Extinction Rebellion Global
Mx. Alba 
@ExtinctionR "Imperfect allies aren't enemies", sure, but what if an ally's imperfection is that they're transphobic, how would you expect me, a trans person, to work with them? If a lot of the allies' imperfections are racism, how would you expect people of color to join the movement?
Russell@MxAlba It depends on how that imperfection manifests. If they're actively calling for bans, etc, that's not a potential ally. If they're passive or squeamish, that's still a potential ally.
Personally I take it to mean stop applying purity tests (those only serve to make enemies, not allies). For example Tesla used to be the car for climate conscious folks; now those same climate allies are being vilified for a decision made years ago. Yes to boycott dealerships, no to burning people's cars.
@zimzat I largely agree with you but at the same time you're basically saying that trans people should just put up with anti-trans micro-aggressions from cis allies, and people of color should just put up with racist micro-aggressions from white allies, and disabled and chronically ill folks should just put up with rampant ableism... What'll happen in practice, is that those marginalized people will leave the movement. And you actually see that happening. I'm a member of a radical intersectional movement in the Netherlands, but over the years, I've seen more and more disabled people and people of color drop out of the movement. The movement is gradually becoming whiter and whiter, and more and more able-bodied, further accelerating those effects.
@MxAlba I don't mean they should just put up with it or ignore it; it should absolutely be called out. It's a question of how or when (or who; those with disabilities shouldn't be the only ones speaking up for themselves but they may be the only ones who know what's best for them, catch-22)
The often snarky exclusionary replies aren't helpful.
Then there was a post that put an accessibility problem on blast and rejected all solutions. Sometimes people just want to be outraged. 🤷
@zimzat But when such things are called out, that usually prompts a fragile response (white / male / cis / able-bodied fragility), and then you get the good old "leftist in-fighting"... Caused mostly by people who have not unpacked their own privileges or don't know how to deal with their own fragility.
@MxAlba You're not wrong. It's challenging and those responses can be disheartening.
I take the attitude of Today's Ten Thousand https://xkcd.com/1053/ and at least try to inform and advocate and hope for the best. It's not much, but ... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Nicola@CryogenicIce9 @zimzat Right... So... Then basically the dilemma for XR is, do they want to include TERFS and exclude trans people, or vice versa? If they keep including TERFs because "you shouldn't exclude imperfect allies", they will implicitly exclude trans people... And then trans people get called out for "not being able to play nice with imperfect allies", basically blaming THEM for the scism...
xorox@MxAlba @ExtinctionR Simple. Those are not an imperfect allies, they literally enemies.
Bargearse@MxAlba @ExtinctionR
>sure, but what if an ally's imperfection is that they're transphobic, how would you expect me, a trans person, to work with them
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Then they're not allies and this post doesn't apply.
An example might be, people advocating for climate change lambasting #JSO or #XR becase their commute was longer one day.
Everyone is human and we can find many things in common with the most horrific people. Reductio ad absurdum, hitler loved animals, like many other folk do, doesn't mean a jewish dog lover would be an ally.