if you talk to people who do community defense you will find gun safety is a paramount, primary focus

if you even look at professional trainers who are conservative or reactionary, this usually still holds

the average gun owner is far more responsible than how they are portrayed by people who don't like guns or who have no experience with them - at least in terms of gun safety and avoidance of injury

@foundseed

sure, but that is a very politically loaded question. people teaching self defense won't necessarily support community defense or know what it is. most often they support police.

community defense doesn't advocate for attacking folks

@johnbrowntypeface @foundseed

Ugh, kind of a tangent, but so many ppl I've run into on the left who talk about armed community defense don't seem to be very down to earth about it. (full disclosure: I am absolutely not opposed to armed community defense. just to the ways in which it gets talked about - or rather, NOT talked about - so often!)

The radical gun club in my area specifically teaches (and requires) a class on the ethics of self-defense where they explicitly ask everyone attending to consider whether their threat model involves guns actually making them safer. These are all folks who own multiple guns, are and have been involved in community defense, including trans-specific community defense and BIPOC-specific community defense - so by and large I trust them.

It's an important conversation because it's good to actually think about what armed self- and community-defense means for you, but unfortunately, a lot of people seem to think that armed community defense stops at owning a gun and getting a lot of range time in. Obviously that's part of it, but if you are going to broaden self-defense to community defense, you need to train WITH your guns AS a community. And that part, sadly, is often lacking (in my experience).

These things should involve: knowing who you're talking about when you're talking community. As in, individual names & faces. What guns do they have and what is their skill level/personal threat model? Are we talking neighborhoods or fast response teams called from disparate locations? If the former, you gotta know a LOT about the layout and makeup of those neighborhoods. If the latter, who are on those teams and how often do they train together? What scenarios do they train for? For both, what are your options up to the point you collectively decide to fire your weapons and how do you come to that decision? Who has de-escalation training? Who has has critical GSW intervention training? What are your plans for higher-level medical care?

The last community defense collective situation I was in as a household was HORRIBLY lacking in a few of those crucial considerations despite all of us having firearms and training with those firearms. And no one wanted to do weekly, or even monthly, drills. I think the issue of armed community defense is far more intricate than, unfortunately, a lot of well-meaning leftist gun owners think it is.

But I definitely agree that it is and should be a choice, albeit one carefully undertaken and carefully considered.

@angelteeth @foundseed
in my experience, folks who have heard the term but not done it personally are more out of the loop than those that have been involved

many on the left don't seem to understand what is meant by the term. like people have heard of the radical gun clubs that exist - those are not community defense. they may support it but their structure is not geared towards it, it's usually just training

@johnbrowntypeface @foundseed

Yes, very true. And honestly I would be VERY heavily side-eyeing any org calling itself a radical gun club that ALSO claimed to be actively organizing and doing community defense, but that's probably because of my bad experiences with vanguardists in general