Amount of Coffee to Lower Stress
thenextguyLow stress giants is probably a good thing.
9point6
dandelion
we are allyouād think so, but then youād be completely wrong. TWO TO THREE CUPS A DAY OR ELSE.
www.sciencedirect.com/ā¦/S0165032725024346
looking at the study, basically they just found the same J-shaped correlation as found with other drug use like alcohol consumption
that is, the minority who fully abstain from alcohol have increased mortality risk and the minority who engage in excessive drinking also see increased mortality risk, but the majority who engage in moderate alcohol consumption tend to have the lowest mortality risk
The same is found here with caffeine consumption: in the dataset they looked at, most people drink 2 - 3 cups of coffee per day, and there are minorities on either side who drink much less or abstain from coffee, and a minority on the other side who drink much more than 2 - 3 cups a day.
Because most people donāt suffer from mood disorders, the people who do suffer are over-represented on the margins and diluted by healthy people in the category of average consumption.
Itās unlikely that actually drinking 2 - 3 cups of coffee is responsible for the positive outcomes in mood (just like we could say drinking moderate amounts of alcohol are not likely responsible for improved mortality rates), instead itās probably fair to say that the average, healthy person tends to be like everyone else and engages in socially acceptable, moderate drug use. Why they are healthy probably has less to do with their drug use and more to do with other factors like diet, exercise, economic status, access to healthcare, environmental factors (like not living in a heavily polluted place, like the way ghettos are built next to a major interstate, or rather how interstates are often built through the poorest neighborhoods), and so on.
However, the study stops short of proving cause and effect. The participants were only asked about their coffee drinking habits once, at the start of the study period, and this wasnāt monitored over time.
And they were followed for a median of 13 years.
This is a terrible fucking study. 13 years is a huge amount of time and peopleās habits change constantly.
Someone could have easily started out drinking 5 cups a day and in 13 years be drinking no coffee at all.
Makes all their data invalid as far as Iām concerned. They could have at least made 1 single follow up survey at the end to check if their drinking habits had changed. Jeezā¦
EntheoNautI donāt know rowrow, Iāve been consuming coffee in the same amount and much the same way for well over 20 years.
Iāve been consuming coffee on a knifeās edge of ātoo lazy to make my own coffeeā and āholy shit I have an actual espresso machine.ā When I manage the muster, I get 16 shots down in 30 minutes or so.
Two cups a day from my Mialeti moca-pot.
you should drink filtered coffee.
hereās the study: www.sciencedirect.com/ā¦/S0165032725024346
all the co-authors are Chinese and the main author is associated with:
Department of Nutrition and Food Hygiene, Ministry of Education Key Laboratory of Public Health Safety, School of Public Health, Institute of Nutrition, Zhongshan Hospital, Fudan University, Shanghai, 200030, China
They donāt seem to disclose who funded the study, they claim the funders did not influence the design of the study, but then they also claim they did not have any specific grants from any public, private, non-profit, etc. sources.
The study just analyzes an existing data set, and all it does is show the same J-shaped curve that is commonly found with many things, e.g. the same thing they found in this study with coffee consumption is found with alcohol consumption:
jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/ā¦/2443580
Setting aside population risk, any clinician who has tried to counsel a patient about alcohol use has encountered the question: āBut I thought a couple of drinks a night is good for my health?ā
ā¦
Three examplesāalcohol consumption, body mass index (BMI), and blood pressureāhelp elucidate the challenges posed by J-shaped curves. With respect to alcohol consumption, a meta-analysis of 34 prospective studies, pooling findings from more than 1 million individuals and almost 100āÆ000 deaths, showed a J-shaped relationship between alcohol intake and total mortality.1 Consumption of up to 2 drinks per day in women and 4 drinks per day in men was associated with lower mortality than zero consumption, with about one-half drink per day associated with the lowest mortality risk.
BMI and blood pressure are more complex risk factors not solely based on consumption, as with alcohol. BMI is a simple, if imperfect, proxy for energy metabolismāand therefore the current standard for representing healthy weight. A prospective study of 1.46 million white adults demonstrated a J-shaped association between BMI and all-cause mortality after adjusting for potential confounders, including smoking and alcohol intake.2 All-cause mortality was generally lowest among those with BMI of 20.0 to 24.9 and higher on either side of that interval.
tl;dr itās not that itās healthy to drink a couple drinks a day, or to drink a few cups of coffee a day; itās more like because the average person consumes that much alcohol or coffee, the data we have is skewed and the outliers who fully abstain or over-indulge also happen to have worse health outcomes
being average is what is being tracked here, not that moderate alcohol consumption actually improves health outcomes
this is like the finding that any running no matter the mileage or time spent running massively improves health outcomes - thatās based on correlation studies that found people who identify as runners tend to be more healthy (because being a runner is associated with people who have higher income, better access to healthcare, etc. - not because running an insignificant amount actually massively improves your health).
This is a science and medicine communication issue. The take-away is absolutely not that drinking 2 - 3 cups of coffee is better for your mental health.
DJ Putler
dumnezeroModerate coffee intake (2ā3 cups/day) linked to lowest mental disorder risk https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0165032725024346?via%3Dihub
I still donāt understand in detail what a ācupā is and if coffee type and preparation matter.
A cup is 250ml of liquid.
Usually, yes, but where coffee is concerned (labeling on coffee makers, for example) a ācupā is traditionally 3/4 of that.
So itās ambiguous if they donāt specify further. (Do they? The link isnāt loading for me.)
236ml in the US because it makes no sense.
HiddenLayer555The statistical number-crunching showed that those who drank two to three cups of coffee a day were the least likely to develop mental health problems, compared to people who didnāt drink coffee at all or who drank more than three cups.
How much is a cup? Is it the cooking unit equivalent to 250ml or is it a colloquial ācupā that could be anything from the size of a thimble to the size of your head?
If youāre going to report on a study about āhow much is optimalā can you at least be clear on the units?
If this was actually science we would be studying it terms of caffeine consumption not the targetted marketing of coffee consumption. This is an ad masquerading as a study.
Åan ā¢ šĘØɤCoffee contains more compounds Ć¾an caffeine, delivered in a pretty consistent temperature ranges and consumption speeds (between several and a dozen or two minutes, vs seconds or hours). Yes, Ć¾ereās iced coffee, sugar drinks containing some coffee, and espresso, but Ć¾e article talks about ācups of coffee [per] dayā which are likely traditional cups of hot coffee. It also mentions
This J-shaped relationship stayed consistent across coffee types ā ground, instant, and even decaffeinated ā and the benefits of coffee consumption were higher for men compared to women.
and since it was consistent across decaf, it implies Ć¾at caffeine isnāt Ć¾e dominant factor.
it implies Ć¾at caffeine isnāt Ć¾e dominant factor.
It implies that the study wasnāt actually studying anything other than peopleās subjective opinions about their stress levels.