Mastodawn

Mozilla vs. their core audience

just call me jack. 🐒Nov 15

@mttaggart best meme ever!

Nivex 🐧 📻Nov 15

@mttaggart @majorlinux "But we'll do it _ethically_!"

oscarfalcon Nov 16

@mttaggart

Feels like it's basically this really...

Bob Machintruc Nov 16

@mttaggart
#AI #Mozilla #WTF #Internet

Vendetta Nov 16

@mttaggart mozilla and everyone else unfortunately. AI is in everything despite if anyone wants, asks or needs it

@mttaggart Sadly.

@mttaggart I disagree here. A lot of people want and use AI and I personally find it useful for some things but not others.

Mozilla, as opposed to others claims to make this a voluntary thing. That's the way to go, give people a choice, not force them either way.

If the only choice is AI forced down your throat or no AI at all, most folks will choose the former.

The world is not black and white, although, it seems we increasingly go absolute.

Nov 17

@sergedroz People already had a choice in Firefox without adding features that, as this post suggests, are by no means popular with Firefox's core user base. Nothing stopped Firefox users from using those tools if they wanted. Moves like "AI Mode" represent a conscious choice to favor these toxic technologies over other possible uses of Mozilla's time and treasure.

@mttaggart this one: https://blog.mozilla.org/en/firefox/ai-window/. Seems ok to me, giving ordinary people a choice

Introducing AI, the Firefox way: A look at what we're working on and how you can help shape it | The Mozilla Blog

We recently shared how we are approaching AI in Firefox — with user choice and openness as our guiding principles. That’s because we believe AI should

Nov 17

@sergedroz What "choice" has been given that was absent before? If the answer is the choice to experience the web using a less secure, misinformation prone interface, I don't see the benefit. Is the choice the need to disable this if users want? Why is that an improvement? And that's not even considering the opportunity cost of investing in this work rather than anything else to improve the browser.

What you call "choice," I call a needless incursion of toxic technology into a browser that needed none of it.

@mttaggart most people want an integrated experience. That's why Google's experience is so nice, stuff just worse and is integrated. But most big tech companies give you little choice and if you can opt out it's buried deep.

So either ff or others leave this stuff completely and cater to a niche or they try better ways.

Nov 17

@sergedroz "Most people" are not Firefox users. They are already a niche, and Mozilla has a stated mission. This ain't that, and the user base knows it.

Look at the response here: https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/building-ai-the-firefox-way-shaping-what-s-next-together/td-p/109922

This is not in service of Mozilla's stated mission. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/

Building AI the Firefox way: Shaping what’s next together

Hi everyone, We recently shared how we’re approaching AI in Firefox with user choice and openness at the center of everything we build. We’ve heard from many of you who’d prefer not to have AI in your browser at all, and we get it: We will soon provide additional settings for you to control how AI i...

@mttaggart I use and recommend FF because it is an ethical alternative to many of the commercial browser. But if that means it stays stuck at some time then it looses it's usefulness. I don't believe in a black and white view, and I do feel AI is useful.

I know people who still exclusively use the command line because that's the way god intended the internet to be used. Fine for me, but not what I want. I think its good that Mozilla looks at how new tech can be used responsibly. I'll stop here

Davey Nov 21

@sergedroz @mttaggart

As a longtime advocate of Firefox I despair of the moves Mozilla take, aping large corporations who have different goals to them.

I think this kind of thing is driven more by the career ambitions of leadership than actual user needs. Like a new product in Google.

A billion people are using ChatGPT, ok.
ChatGPT exists though.

Products with other goals shouldn't be wasting money trying to replicate it and certainly not donor-funded ones.

Adolph Nov 23

@davey_cakes @sergedroz @mttaggart I've been using Firefox for almost 15 years because it was __the privacy-focused__ browser, and I despise having AI and ads integrated in the browser, as they did. It should be opt-in, always, everything, and let people decide, not force them to swallow those decisions based on nothing but the imagination of one or two people.

Also, AI stuff should be an extension, not integrated in the browser directly, for those who don't even want to touch it with a pole.

Aaron Nov 22

@mttaggart

Yeah, I haven't observed *any* members of this hypothetical majority except in this very thread.

@sergedroz

Æ Sea F.Nov 17

@mttaggart @sergedroz Where do you guys see AI in Firefox? I've been using Firefox for years on multiple devices. It updates itself regularly but I'm still to see that something AI like would be pushed on me, unless I go to settings and enable something. If or when I want AI in my browser I'll have it with a click. I think it's a good choice to have.

@hcf @mttaggart check the blog above, it's not rolled out yet.

Zero Nov 17

@hcf i see Firefox dead. The new CEO is looting the place for personal wealth. No one that wants “AI” gives a shit about Firefox or having a clone of an already shitty product, “AI”.

Parigot-Manchot Nov 22

@sergedroz @mttaggart Where is the choice when AI is here even if you don't want ?
Thanks to Mozilla, I'm investigating a Chromium-like alternative like @Vivaldi , even if adding extensions on mobile version is not here.
Thanks a lot Merdzilla (french slang term meaning Shitzilla).

オチュー (stop colonialism 🇵🇸)Nov 22

@sergedroz @mttaggart I would be 20% less about firefox being full of shit by putting a "disable IA" big button at the start of the browser.

But even if it were : they put valuable ressource into "shit I won't ever use and that'll confuse users and make the whole web stink more" (to me) and so it kinda still make them fools... to me.

People who like and use IA other for very specific science task (where million of a one pic has to be analyzed) are a deep mystery to me

Giovanni De Francesco Nov 21

@mttaggart HAHAH. Loved it. However I do think they want to do this just to stay up to date and try to still be enticing to probable new users. I'd like them going in the opposite direction tho, maybe more people would switch.

J🎶Nov 21

@mttaggart I read this in their voices. I needed this.