SHOOOOCCCKKKKKKK 🤯

Italy is struggling to get its hydrogen trains working

https://ferrovie.info/treni-reali/treni-a-idrogeno-in-lombardia-rischio-ritardi-fino-al-2028.html

Here’s an idea: put up a WIRE. Or use a battery

We have enough cases from Germany already to know that *even if* these trains run, they won’t run well or economically

Treni a idrogeno in Lombardia: rischio ritardi fino al 2028

Secondo quanto riportato dal Corriere della Sera, il deposito e l’impianto di produzione di idrogeno a Brescia Borgo San Giovanni sarebbero ancora in fase critica e, in assenza di questa infrastruttura, potrebbe...

Ferrovie.Info
Do you know why they went with hydrogen in the first place? Electrification is the place to be for trains for sure.
@bebraw.bsky.social in that particular case, no. But ENI has been pushing it strongly in rail in Italy as they see profit in it.

@jon @bebraw.bsky.social

The gas industry has been lobbying hard for hydrogen power because creating hydrogen via electrolysis is expensive but there’s a lot that’s a byproduct of gas extraction and so once you’ve built the infrastructure you realise that fossil fuels are a much cheaper source of supply than renewables.

This is not true of other forms of electrical power, where gas is one of the most expensive sources and is primarily used because there isn’t yet enough renewable supply.

And you just need to convince politicians that hydrogen is the future to get the investment, and hydrogen sounds exciting and futuristic, whereas power lines are century-old technology.

@david_chisnall @jon @bebraw.bsky.social There's also the point of distribution networks. Hydrogen can be transported and stored in gas pipelines and storage holders. And it can be used in industrial processes. It's easier & cheaper to convert a blast furnace or cement works to hydrogen than to electricity. But this only works economically if other users share the cost of the distribution infrastructure.
If you have to maintain pipelines just for a few industrial customers, the case doesn't work.
The only real benefit I could see for hydrogen is that Africa could produce it abundantly. But why then ship it over here if you could relocate your cement works across the Med?

@jsl @jon @bebraw.bsky.social

Note that hydrogen can’t be transported in existing gas pipelines. The smaller molecules leak a lot more and you get a lot of loss (and, importantly, loss of pressure) over long runs. In the UK, the government is upgrading a load of gas pipes to be able to carry hydrogen because they listened to fossil fuel lobbyists. This is causing road damage in a time when potholes are the number one complaint from voters.

Storage is also a bit tricky. Hydrogen is incredibly corrosive and large-scale storage at the pressures needed to be useful is expensive.

@david_chisnall @jsl @jon hydrogen fuel for vehicles is a complete failure.

The generation in Aberdeen completely broke down, the converted bin lorries were just running on diesel for years and we are now selling off the buses. No one wants this.

After a decade of this, it is a pretty transparent distraction like the tunneling company.