KayOkay, i'm going to say something, may not be very popular but oh well. It's regarding Thrive messenger. I've seen so many comments about it, please, bear in mind this is a new application. Things will be corrected/fixed in time and some of the wording in these comments has been rude at best. Developers work damn hard to make sure something is right, give them some damn respect. #ThriveMessenger
@ChocolatePie respect is earned not freely given and when the dev calls someone an idiot and starts cussing on social media. that's not professional.
@ChocolatePie The thing is, this isn't exactly a hot take. We all have used software before. We've also heard the argument of "but why aren't you giving big tech the same treatment?" The developer's here, on this platform, and throwing literal text tantrums. So no the problem isn't necessarily that this is an... as the developer so eloquently put it, "alpha alpha alpha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" It's that some of these bugs really shouldn't have made it out the door to a public audience, and his idea of pr damage control is to fly off the handle and start telling people to shut the fuck up. I mean Scramble was still pretty buggy when I released its (paid) first version, and somehow I feel like the positive reputation it gained would've been far more different if I'd started flying off the handle at people and ranting at them the same way my 10 year old self might've have done to my sister for taking the last slice of pizza.
Alex Chapman (moved to new account)@stevo399 @ChocolatePie The only people who were throwing text tantrums are those that were blowing a situation that got fixed way out of proportion.
@ChocolatePie the comments from the developer have been equally as rude. As someone who develops and has received some rather hurtful comments over the years, it does not excuse the behavior one little bit.
@lerven @ChocolatePie Yes, some of my comments weren't the best, but some of those people were straight up being asses over issues that were fixed, and as its a new application still in the early stages its bound to have issues, but that doesn't give everyone and their mother the right to start drama over problems that are already or have already been addressed.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie You also can not stoop to that level as it massively erodes your credibility. if you were employed as a software engineer/customer service agent, you would be very quickly unemployed. You need to treat freelance/hobby development the same way. Just saying. Best of luck with your project going forward.
@lerven @ChocolatePie Well I'm not employed, I'm an open source developer that is doing the best to try and make an alternative to the shitty electron apps and crappy webview rappers that messaging apps have become, and what do I get in return, a bunch of people shitting on me and @cubic 's work. And not just that, but the way people were going off all because of a bug which got fixed was just ridiculous, I'm not gonna sit there and let people do that.
@lerven @ChocolatePie exactly. i haven't sceen the offending comments myself, but what i do know is, the 1 thing you need to be when developing anything is unflappable and carm underpressure, which means taking any abbuse anyone throws at you on the chin. Now yes, the comments may have been rood and unconstructive. but that's no excuse for the developer to fly off the hook. there is a saying hear. if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. people are just poor at giving constructive criticism these days.
@ChocolatePie @lerven Then again when you're a dev making open source software in your free time you shouldn't have to put up with people disrespecting you and your work like that. As a company that's different, you have to adhere to certain standards and stuff.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie I really want to reply to this, but your mind is clearly made up on what you consider constitutes appropriate conduct, so I will wish you all the best.
@lerven @ChocolatePie Again, I'm not excusing it, I'm just saying that I should not have to tolerate people disrespecting me and my work all because of a bug that got fixed as soon as it was brought to my attention.
Brandon@lerven @alexchapman @ChocolatePie Haha, why should everyone have to be politically correct 100% of the time? This happened because he was triggered by it. It was not a one off comment that he yelled at. Moral of the story if someones a dick to you about a feature request just block.
@serrebi @lerven @ChocolatePie Yeah, like that Elospeak guy, he started being a dick and twisting what I was saying, blocked him.
@alexchapman @lerven @ChocolatePie I dunno man, I'm not perfect either. I'm sure sometimes my response isn't appropriate either. We all have our opinions. I try to think about other people but sometimes i post something spicey and might think it's fine but I should be corrected. No ones perfect.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie @lerven I've never seen you being rude, if anything, I've been giving you suggestions, you may as well allow me to be a alfa/beta tester. I love it when something new happens. I was on Josh's team for an audiogame and I love doing these testy things in my free time.
JamminJerry@TomGrant91 @alexchapman I would love to help with it, as I love beta and even alpha testing, but don't know who to say it to, and not only that, I keep getting kicked off and I don't even know it until I try to send a message to someone. smile. so I really can't use it very much. I will say I like it for what it is, and hope to see more down the road. if one of the devs is who I think it is, I am not surprised about them going off about things though.
@JamminJerry @TomGrant91 That's weird, I honestly don't know why it would be kicking you off like that, but yeah the way others have gone about things with this is just insane.
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 the thing is I don't know what is going on either. and there is no log of any kind so I could try to help the devs, so I would know what is going on. I don't get any notification at all that I am all of a sudden offline. if I am on audio facetime with my GF, I hear that I went off line, or she will tell me if I miss it, but other than that I don't know. also, I like what the devs tried to do, if you are off line, it now signed you back in with the latest alpha build, and sends your message you were trying to send, but the other person doesn't get the message, even though on my end it says it sent it.
@JamminJerry @TomGrant91 Are you running it from source or the installed copy. Maybe running it from source will give some sort of output in the console.
@ChocolatePie Someone who calls others idiots and tells them they must be hiding something because they want their chats to be secure deserves no respect. Get your act together, and then you'll get treated respectfully.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie I don't just say that for no reason, that guy who was freaking out was acting like he had something to hide, and not realising that the program is still in early development, but nope, he had to throw tantrums about it.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie So there's actually no reason under which it is acceptable for you to address your users as idiots, tell them to go get a grip and shut up, or accuse them of having something suspicious they need to hide. That's just not the way you communicate with your users. The longer you keep doing it, the more of them you will drive away.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie That specific guy wasn't even using the thing, he was just mouthing off from shit he heard.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie Was it incorrect?
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie Yes, because half the stuff he was harping on about was fixed, and the rest is being worked on.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie The way he was carrying on it was like nothing was gonna get done, like dude what the actual hell?
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie What a strange, long winded way to say no.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie I didn't even say no, so stop twisting what I say.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie You didn't, but you should have.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie There is no should have about it. You are being very arrogant now, and I don't appreciate it.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie Oh no, you going to start insulting me too? I need to get ready for the amount of posts you are going to make about me.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie No, I am pointing out how you are coming across.
@alexchapman @ChocolatePie You are coming across as a little child who cannot handle any complaints and needs to make a show out of them.
@Elospeak @ChocolatePie Whatever, goodbye
@ChocolatePie I am giving them respect.
@TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie Yup, and that's good dude.
Ra (Freyja) (it/its)ππΉπ π©@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie I also respect what the devs are trying to do. however, I also expect the developers to have a solid roadmap and set of legal and security policies
@freya @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie You're forgetting, this is not a company, but a couple of people working on this in their spair time, so yeah, expecting all that to be in place right out of the gate is expecting a lot.
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie I do not care that this is a company or not dude. you are running, a public service. you are running a service, where people may communicate sensitive data, including personally identifiable information (PII). you are responsible, at that point, for ensuring the security of that data and the media over which it is communicated. whether you're a single developer, a group of 5 people, or a 20000 employee company, it doesn't matter, the same legal and policy requirements apply. I want to see thrive messenger, well, thrive. but it's going to be the source of a massive data breech if yous aren't careful and I don't wanna see yall go through that
@freya @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie OK, well people know what they are getting into when the phrase, public alpha, or just, alpha, is right there in the releases. Its a proof of concept stage, and all this is being worked on, but its not gonna be there within a click of a finger.
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie you are running it as a public service with insufficient security. shut it down, add security, then relaunch. you shouldn't be offering this right now, in its current state, it's not safe
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie I'd like to see proof of that. Who's your designated security lead?
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie based on what I've heard from you, you don't know much about security. I then ask: what do you thinkl is required to make a truly secure messenger? and how aware are you of the current threat models? what *is* your threat model in fact?
@freya @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie OK this conversation is getting no where. I am not continuing this.
@alexchapman @TomGrant91 @ChocolatePie I suspect you wouldn't, no, because you don't know how to answer my questions, do you? it's ok to admit you're in over your head here, but you need to admit that and back out
@freya Its being implemented in stages, and I'm not wasting my time explaining shit to the likes of you. Either you stop wasting my time or you're getting blocked.
@alexchapman "not explaining shit to the likes of you". Holy fuck dude, that's......../... I am asking earnest, honest questions. if your messenger was so safe, you wqouldn't find the need to lash out at me like this, would tyou?
@freya Because even if I bother you're gonna give me shit still, I know what you're like
@alexchapman you know what I'm like? we've never met before, so no, no you don't "know what I'm like". Please be honest here and admit that either (A) you don't care about security and you don't care about your users' data, so I can go ahead and assume that or (B) ask for help. I am willing, more than willing, to provide help.
@freya No but people who do this shit usually still act like this even if I've given the info. You wanna know what makes a secure messenger, well, I just made a dedicated post, so go and look for it if you really are that bothered.
@alexchapman did you? and where is that exactly, the thing a day ago where you demonstrate you don't know the difference between the thrive messenger protocol and XMPP?