Rubio melts down on air over accusation U.S. is ‘placating Putin’

https://lemmy.world/post/26253222

Rubio melts down on air over accusation U.S. is ‘placating Putin’ - Lemmy.World

Summary Secretary of State Marco Rubio grew visibly frustrated during an ABC News interview when questioned about the Trump administration’s approach to Russia. Defending Trump’s push for peace talks with Putin, Rubio insisted negotiations were necessary but admitted the administration didn’t know Russia’s demands. He clashed with host George Stephanopoulos over Trump’s refusal to call Putin a dictator and the U.S. siding with Russia in a recent UN vote. Rubio also compared Trump’s handling of Ukraine to Biden’s approach to Israel, further escalating tensions.

The only person to talk about backing out of NATO since its creation has been Putin/Xi and Trump/Musk. So why wouldn’t everyone think it?

NATO is Russia/China’s greatest deterrent. It’s literally devastating to our national security to pull out–so clearly only a bad actor would want that… It’s pretty goddamn obvious.

The only person to talk about backing out of NATO since its creation has been Putin/Xi and Trump/Musk.

That’s not true. Ron/Rand Paul, Ross Perot, Pat Buchanan, and a number of other paleocons have been championing this for decades.

Trump’s just the first guy to make it all the way to the White House with the view. But it isn’t unique to Trump, nor is it particularly unpopular. Lots of Americans, particularly poorer and more rural ones, see these foreign alliances as an unnecessary extravagance.

NATO is Russia/China’s greatest deterrent.

What is The North Atlantic Treaty Organization detering China from doing, exactly?

@Xanza probably doesn’t know anything past what CNN and Facebook has told them about things.

That’s not true.

I was being facetious.

What is The North Atlantic Treaty Organization detering China from doing, exactly?

Anything in the South China Sea or the Indo-Pacific that they shouldn’t be doing. China literally just says sometimes “Hey, nice land you got there. Would be a fuckin’ shame if we took it…” and then just pretends like that land has always been a part of China. They literally do it all the time. They’re attempting to expand their empire and without the presence of NATO, there would be no one to stop them… Especially from capturing strategic or necessary assets that are critical to the US, like Taiwan. If we lose Taiwan we’re pretty much omega-fucked and I don’t think people appreciate that fact enough.

NATO is the largest nuclear deterrent in the world and if we pull out, it’s like taking all the ammo out of our really big guns. It’s such an astonishingly stupid move I cannot even believe that anyone with a pulse would or even could support it. It leaves me fuckin’ bewildered.

Anything in the South China Sea or the Indo-Pacific that they shouldn’t be doing.

Such as? What isn’t China doing that they would be doing without British or French intervention?

China literally just says sometimes “Hey, nice land you got there. Would be a fuckin’ shame if we took it…”

You sure you’re not confusing China with the United States?

NATO is the largest nuclear deterrent in the world

Deterant to what? They certainly didn’t keep Russia out of Georgia, Crimea, or the Donbas.

Such as?

I literally went on to explain. So either you’re being disingenuous here or you just don’t read. Either way, I’m out.

You sure you’re not confusing China with the United States?

Boom, there it is!

And I Guess we’re just ignoring all the shit they’re pulling by dumping sand and dirt into the ocean and calling it a Chinese island, and all the shit they’re doing near Taiwan.

Can’t wait for someone to pull out a 400 year old map to justify modern day imperialism again!

I Guess we’re just ignoring all the shit they’re pulling

Interesting “West vs rest” moment yesterday on French TV with the President of Congo, the 2nd biggest country in Africa.

The host asks: “Are you saying that the Chinese or the Russians behave better than us, Westerners, currently, in your opinion?”

“Oh absolutely!” he replies, “You don’t quite understand African realities… it’s astonishing to see how we are very distant in terms of cultures. We cannot understand why you come to give us lessons, for example, on human rights.”

Reminds of the now famous saying from a Kenyan official: "Every time China visits we get a hospital, every time Britain visits we get a lecture”…

Can’t wait for someone to pull out a 400 year old map to justify modern day imperialism again!

glances at a map of US military bases

The crazy thing about NATO is how much of it hinges on the political attitude of a single man in a big white house within walking distance of the Potomac. So many eggs placed in one basket. And then the Americans spill it… twice.

But you cling to NATO like its something so much more than the legacy of American post-war expansionism. Like it really is an enthusiastic alliance between Atlantic Nations and not the biggest kid on the playground shaking down everyone else for their lunch money.

Arnaud Bertrand (@RnaudBertrand) on X

Interesting "West vs rest" moment yesterday on French TV with the President of Congo, the 2nd biggest country in Africa. The host asks: "Are you saying that the Chinese or the Russians behave better than us, Westerners, currently, in your opinion?" "Oh absolutely!" he replies,

X (formerly Twitter)

Fyi, UK, NL, FR, ES etc all went with you on your “right of passage” sail throughs, against the chinese. Thats NATO.

Guess who can do that all on its own from now on.

Guess which countries also put sanctions on china? Your NATO partners.

Guess where the machines most chips are made with… Are being made? (NL says hi.)

If you stop scratching our back… Why should we still scratch yours? The chinese market is double yours. We can make more euros there then in your tariff hellscape.

Have fun having the biggest military for the time being. In a few years china has eclipsed yours.

Trump’s tantrums have made it very clear we should buy our military gear locally. So we will. Same will happen with cloud and tech. You can’t be trusted. One day everything is ok, next day everything is +25%

If this continues for a few more months it will mean the end of US hegemony. You will be left with nothing.

In the end we will make peace with Russia, simply because we must. The oil will flow west again in a few years leaving you with all the problems of fracking and zero gains.

Same will happen with china.

We will be allright, bud.

From an EU standpoint it doesn’t matter if the US, china or even Russia is our partner. It mattered because of history. But trump’s US chooses to flush it all down the drain. So we will check if the turd really went down.

Fyi, UK, NL, FR, ES etc all went with you on your “right of passage” sail throughs, against the chinese.

They’re all marque destinations for Chinese exports. Why on earth would China prevent them from sailing in to pick up merch? Sail Through isn’t a consequence of NATO, its a consequence of a multi-trillion dollar trade network.

Guess which countries also put sanctions on china? Your NATO partners.

The sanctions are a joke. Russian gas and Chinese tech have been flooding markets in gray markets across the South Pacific and the Middle East. Germans are buying gas through Turkyie at a middleman’s markup. Indonesia and Malyasia are restamping Chinese manufactured goods and passing them under the radar of sanctions officials. And NATO leadership knows it. They turn a blind eye, because the Business First ideology of capitalism means fattening the wallets of a few industry insiders is far more important than imposing any kind of uniform foreign policy.

Guess where the machines most chips are made with… Are being made? (NL says hi.)

You’ve missed so many steps in the supply chain, its difficult to know where to start. But if you want to believe the Netherlands is the heart of the global electronics manufacturing industry, that’s none of my business.

If this continues for a few more months it will mean the end of US hegemony.

The US has been sloughing off its hegemony since Bush invaded Iraq. But the game was already functionally over when the UK was forced out of Hong Kong. The Americans have been scrambling to keep control of the Philippines, as liberals panic at even Chinese-adjacent businesses in Singapore gaining global popular appeal. They’ve lost control of the Suez thanks to their proxy war defeats in Yemen of all places. And South Africa has been outside the western sphere of influence since Apartheid ended.

What’s scarier than any Trump Tariff is the possibility of the Americans losing control of the Panama Canal, in their own backyard.

In the end we will make peace with Russia, simply because we must.

We’ll see. Trump’s itchy trigger finger blew up the peace deal with Iran and cost the US any kind of stability across the Persian Gulf. We’re alienated from the Turks, we’re pissing of Ukraine, and we’ve lost control of a large swath of Central Africa, all because American ethno-nationalism remains the lodestone of our foreign policy. I don’t know if we can bring ourselves to make peace with anyone. All we can do is walk away from our crumbling edifice of empire.

What the hell are you talking about? This report/interview has nothing to do with backing out of NATO. It’s like everybody’s gone mad.
Some people have thoughts that lead to other thoughts. Then they compare those new thoughts to the original problem.
Trump backs Putin. Trump was told to pull out of NATO. Trump has talked about it. That helps Putin.
Don forget ending all US cyber operations against Russia

Biden’s approach to Israel

seems absolutely sane by comparison to your boss, there, buddy.

and if you were going to ‘biden’ your support for ukraine, there’d be a non-stop airlift going on with equipment and armaments.

seems absolutely sane by comparison to your boss, there, buddy.

Coming at the Israeli genocide in Gaza and calling it “sane” is one hell of a take.

He called it “sane by comparison”. He didn’t say it was sane. Words mean things.

He called it “sane by comparison”.

It’s genocide. There’s no comparison.

Oh, you’re one of those who can’t distinguish between genocide and super-genocide with golf resorts. I wish the world were as simple as people like you seem believe.
This really is what people believe.
Oh Mr Rubio, only difference is Israel aipac is funding all of you congreswith bribes do their bidding
Why can’t we have a woman president? They’re too emotional for politics?
Just to be fair: Only women can be elected president for the next 47 presidents.
Can we write s sanity test into the Constitution?
Or maybe we don’t vest so much power into a single psychotic ape. Maybe we have three presidents and they all have to agree before something happens, like the computers on the space shuttle
I'm fine with that, as long as a sanity test gets written into the Constitution. I believe it should apply to all reps. But then if they change the definition of sanity... I don't know what the best way forward is, but it's surely not regression.

Counterpoint: Fetterman.

Dude had a stroke and stuck his tongue up Trump’s asshole. Even if they pass the sanity test they could have some kind of traumatic brain injury that makes them jerks.

Plus I consider all humans to be psychotic apes who I wouldn’t trust as far as I can throw them. Including myself.

Fetterman was a plant. Someone posted an article about how he actually governed before he was a national level leader.

Plus I consider all humans to be psychotic apes who I wouldn't trust as far as I can throw them. Including myself.

Fair point, and thanks for reminding me! The people who don't want it are probably the people most capable and worthy. I look forward to your filing as a candidate! 😀

Don't hurt me please. I'm only half serious, but it's exactly people with this attitude who should probably be on the ballot.

The people who don’t want it are probably the people most capable and worthy. I look forward to your filing as a candidate! 😀

This comment made me realize I have a religious obligation to run for office. And then if I win to not do the job at all.

The major problem, one of the major problems, for there are several, with governing people is that of who you get to do it. Or, rather of who manages to get people to let them do it to them. To summarize: It is a well known and much lamented fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it.

To summarize the summary: Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made president should on no account be allowed to do the job.

To summarize the summary of the summary: people are a problem.

  • Douglas Adams

It’s gonna feel weird running against my dad, though.

There seemed to be quite a few who were just there to sabotage the party from within, such as Manchin.

Manchin was the only Democrat who could win national office in West Virginia. He’s the best my sad state could do.

Yeah he tanked some important votes but a Republican replacement would have voted that way anyway. At least he stuck with the Democrats most of the time.

He always seemed like the Mitt Romney of the Democrats, Romney loves to take a moral stand against his party, after he’d checked with his Whip who assures him the measure with pass without his vote.

A triumvirate?

Just a speed bump on the way to a dictatorship.

Okay how about everyone votes on everything? That actually sounds awesome.
It sounds awesome until you remember that we can barely get half our population to vote for president most of the time and that the average voter is uninformed and poorly educated.
And it would be neigh impossible to manage in a very large nation with a large populace.
Not really. We have a lot of connectivity, the world has never been smaller.

I do not trust techbros to solve this correctly. It would be far too easy and tempting to game the system.

Any political system needs to be able to function separate from electronic devices as there are times when the grid fails.

I agree that you can’t blindly give someone else control over such things, it would be too be run out of gov offices with people beholden to transparency for the public and not to which ever contractor they bid.

On the offline issue, I can see your point as valid, I just don’t think it’s impossible, CA still does paper voting through a scantron, millions of votes can be processed with paper, there’s certainly ways of getting it done in my opinion.

If you look at polling you often find the majority of Americans don’t actually agree with much of the actions of either party, I personally think direct democracy would lead to real progress and prosperity.
It would be fairly simple to pull off with modern technology
Or maybe zero presidents?
Don’t stop I’m almost there…
Or maybe like 200,000,000 presidents? Direct democracy go brrr.
Wouldn’t that be a dream… but it would only turn into finding the doctor that takes money for a clean test.

It’s all unintentional. Their based will accept anything their king and his court declare as the truth.

From their perspective it is all intentional, don’t let their blind loyalty sway you to their view.

Would having MTG as president help?
We currently have a woman president. Trump signed an EO saying that all Americans are female so he’s the first woman president.
Just to add: Since sex is specified “at conception”, there are only a couple cells, and thus aren’t capable of producing either sex cell. The EO says that everyone is non-binary!
Did you watch the video? He never had a melt down. He was frustrated but overall kept his cool and spouted the lies he was supposed to say.

I saw a lot of hemming and hawing, stalling, spewing bullshit, and talking over Stephanopoulos.

Not the behavior of someone “keeping his cool.”

The headline says meltdown!! Just like a headline about my response would be ‘‘insignificant man SLAMS Rubio for Top 10 Epic Anime Showdown’’

Rubio also compared Trump’s handling of Ukraine to Biden’s approach to Israel, further escalating tensions.

Well good thing he got that far. Now we just need to teach him that Apartheid is ba—

I think I see the problem now.

I don’t think Rubio’s analogy is in any way adopting the idea that Biden’s extremely limited pushback on Netanyahu was because Israel did anything wrong, but instead just trying to legitimize Trump’s attempts at coercion as normal. Somehow that’s the thing he thinks people have a problem with, not the target.
I guess if you don’t want the world to think trump isn’t sucking putins dick every chance he gets then i guess he should just stop sucking putins dick every chance he gets.
Hey hey hey don’t forget you’ve got to allow for all the time trump spends with putins dick up inside his arsehole - gotta be at least a 50/50 split imo

The problem is that mostbpeool6are handling this current situation through the lens of classic geopolitics

This is not classic geopolitics. This is the ultra wealthy enacting their plan to create a global plutocracy. A ruking class of only the most wealthy in the world.

They believe that their plans are more easily achieved with a Russian empire than with a free Ukraine.

Ask people like Rubio questions using that as the basis, not classic geopolitics.

Agree, the paradigm has changed and needs fresh eyes.
Putin wrote the book on this and it’s playing out page by page.