Mastodawn

I think a lot about accounts of older "therians" who do not use or know that term. I think about this story from Tumblr. https://www.tumblr.com/questions-within-questions/770568290019999744/being-a-ranger-i-spend-a-lot-of-time-alone-in-the

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Firecakes Feb 20

@spacefinner lovely story

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Colin Feb 20

@spacefinner @yksteldus it’s so fun to hear about historical writings of folks demonstrating/exhibiting therian traits.
It’s not some new thing. This shit has been around a long time. Species dysphoria is no joke.
(It’s sad hearing how they were treated/dealt with though :/.. but that persecution still persists..)(some cultures dealt with it better tho..)

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Rosy Feb 20

@spacefinner I don't like to use the term either though other people would probably describe me as such. I'm not that old though...

it would be cool if there were any history books about "therians" or "lycanthropes" or whatever word we want to use... I haven't seen any yet

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Ossie

Feb 20

@lalah I tend to believe "therian" is a very young term, and many of the behaviours ascribed to it are cultural and (imo) symptoms of being on the internet a lot. This is why I have been trying to think in terms of behaviour.

The man described in the story doesn't have a strong empathy with cartoons, for example. He is presumably unfamiliar with the internet. But he still feels this particular way, very clearly. If he is referred to as a deer he feels this is right, in some obscure way.

That's a thing he and I share (albeit it's not deer for me). And I think it is a thing that can be named. But I have to be careful.

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Baral'heia Stormdancer ΘΔ🐲Feb 20

@spacefinner @lalah I originally discovered otherkin and therians back in the very early 2000's and - at least back then - many of us didn't have a strong empathy with cartoons either, at least in the community I fell into. The empathy with cartoon characters that leads to or awakens non-human thoughts and beliefs is a bit more of a modern thing, I think.

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Baral'heia Stormdancer ΘΔ🐲Feb 20

@spacefinner @lalah Though to be fair, it's been really nice to see more and more furries not only become aware of therianthropy, but also awaken to the possibility that their character is more than just a character. I remember back in the day there was almost animosity between the two communities so seeing the Fandom openly embrace therianthropy has been quite refreshing, honestly.

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Ossie

Feb 20

@baralheia @lalah It's interesting because I still don't interpret my related experiences as "literal", and didn't relate strongly to others at the time when I discovered the identity online; but as time has gone on I've decided the associated images and feelings are still very important to me and probably need attention.

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Dragon Friend Feb 20

@spacefinner "hushed as if he's talking about something sacred."

Wow, I very much relate to that. I was like that when talking about dragons/reptiles with people until very recently (and still a little bit). Hesitant, a little embarrassed, dealing with shame. Excited by the topic but not sure how to express it, and not always comfortable talking about dragons/reptiles with other people.

And also not really understanding the desire I had made it all more awkward and embarrassing.

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Ossie

Feb 20

@dragonfriend A good catch - I hadn't thought about that part of it.

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GoodNewsGreyShoes🔞(on hiatus)Feb 23

@spacefinner @dragonfriend Shame is one hell of a drug.😖

I think a lot about what a world bereft of shame might look like. I don't think it would actually be *better* (social pressure isn't always a bad thing), but I'd imagine there would be FAR less anxiety.😅

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Dragon Friend Feb 23

@GoodNewsGreyShoes Yeah, shame is a tricky thing, and people sometimes use it to mean different things.

It's usually attached to guilt, but not always, and guilt is important because if something is wrong, well, it's wrong. There's guilt there. Shame as in contrition over wrong actions is good. Lingering shame can be very unhealthy.

I've definitely done a lot of wrong things, and I struggled to understand myself and my dragon-ness for so many years because I was doing wrong things. I had shame, and I wasn't able to forgive myself and I wasn't able to believe that God had forgiven me for what I had done.

It's definitely a complex subject, and a kinda strange one to think about.

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GoodNewsGreyShoes🔞(on hiatus)Feb 24

@dragonfriend 100%! One of the toughest parts of deeply internalized shame is simply being able to ACKNOWLEDGE it at all, in ourselves, much less talk about or process with others.🫠

(It's hard not to spiral into seclusion & despair if you feel ashamed OF feeling shame😵‍💫)

Institutionalized religion taught me a lot I never wanted to know about weaponizing shame, despite y'know...*gestures vaguely at John 8:7-11*

It helps to consider that, technically, Jesus could be considered therian.😉👼

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Dragon Friend Feb 24

@GoodNewsGreyShoes Yeah, I lived in a state of depression for a large chunk of my life, and shame can be a vicious cycle.

And yeah, I've seen a lot of, shall we say, bad behavior from people in the church, despite none of us being without sin, and none of us deserving God. And that includes from myself. My inability to love myself was eclipsing my view of God, and despite being taught and shown that He *loves* me, I somehow didn't get it, and thought He just *tolerated* me, because I hated myself.

And yes! One of the big things I've learned in the past few years is that God *understands*! I struggled to understand my dragonic feelings, but God understood from the beginning and was waiting for me to take these feelings to Him! He wanted to lead me and show me how to understand them, and He has shown me how dragonic He is!

God knows what it's like to have a human body and yet be more than just human, because He knows all things, and because He lived an authentic human life while still being divine! He gets it!

I wish I had taken my thoughts to God sooner, because I could have saved myself years of hurt.

I also want to say, since it sounds like you've been hurt by institutionalized religion, that I'm sorry. It's messed up, the things that happen. None of us are without sin, and all of us have failed and done wrong. None of us deserve God, but God wants us *all*. That's what it's about. On behalf of any Christians who have not shown you the love they received, I apologize. I myself have laughed and ridiculed along with others, and we all should have known better. I'm sorry.

Despite being raised in a Christian home and calling myself a Christian for most of my life, it's only been a few years since I really had a relationship with God, and that has made all the difference. I don't deserve it, but He loves me and wants me, and that's what it's all about!