8Bit | 
| 🍶🦊I cannot tell you how much I love that the process of
"my Linux distro suddenly booted into Gnome because I didn't realize a package I installed yesterday had all of Gnome as a dependency"
is referred to at
"getting gnomed"
Pikario 
@memoriesin8bit I didn't know 🤣
But after a laugh I think a distro should not change your default DE, it's a bad behaviour
But after a laugh I think a distro should not change your default DE, it's a bad behaviour
@pikario The way I understand is that often it's through people installing ProtonVPN tray icon which is only needed for Gnome and has all of it as a dependency. This then also installs GDM which boots to Gnome by default.
What I don't understand, yet is how just installing a Display/Login Manager automatically activates it. Say I installed it, I would need to disable SDDM and enable GDM. But I suppose some more beginner friendly distros do this automatically by now?
What I don't understand, yet is how just installing a Display/Login Manager automatically activates it. Say I installed it, I would need to disable SDDM and enable GDM. But I suppose some more beginner friendly distros do this automatically by now?
Reinout van Schouwen@memoriesin8bit
This sounds like something that could have happened twenty years ago. But now? This behavior is anything but beginner friendly.
(Saying this as a GNOME enthousiast since v1.2 or thereabout)
@pikario
This sounds like something that could have happened twenty years ago. But now? This behavior is anything but beginner friendly.
(Saying this as a GNOME enthousiast since v1.2 or thereabout)
@pikario
@reinouts @pikario Agreed. Installing a whole desktop cause you accidentally install a package made for that desktop - okay fine. The rest is not okay. As I said before, I don't even know how that works. Maybe Mint automatically activates services you just installed to make it easier for newcomers? I dunno.
24😷-185@memoriesin8bit @reinouts @pikario
It's often due to user error. They follow this link: https://protonvpn.com/support/official-linux-vpn-mint then click on the other link https://protonvpn.com/support/official-ubuntu-vpn-setup/ and unfortunately skip this part before clicking:
“However, if installing the GUI app, please skip the Linux system tray icon (optional) step, as the gnome-shell-extension-appindicator package will install the entire GNOME desktop environment as a dependency.”
Poorly worded instructions? Maybe
@240185 I get that part of the problem - as I said (multiple times), it's not even an issue.
But how installing Gnome(+GDM) results in the distro seemingly defaulting to it, I'd say that's the real problem in my book.
Skyler@memoriesin8bit @240185 I think (for convenience) many distros show a picker menu that defaults to whatever you're installing - which is great if you meant to install that thing, and horrible if it was pulled in as a dependency to some unrelated package and you don't fully understand the prompt
@240185
Even if the user makes this error, the system should be forgiving enough not to change the whole default desktop environment without explicit user consent.
@memoriesin8bit @pikario
Even if the user makes this error, the system should be forgiving enough not to change the whole default desktop environment without explicit user consent.
@memoriesin8bit @pikario
Cassandrich@240185 @memoriesin8bit @reinouts @pikario There are two problems here:
One is the utterly bogus dependency. At most these packages should pull in a few GNOME libs, not any applications much less GDM.
The other is that the distro is using "user installed this package" as proxy for "user wants to change their system settings to run it as their login manager".
🤡 🚗 at so many levels.
khmthis is the oldest debian/ubuntu vs fedora/redhat fight there is. in debian installing a service activates that service during installation. "the user installed it, so they must want it running" logic happening. in fedora, installing a service doesn't do that. "if the user wants it running, they can start it" logic happening.
the disagreement will continue until the end of time
CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]
the disagreement will continue until the end of time
CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]
Ember is so tired of people. 
@memoriesin8bit @reinouts @pikario iirc even plain debian activates newly installed services by default
Anthk@memoriesin8bit @reinouts @pikario
Inmutable distros prevent this. You then install the rest from either Guix or Flatpak.
@anthk Fair. We can always fix the results of taking choice away from the user by taking more choice away from the user. That's how Windows got so popular.
Don't mind me - just being particularly jaded today.