ExtremeDullardAmericans Are Leaving the U.S. in Record Numbers
https://piefed.social/c/politics/p/1819063/americans-are-leaving-the-u-s-in-record-numbers
pedzI wonder if just like Brits and French, Unitedstaters emigrating elsewhere will call themselves “expats” instead of immigrants.
We, white people of the west, can go anywhere in the world for work, affordability and/or safety without considering ourselves immigrants.
Many years ago I was chatting with someone from Malmö. He was complaining how immigrants were “taking over his city”. But when I mentioned that I, a Canadian, would also like to move to Sweden, he told me it would be fine, that he would not consider me “an immigrant” because I’m from the west.
Anyway, I understand why anyone would want to leave. It’s just that it seems the vocabulary used is different for different people.
I’m an American immigrant in Germany. It’s infuriating how many Germans complain to me about immigrants, then when hearing that I’m an immigrant, wave their hand and say I’m not like the others. I’m now a German teacher and married to a German, so they’ve always got plausible deniability that it’s about language or integration, but I wasn’t always good at German and I only met my husband after a few years here. It used to be much more fun to push back on why.
PlaidBaronTry immigrating to Canada from the US. Nobody here would ever consider me a ‘true’ immigrant, even though that is quite literally what I am.
I moved for school and never came back. All my family and personal ties were left behind in the states. Except for my family and the annoying need to file taxes every year for some fucking reason, I have no ties left to the US.
But Im white and culturally similar enough that the label ‘immigrant’ would feel funny to people here. It really is wacky.
Why pay taxes? Is it an extraditable offense?
mercYou have to file taxes with the US, most people with US citizenship living outside the US don’t actually have to pay anything.
As for why to keep filing:
- renouncing your citizenship is difficult and expensive
- it’s hard to avoid the US
Let’s say you have no plans to ever live in the US again. Does that mean you never want to visit friends or family you left behind? Does that mean you’ll never go to a sporting event, concert or professional conference in the US ever again? If you’re flying internationally, will you always be willing to pay extra and do extra work to avoid being on a plane that makes a stopover in the US?
For most people it’s a few hours of work, and/or a hundred bucks or so once per year to keep their options open and avoid major headaches.
Thanks for the well laid out response. I learned a lot, and my assumption on renouncing citizenship were along the same lines as:
Yeah, it’s more: “Oh, you want to renounce? Guess we better audit your last 5 years of tax returns with a fine-toothed comb.” In addition, you have to do two separate interviews with US officials, plus pay a $2.5k USD fee. Plus, you might be hit with an exit tax if you have any wealth – and that includes retirees who are counting on using that wealth for their retirement.
If you’re flying internationally, will you always be willing to pay extra and do extra work to avoid being on a plane that makes a stopover in the US?
Yes. All the yes. Sod all legal rights when in an airport. Not worth the risk.
You aren’t a Turk?
Daaamn. You moved to a foreign country and became a teacher of their language in said country? Jesus that’s an almost pornographic level of integration. Almost like a flex.
I was German club president in high school and I could not even fathom doing this. Kudos.
I mean, to be fair, it’s not German literature, I’m teaching German as a second language. I’m a big proponent of dual native/nonnative language teaching, because native speakers (almost) always know what’s right and nonnative speakers (almost) always know why. I think of it like having a math teacher who’s a prodigy vs one who struggled with math- both are useful to have for different reasons.
My German’s not perfect, but it’s very good (C2) and it’s good enough to teach new speakers, I just let them know that I also make mistakes.
quick_snailYour associate is racist. You should tell them.
that he would not consider me “an immigrant” because I’m from the west.
I’ve lived in 7 countries - and still living in a foreign country now - and I’ve heard the same thing from many locals in all the countries I’ve lived in.
It’s not because you’re from the West that you’d be an acceptable immigrant, it’s because you’re white. From the way you’re telling the same story I’ve heard a million times myself, I’m 99% certain you’re as white as I am.
Yep. When I visit my girlfriend’s family in Peru, I get looks because I’m mixed Caucasian (white skin but some asian features) and definitely not Latino. When I stayed in Germany, or visited Austria or Switzerland, I did not get the same looks or attitudes. I’ve been around, and I’ve found a lot of people’s initial attitudes towards you depends on how similar or different you are to them at face-value.
It depends on who.
For immigrants changing their mind, they are either going to approach it as moving back to their old country or being an immigrant in the new country.
For most native born Americans who I know who did or will, they will also likely self identify as immigrants.
It will be the elderly moving to Latin America to retire who will likely refer to themselves as “expats”.
CharlesDarwinIt might be assumed that it is easier for people within Western countries to assimilate in another Western country? It’s often not actually true, I imagine, and probably really comes down to the individual.
No, it’s racism. Always has been.
We just left the US at the beginning of the year, and so we’ve been thinking about this sort of thing a lot. The short answer is, before we thought about it, we were referring to ourselves as “expats.” But just last week I saw someone online mention that, as a rule, people moving from rich countries are called “expats” while people moving to rich countries are called “immigrants.”
That one did my head in a bit. Had to rethink some stuff.
I grew up in the USA and live in Australia. I think of and refer to myself as both ‘expat’ and ‘immigrant’.
Which word I use depends on context. I’m an American expat (context: my relationship with USA), but I’m an immigrant in Australia (context: my relationship with Australia).
I guess I’m really just using “expat” to mean “emigrant”. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
An expat is not an immigrant. An immigrant emigrates to a different country, like my mother who was born in Venezuela but earned her citizenship in the USA. An expat is somebody who moves to another country for work temporarily, and does NOT emigrate. Think of immigration as permanent and expat as temporary (think work visa for a few years then back home, or transfered somewhere else)
Oh a migrant gotcha
I moved to Germany from the US and make a point of calling myself an immigrant to tackle this very thing. Honestly I haven’t heard expat used by anyone besides contractors looking to go back home after the duration, but that’s anectodal.
Colonial legacy. One has to remember European spent the 1800s and much of the early 1900s dabbling in “were civilized, they’re not” brainrot ie. phrenology, race “science”, eugenics, forced sterilization and most Western education essentially ignores the universal cultural legacy of white supremacy. It’s why Western countries can never seem to completely shake Nazism. To agree it’s imbued into their very foundations.