OmegaI want more spaces that don't allow cis men. :/
https://piefed.blahaj.zone/c/womensstuff/p/646180/i-want-more-spaces-that-don-t-allow-cis-men
dandelion (she/her)Yeah, Lemmy seems to have a misogyny problem, and it’s really sad to me, and even seems unnecessary (like, it’s one small step from the community’s otherwise general egalitarian views to also include gender egalitarianism; you would think self-described leftists would be more feminist and less misogynist).
I completely hear you about men being creepy, denying your experience, assuming you know nothing and talking down to you, etc.
I also hear you about how Nazism and other right-wing ideologies attract predominantly men - it’s not just you, it’s actually backed by the data, particularly young women are far more likely to be left-leaning and young men are far more likely to be right-leaning.
I tend to think this has more to do with influencers and who is targeting young men as a demographic than anything inherent in the ideology (though maybe it’s easier to use right-wing arguments to appeal to men’s insecurities and frustrations than left-wing ones, I don’t know). In general I tend to think people are irrational in their religious and political views and find it easy to rationalize acceptance of an ideology or religion that victimizes them (e.g. see women and Christianity).
an aside about trans menI intuitively understand what you’re saying about trans men being better and this being a cis man problem (because I think trans men often can be better, maybe due to their past), but in the end they’re dudes like any other, and there are plenty of toxic trans men. For example, a significant portion of the detransitioners and anti-trans activists are trans men, just off the top of my head: Buck Angel, Chloe Cole, Sage Blair, and Aaron Kimberly are all trans men (or “ex-trans”) who are conservative anti-trans activists. So while my personal experience IRL with trans men are mostly positive, I think we should remain aware that trans men are just as capable of being toxic, and at the end of they day they too are just men.
prettybunnysan aside about trans men
and at the end of they day they too are just men.
huh. well. this is some progressive ass stereotyping lmao
I don’t really want to imply we should stereotype either way (sorta the same with cis men, tbh - there are bad men, there are good men, there are men who are both; I’m not going to pretend it’s not complicated) … but it is a good reminder that trans men are just men and there are plenty of shitty trans men.
I mean the whole point of this is we’re othering men … right
Like. This is a “I dislike the other” post.
I don’t think so, this is more like a venting / frustration post over bad experiences with men, and a statement of relief and gratitude for safe spaces.
You don’t have to twist that into strict “othering”, even if that’s often how that goes in practice.
I would prefer we hold both as true - that we don’t invalidate women’s experiences with men, but that we also recognize that those bad experiences are not absolute or guaranteed with every man. I see no reason we can’t be mature and recognize the compatibility for both truths here.
I don’t intend to say we shouldn’t complain or ought not or that complaining in and of itself id bad, just I find the space to give me the ick when that starts to become the theme. Idk if that makes sense?
Maybe I’m being reactive and being anxious about the discourse changing, but some of the comments in here have given that ick.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to feel anxious about this turning into a toxic space where generalizations and othering are common, because tbh I think that’s usually how it goes. Victims often generalize, I think it’s part of the fear and survival response to constantly be looking for similar patterns and anticipate threats - so to some extent I even think this is hardwired.
Not that every bad interaction with a man results in PTSD-like symptoms or anything, but some of those bad interactions do turn out that way. I’ve been inappropriately touched by a man and once I was in a safe place my body started to shake uncontrollably, and I assume based on that, that I had some kind of trauma response from my experience. I just assume this experience is going to make it harder for me to trust men, esp. men who remind me of the person who victimized me.
I definitely think as a culture we have to find a path to both validate women’s experiences, but also not let that turn into dehumanizing rhetoric based on inappropriate generalization. It’s admittedly hard to do both.