🇾 🇪 🇿 🇿 🇪 🇾Does anyone remember Third Voice? You could graffiti any website and only people who had plugin installed could see it. Why isn't there a modern alternative?
Or do they still exist?
I fear after asking the question, could this be used as a weaponized bubble machine.
henfredemarsThis sounds like so much fun! I don’t know of any such plugin existing, but I wish it would.
When the internet was fun
raman_klogiusThen Zuck who’s incapable of fun found out rage drives more engagement.
Too bad “funny” isn’t as profitable as “furious”.
Thing is, funny could be profitable “enough”, but not for them
It’s the opposite of Monsters, Inc.
I remember Yahoo Chat used to let you go to a website and then chat with other users currently on that website. It was kinda cool.
But idk about Third Voice.
I think the answer to why there isn’t a modern alternative is under the History tab on that Wiki page.
Easy to police now with AI, if someone gets rich send me some bitcoin im poor (:
If it was "easy to police now with AI," then companies wouldn't still regularly have issues with all kinds of code injection on their websites, since literally any security vendor would have implemented bulletproof AI protection for it already.
An AI model designed for moderation could probably block some things, but it would be no better than traditional mechanisms employed by large organizations who's job it is to keep things secure, that still regularly fall victim to these kinds of vulnerabilities. Many of these organizations already use AI-powered tools to police their systems, and they know they're not anywhere close to even being a full replacement, let alone foolproof.
AI isn’t perfect, and it’s definitely not a magic bullet for security or moderation. But that’s true for every system we use today.
geekwithsoulIt's more than "AI isn't perfect", it's that AI isn't even good. Moderation, and even summaries, require more than predictions - they require understanding, which AI doesn't have. It's all hallucinations, and it's just that through sheer dumb luck and hoovering in so much ill-gotten data that sometimes the hallucinations happen to be correct.
Dismissing it all as “hallucinations” is like saying all cars are useless because they can crash. No tool is flawless but imperfect doesn’t mean worthless.
Nice strawman, but not applicable. A car can mechanically fail, resulting in a crash or a human can operate it in such a manner as to cause a crash. It can't crash on its own and if driven and maintained correctly, won't crash.
An AI, on the other hand, can give answers but never actually "knows" if it's correct or true. Sometimes the answers will be correct because you get lucky but there's nothing in any current LLM out there that can tell fact from fiction. It's just based on how it's trained and what it's trained on, and even when taking from "real" sources, it can mix things up when combining sources. Suggest you read https://medium.com/analytics-matters/generative-ai-its-all-a-hallucination-6b8798445044
The only way a car would be like an AI is if every time you sat in the car, it occasionally drove you to the right place and you didn't mind the other 9 out of 10 times it drove you to the wrong place, drove you using the least efficient route, and/or occasionally drove across lawns and fields, and on sidewalks. Oh, and the car assembles itself from other people's cars and steals their gas.
Too many beers to reply now, maybe tomorrow.
Have you ever done any technical work with “AI”?
I assume it’s the same reason CS got rid of tags.
Pretty sure I’d rage quit.
Man it was so much fun to see the clever shit people had qs tags
Menschlicher_FehlerMy favorite was a ladder texture
Honestly, I know it’s not the same, but that’s why I have always gravitated towards “news aggregators”, basically the sites that bore progeny like Reddit and Lemmy, where you’re presented with links to news or random websites and people have their say about it in the comments.
I never heard of Third Voice and truthfully anything that is 100% reliant on a third party app or plugin / extension / mod / etc probably isn’t my bag of tea, but still a cool idea.
One of the best thing about old reddit was how often you’d see a post for a news article about some scientific research, and if you went in the comments you’d find something like, “I’m a graduate student who helped work on this research and the reporter completely misunderstood it and their conclusion in the article is all wrong. Here’s a link to the original paper, and I’ll give a brief explanation of what our research actually found…”
These days that’s more common on Lemmy.
Lemmy now definitely reminds me of the very early days of reddit, enjoying it immensely
They used to be a really niche version of this back in the day created by _why the lucky stiff in the ruby programming community. It was called hoodwink’d, at the time it felt like the way of the future
Did they ever ask why they got dozxed?
His identity was sort of an open secret in the community, he was a whimsical creative brilliant madman that was very well known, people were curious. Check out Why’s Poignant guide to Ruby
Why’s Poignant guide to Ruby for a glimpse wow very interesting…
there’s a more or less unspeakable amount of money riding on businesses’ ability to control the narrative around themselves. this applies to small businesses and big ones alike, and a service like this would be a target for corporations all over the world. a dox isn’t a large lift.
seathruStumbleupon was kind of like that. Along with being an early type of link aggregator, any website would have its own comment section that was only visible to other stumbleupon users.
I used to enjoy it, and it looks like it may still be alive in some form. But I’m not brave enough to see how shitty it’s become. I’ll keep my rose tinted glasses on.
RivalarrivalI loved stumbleupon, but with its moderation policy, it doesn’t surprise me in the slightest that it went down hard.
What happened there? I must have wandered off before the drama happened.
Oh, they just catered to Karens with automated bans, and no human review.
They also had a policy that if you didn’t restrict your account to PG-level content, all of your submissions were considered X-rated.
AatubeThe product soon received much criticism by website owners claiming they were trying to externalize discussion. The White House website was annotated with topical jokes. Further issues arose when spammers began to leverage the product, and increased issues arose when cross-site scripting security vulnerabilities were exploited in the product.
Pretty sure all these problems can be solved now.
The “say no to third voice” campaign website is hilarious. It’s very obviously just cyber boomers who couldn’t handle people talking about their “internet properties” outside their control
Cyber Trespassing We believe that Third Voice software cyber trespasses on the paid for property of commercial sites, private organizations, and private individuals.
Web pages are publicly accessible surfaces that are attached to privately owned domain names, located on server space that is rented or paid for. … According to Webster’s Dictionary, vandalism is "willful or malicious destruction or defacement of public or private property ".
Defacement is defined as “to mar the external appearance of”
Third Voice notes are graffiti and vandalism.
I prefer Cyber X Gen
ArghblargYears ago web.hypothes.is used to let one annotate any website, but it appears now they are focused on only student/educational usage.
There was a plugin that allowed highlighting text on any web page, adding comments, and having threaded conversations based on groups… it was kind of cool, too bad it didn’t take off.
SubArcticTundraIt still works and I still use it. Every so often I even run into other people’s public comments in the wild.
This is very ‘meta’ – we should perhaps start a lemmy community to discuss what sites and groups to form, to use it on other sites. There could even be a lemmy group to comment on lemmy… or something :p
db0Never heard of it, but I was into pmog/the nethernet instead which was kinda similar but I more exploration oriented
Is it OSS?
I just browsed a few of the component projects on github and it seems they’re BSD-licensed…
This is awesome.
I recommend pasting this into TamperMonkey to have the Hypothesis controls display on every page.
Neat, thanks.
How would it work, technically, on a dynamic website? Any given url may load different content.
Good question, this is not an issue I dont think these days.
The content isn’t being hosted on the server of the location you’re ending at. You just tie it to the url, same as it worked before. Ignore search strings and tracking tags and that’s it. Nothing has changed on that end.
But if I’m on example.com/feed and I see posts [1,2,3] based on my user and whatever algorithm is there, and you’re on example.com/feed and you see posts [4,5,6], how would it know? Same url, completely different content.
I guess it would work on pages that have a fixed url, like news articles.
You can’t account for viewing the same dynamic content across all pages on the Internet. Nothing is consistent, and stuff changes. I don’t think it really matters though. Commenting on dynamic content is a function of social media ie the site itself, not a third party addon. It would still be useful without that
JRaccoonThe internet got way more complicated since then with all the dynamically loaded and generated content. I don’t think the plugin would work very well these days.
A plugin that just checks to see if Lemmy has any posts pointing to the current URL would be pretty nice. So I can go and get secondary opinions if I want.
Not sure how much stress that would put on servers though. I guess probably not that much if searches can just be exact matches on URLs.
I’d love this. Maybe a filter for subscribed communitied but otherwise sounds like a great way to interact with a community around articles
wouldn’t be much stress really.
I’m currently building something with fediverse integration so this is a great idea and something i’ll look into. Basically you would be logged into an instance (lemmy.world) and if you’re navigating a to a site or even an RSS feed you could see if there’s any relevant links to said article/story/whatever back to lemmy.
right now I have a feed built that allows you to log into all your instances (mastodon, lemmy, peertube, etc) and displays all the content you’re subscribed to in a single feed. So adding in what you’ve suggested would be a great feature.
Haha, sick. Count me in if you want a beta tester :)
I use an extension that replaces YouTube comments with Reddit comments, if the video was posted anywhere on Reddit.
Would be nice to have a Lemmy version.
Privacy, cost, moderation