"He squandered a massive landslide from an electorate hungry for change, poured billions of public pounds into private pockets and accelerated the growing gap between rich and poor"
Crow was speaking about Tony Blair. But he could have been talking about Sir Stammer, Albanese in Australia, or in Aotearoa, Jacinda Ardern and Chris Hipkins. Seems there's a pattern here.
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I learned about Bob Crow from the song named after him by Fit and the Conniptions, from their 2017 album Old Blue Witch;
https://bandwagon.fm/677c2a9b5cd233fafccd3b8c
This is a fun album, full of piss and vinegar. Reminding me in parts of the some of David Rovics, especially his more tongue-in-cheek songs like Burn It Down, and rabble-rousing songs like The Commons and Black Flag Flying.
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Bob Crow was a militant trade unionist, which I have huge respect for. He was also into Leninism, which I don't have much time for. But to be fair, in my experience Marxists have often been better at showing solidarity with fellow leftists than other anarchists I've dealt with, and some of my best friends have been active in Marxist-Leninist groups. One or 2 still are.
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@strypey Before the Revolution, Marxist-Leninists will get along with other revolutionaries.
If the Revolution actually happens, they are going to have you shot. Hope you're ok with that.
It happened in Russia and China. There are close parallels in the French Revolution and the 1933 German revolution. The totalitarians eliminate everyone else.
Revolutionaries need to put a LOT more energy into figuring out how to avoid that. The State will fall when it's time. What comes next is harder.
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@mike805
> If the Revolution actually happens, they are going to have you shot
Maybe. But that's a then problem. Being thrown under the bus by other anarchists, or just shadowbanned from the local movement, is a now problem. At least I can count on most Marxists to collaborate pragmatically on areas of common concern in the short term. Other anarchists? Maybe. Often not.
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Take Occupy Civic Square as an example. A few of the local Marxists were involved from the planning stage, and other turned up regularly after it got going. They all engaged respectfully, and did valuable work for the occupation.
A few of the folks from local anarchist groups turned up well into the occupation and did some helpful stuff. Most of them turned up to GAs to lecture us about how we were doing it wrong, then buggered off. I have no time for that self-indulgent crap anymore.
@strypey Isn't that an old joke? If a group of crows is a murder and a group of dogs is a pack, what is a group of anarchists? A void?
From reading, this was a huge problem in the Spanish Civil War. The anarchists could win a battle and take over a town, but then it wasn't clear what to do next.
The Communists and the Falange knew what they wanted to do next: seize state power.
Anarchy paradoxically requires an organization to maintain it. Else gangs form and one of them becomes the state.
@mike805
> Sounds like those were the poser sort of anarchists
They were pretty much all people I've seen doing serious activist and community work at other times. But ironically, only when they could dictate exactly how it was all going to be done ; )
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@mike805
> a lot of decent radicals have had last words like "Wait, I am a loyal Party memb..."
Then there are those like Orwell, who realise they're in a cult and GTFO. This happened to me, except that it wasn't a ML cult I was in, but a Markist-Bakuninist one. I'm more of a Proudhonist than a Marxist; "property is theft", yes, but also, "property is freedom".
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@mike805
> There were several months between the first and second Russian revolutions where it all could have been different
Absolutely. Tim Snyder covered this briefly in his Yale lectures on the history of Ukraine;
https://online.yale.edu/courses/making-modern-ukraine
... and the #PastPresentFuture podcast did a whole episode on it, which you ought to be able to find quotes from with links, by clicking that tag.
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Timothy Snyder, the Richard C. Levin Professor of History and author of Our Malady, On Tyranny, The Road to Unfreedom, Black Earth, and Bloodlands, will make his lectures on The Making of Modern Ukraine available for free to the public within days of delivering them inside the classroom at Yale University. The first lecture will be available on YouTube the week of September 5, 2022. The class syllabus for The Making of Modern Ukraine offers an introduction to this critical course. “Often the most important historical experiences are difficult to see. Ukraine tends to exemplify the major trends in European and world history, but sometimes in forms so intense or radical that they escape notice and classification. Ukraine provides an early example of European state formation and an early example of anti-colonial rebellion.” The course syllabus and reading list can be found here.
@mike805
> this was a huge problem in the Spanish Civil War. The anarchists could win a battle and take over a town, but then it wasn't clear what to do next
That's Stalinist propaganda nonsense. Anarchist trade unions were organising collective productive in Spain decades before the Civil War kicked off. The only reason they lost the revolution was because they didn't expect the Stalinists and Republicans to start killing them, instead of maintaining a united front against the Falange.
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@strypey The "maybe" in your reply is uncommon and good. Most revolutionaries are oblivious to that possibility. And historically, a lot of decent radicals have had last words like "Wait, I am a loyal Party memb..." or "Call the leader, this is a mist..."
Before the next attempt at revolution there needs to be an understanding of the dynamics immediately post-revolution. There were several months between the first and second Russian revolutions where it all could have been different.
Strypey
mike805