Lucie / minuteidea i wish i had time for: a little pcb that converts any old computer (8/16/32bit) into a network terminal UI to interface with any modern CRUD/database/API (i imagine a library of community developed software adapters that run on that pcb or on a server), so any old machine could be used for speedy data lookup/entry.
parts of this already exist of course, for all retro platforms there are serial- or bus-to-net/wifi adapters, there are BBS style gateways for the web, frogfind etc. but i don't know of a toolkit to make these talk to something like inventree over API
the most comfy way would be if the thing would bring its own ROM with the software that's needed, and which renders the (T)UI. for c64 this would be an expansion port cartridge, for amiga zz9000 could easily do this, on PCs it could be an ISA/PCI card, for classic Mac NuBus etc
the only downside is that the old machines use a lot more power than modern laptops/tablets, especially the CRTs, and they take more space. so you'd need to do a calculation of electricity cost and CO2 exhaust of keeping an old machine running vs the cost of trashing it and using a new machine
invernomut0@mntmn I don’t think that even some years of a digital device consuming 5kWh/day can offset the amount of CO2 necessary to dispose and recycle an old device and allow production of a new one.
@invernomut0 right, that's also my feeling
tehfishman@mntmn @invernomut0 But the vibes would be unassailable.
tom jenningsI think some measurement is called for...
5kwh a day to me sounds like a 1960s rack mounted minicomputer. A 1984 ibm pc xt i would guess would be more like one ampere/120v (US) or 100 wh. Monitor might be the same consumption.
A modern laptop is 1 to 10 wh range.
I could not find a line power ampere rating online, easily, and i don't have one to measure with my Kill-A-watt.
@tomjennings @mntmn I assumed 150W consumption for an old PC plus 50W for the CRT monitor for 24h I think it’s about 5kWh. If we account for just 8 hours it’s 1.5kw that is 547 kW/year. Taking the emissions for kWh here (0.22kg / kWh) we get 120kg of CO2 per year. Searching the carbon footprint of a laptop seems to be around 200kg for a dell laptop. Thus it seems to be about 2years of typical usage for an energy hungry pc.
It also depends on how clean is the energy you use to power it.
It also depends on how clean is the energy you use to power it.
Right! Sorry, I was reading "5KWh" as ongoing rate, not daily sum. You are of course correct.
Joaquín Cuéllar@mntmn well what are we really saying when talking about energy?
Only the plug current?
The petrol and water needed for designing , making and transportation of new hardware?
The minerals extraction? The wars related to this? The ecological damage?
Now there are less manufacturers than before, achieving competitive top edge technology. This is more closed source firmware, less social justice, more techno-billioners... This count as energy?
Truly it's a debate
Only the plug current?
The petrol and water needed for designing , making and transportation of new hardware?
The minerals extraction? The wars related to this? The ecological damage?
Now there are less manufacturers than before, achieving competitive top edge technology. This is more closed source firmware, less social justice, more techno-billioners... This count as energy?
Truly it's a debate
@gentooza in terms of energy, lets only look at the running cost, and lets assume green energy. in terms of CO2, i think there should be calculators for new devices (i'm sure they're not perfect, but can maybe give an indication).
Sam Tygier@mntmn Dell publish LCAs for most of their machines (https://www.dell.com/en-uk/lp/dt/product-carbon-footprints). There is a bit of a spread but you could consider production of a modern laptop in the 100-400 kg CO2e range.
https://www.eea.europa.eu/en/analysis/indicators/greenhouse-gas-emission-intensity-of-1 has some carbon intensity data (note big variations by country).
If you assume that the old hardware uses 100W more than modern one, for 8 hours a day, at 200g/kWh, you get about 50kg CO2e per year: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=100W+*+8h+*+365+*+200+g/kWh .
https://www.eea.europa.eu/en/analysis/indicators/greenhouse-gas-emission-intensity-of-1 has some carbon intensity data (note big variations by country).
If you assume that the old hardware uses 100W more than modern one, for 8 hours a day, at 200g/kWh, you get about 50kg CO2e per year: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=100W+*+8h+*+365+*+200+g/kWh .
@samtygier thx! that's quite interesting
SoapDog@mntmn couldn’t something pretending to be a serial modem be able to achieve this for all platforms at once? Just using serial comms and ansi escape codes or the equivalent terminal codes for the platform?
@soapdog depends on the system/connection speed. even TUIs are quite slow at low baud rates. also you probably want at least partial unicode (?)
@soapdog (i.e. c64 user port has 9600 baud max iirc, expansion port can do much more of course. amiga serial port i think max 56kbaud?)
@mntmn yeah they can be slow af. I was just wondering about it cause a serial modem is something you can just wip up on a protoboard and is easier to experiment with to test a concept. I think I can build one, but I could never build an internal expansion card, haven't put any points into that skill :3
Might attempt to build the serial version and test it with my eMate 300 =^.^=
i imagine the UI a bit like this, or like old filemaker https://www.visidata.org/
karttu@mntmn Not visidata but similar idea https://unfinishedbitness.info/cubedot/
AndiS 🌞🍷🇪🇺The best starting point would probably something like the https://fujinet.online/ because it enjoys the widest adoption across many retro platforms.
#retrocomputing #fujinet
#retrocomputing #fujinet
@andi right, that was the name, thanks! there's also Plato, not sure if related
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PLATO_(computer_system) - There is a recreation that runs on the FujiNet - so yes there is a relation
kloenk
highvoltage@mntmn Same here. I think I even have some boards that come close. Just a time issue /o\
C.Suthorn 
@[email protected]
The idea is certainly original. But I don’t see the point. 95 per cent of people always have a smartphone with them. The idea could be implemented as software on those. The other 5 per cent of people are either computer-shy or, for other reasons, unable to use a computer. So they wouldn’t benefit from it either. On the other hand, more and more information displays are now appearing at bus stops and train platforms in Germany. These feature an e-paper display in a reinforced casing and a battery that lasts four years. They cost €4,000 each. Building something similar more cheaply using discarded e-paper devices would be a useful project. This would also benefit those who avoid computers, as it has the look and feel of a standard paper notice.