Mastodawn

@mntmn

mini-itx ampere would definitely have my attention.

the mechanical data on the altra is ... intense

@maya_b @mntmn y'all don't wanna do an altra workstation, the pcie on those is totally busted which means gpu support is just bad and super unstable (source: i have an altra workstation and i maintain downstream kernel patches, https://github.com/chimera-linux/cports/blob/master/main/linux-stable/patches/9001-ampere-arm64-Add-a-fixup-handler-for-alignment-fault.patch and https://github.com/chimera-linux/cports/blob/master/main/linux-stable/patches/9002-ampere-arm64-Work-around-Ampere-Altra-erratum-82288-.patch ), the only gpus that work fairly reasonably (but not completely) are the intel ones and they will never fully work upstream without patches

this is not fixed until ampereone, and since it's a hardware bug you'd be shipping buggy hw forever

cports/main/linux-stable/patches/9001-ampere-arm64-Add-a-fixup-handler-for-alignment-fault.patch at master · chimera-linux/cports

Chimera ports collection. Contribute to chimera-linux/cports development by creating an account on GitHub.

GitHub

@q66 @mntmn

thanks for the tip!

how disappointing.

@maya_b @mntmn pcie on arm is a neverending cursed story

there isn't a single board that gets it completely right

@q66 @maya_b ah, big meh! so this is fixed in ampereone?

@mntmn @maya_b i think so; altra max has the same thing (i confirmed it with someone some weeks back) but i believe ampereone is brand new

ofc, it's not available to mortals yet so we won't know for sure for a while

@q66 @mntmn

and at $3k for the least expensive SKU not affordable by most mortals either.

@maya_b @mntmn yeah, though the least expensive sku for that should be beefier than the best one for regular altra, so at least that's somewhat appropriate

but if they messed up the pcie again i won't be amused

elly Feb 26, 2025

@q66 @maya_b @mntmn Ditto on Ampere Altra: Save your time and sanity. It's not worth it.

@elly @q66 @maya_b so disappointing, but thanks for pointing out these issues. boggles the mind how this could be so messed up... i guess we have to wait for an ampereone HPC module then?

@mntmn @elly @maya_b it's a shame because other than this it's an excellent system, with great power efficiency and performance

but if gpus are problematic then it makes a bad workstation (if you do not apply the patches you will get noise in display, if you do you get somewhat slower performance and amdgpu is broken since 6.9 and before then it worked ish but had broken vulkan, funnily what works is nvidia with proprietary drivers with no patches, but you don't want that)

@q66 @mntmn @elly

so okay for headless work but not much else.

@maya_b @mntmn @elly for headless server it's fine yea (unless you need gpu compute, i assume the noise you get in display output unpatched affects even for headless compute in some way)

liffy 💜Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn @elly @maya_b here's what portal2 looked like prior to @q66 's aforementioned patches, by the way! (gdk and qt had to be forced to use software rendering to avoid corruption as well)
as far as vulkan goes, i've had an amount of luck with using AMDVLK when RADV chokes, but yeah...

@lifning @mntmn @elly @maya_b i just get a sigbus with any application using radv on amd

@lifning @elly @maya_b @q66 haha ok that looks interesting

liffy 💜Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn @q66 somewhat interestingly, before the kernel patches, this workaround from something that had previously been encountered on Honeycomb ended up working for this for GL, somehow. (though obviously it wasn't a good long-term solution since the issue turned out to be at the PCI level)

[amdgpu][aarch64] Text and Window Artifacting; Possible System Crash in 3D Applications (#5205) · Issues · Mesa / mesa · GitLab

OS: Linux Ubuntu 21.04 aarch64 System: HoneyComb LX2K ARM64 GPU: AMD Radeon WX 4100 Kernel: 5.11.0.25-generic Mesa Version: 21.3.0-devel (occurs...

GitLab

@lifning @q66 argh, i've encountered that too back when i had a honeycomb...

Val Packett 🧉Feb 26, 2025

@lifning @mntmn @q66 not surprising, honestly i'm surprised no one took these workarounds more seriously

I don't actually remember the context for the RADEON_DOMAIN_GTT and GL_ARB_buffer_storage stuff 0.o but I remember that in FreeBSD we just hardcoded all ioremap to do device memory and added the drm_arch_can_wc_memory() == False patch to Mesa and declared amdgpu to Just Work ™ on the macchiatobin (a8040), honeycomb (lx2160a), etc. (all devices with buggy designware controllers)

@elly @q66 @maya_b ok, one or two more questions: do you have any more detailled info/links about the brokenness level of nvidia/amd/intel gpus on that system? ampere themselves have some guides recommending nvidia rtx cards. are these also broken? because their erratum pcie-65 mentions amd gpus.

@mntmn @elly @maya_b amd: opengl ok before 6.10, vulkan broken; since 6.10, does not work

intel: works ok with the patches since 6.12

nvidia: proprietary driver works fully, no patches (but it's the proprietary driver)

patches reduce performance in edge cases due to alignment fixup

@q66 @elly @maya_b thank you very much for taking the time to list these issues! do you still use the machine, and if so, now with intel GPU? i wonder if sth like blender runs OK on it?

@mntmn @elly @maya_b i use it with an a750, everything more or less works, though it can very occasionally crash the compositor randomly

oh yeah another thing about amd: need to disable amdgpu power management on kernel cmdline or it does not work at all

@q66 @elly @maya_b OK, that still sounds like an interesting setup somehow.

Filip M. Nowak Feb 26, 2025

@q66 @maya_b @mntmn yikes! thx for sharing, much appreciated.

Filip M. Nowak Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn hoooly...! i am waiting for radxa orion, but ampere workstation is my dream replacement for beloved odroid h3+ (i know, i know - apples and oranges). a handheld from you is instabuy :)

Filip M. Nowak Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn but let's give it a twist: i would also jump at amiga with non-FPGA 68080 cpu 🤭

s_levi_s Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn For me it would be an eink screen as an upgrade

Ben Pye Feb 27, 2025

@s_levi_s @mntmn I’m definitely excited by https://www.crowdsupply.com/modos-tech/modos-paper-monitor - I’d love to see that in a laptop…

Modos Paper Monitor

A fast, low-latency, open-hardware e-paper monitor and dev kit

Crowd Supply

s_levi_s Feb 27, 2025

@benpye @mntmn Like once a month I remember Modos and check their progress

but it has been really slow imo. Anyway, the general progress in the eink space is exciting

Lucie / minute Feb 27, 2025

@s_levi_s @benpye yeah it's something i'd like to explore as well, but not sure if modos have the capacity to hand out dev kits etc at the moment

s_levi_s Feb 27, 2025

Probably best to ask them directly @modos ...you @mntmn wrote that the poll was for a grant application? Maybe you could even collaborate with the Modos team, depending on the grant requirement ofc

Modos @Boston, MA Feb 27, 2025

@mntmn @s_levi_s @benpye

We're a small team with limited capacity and doing our best, moving slowly and with intention.

@mntmn If you're interested in exploring a future e-ink or touch/EMR device, I'd be happy to work something out and send a kit your way. Let me know!

alex(at)modos.tech

CellularMoose Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn I'll be the first to back a 55" MNT Reform TV.

gkrnours Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn I'm pretty sure you mentioned working on a desktop or server form factor recently, I'm super interested in that

Björn Gohla Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn I'd be excited about a workstation or laptop based on POWER9.

Usagi Feb 26, 2025

@6d03 @mntmn Look no more https://www.raptorcs.com/TALOSII/

Raptor Computing Systems::Talos™ II Secure Workstation

Talos™ II is the world's first EATX-compatible, workstation-class mainboard for the new, free-software friendly IBM POWER9 processor and architecture. POWER is the only open, owner-controllable architecture that is competitive in performance.

Björn Gohla Feb 26, 2025

@usagi @mntmn sure. But they could use some competition. Also, no laptop.

Anyway, I just thought this was topical in the context of open hardware, since as far as I understand, it's the most open ISA and processor.

Usagi Feb 28, 2025

@6d03 @mntmn You get to run your own firmware, and as I understand it the POWER9 CPU itself may not have any ROM because it's bootstrapped by a 'service processor'. That's typically an embedded CPU that does have a ROM but you could probably get creative with that

Leah

@mntmn hear me out
i want a linux ISO that can turn any computer + capture card into a TV

Leah

@mntmn like this would be such a good usecase i've seen a ton of potential
like a to of people i know want to do this

Andrew Plumb 🇨🇦Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn riscv pocket reform.?.

Daniel M Karlsson Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn MNT Reform all black (including hinges) edition.

Sorry, terrible to write this.

Jan Lehnardt

@mntmn half-rack 2" NAS.

https://chaos.social/@scy/113737307170001571

scy Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn Linux-powered DIN car radio. There's a lot of hack value …

Of course, I can totally understand if one is opposed to building anything related to cars.

scy (@[email protected])

I'd love to have an open source, Linux-powered, scriptable car radio. For example, I usually drive with my phone streaming podcasts or music to my (normal) car radio to a Bluetooth dongle connected via aux cable. But, when there's a traffic announcement on the radio, it has priority. Which is good, I want that. If only my car radio would stop the podcast playback while the traffic announcement is playing … 😔

chaos.social

ninee!Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn inb4 mnt nano reform

*dankpods voice* na no

Daneli Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn a good eReader/kindle alternative

morl0ck Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn some pda like device would be cool, smaller than the pocket.

Hagbard Celine Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn
Vacuum cleaning robot would be nice

Zatty

@mntmn can I write-in with Danish/Nordic keyboard layouts?
Otherwise, it looks like you're doing great work, I mostly just don't have resources to participate or make it fit my situation. No ill will intended!

@zatnosk so far we offer a swedish layout, but could do danish too https://shop.mntre.com/spree/products/407/large/reform2-keyboard3-v2-qwerty-se.png?1696500438

Martijn Braam Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn The Linux TV is the only thing that seems truely unique.

I wonder how hard it would be to fit a MNT mainboard in an existing TV

f_ 🇵🇸Feb 26, 2025

@martijnbraam @mntmn

The A311D Reform's amlogic SoC is also suited for TV (boxes) and androidtv and such, too

josch Feb 26, 2025

@vitali64sur @martijnbraam I can second that. I have the MNT classic Reform motherboard 2.0 with the A311D BananaPi module connected to my TV via HDMI and Kodi automatically enabled CEC and I can control the whole setup out-of-the-box with the infrared remote of my TV. No configuration was required.

arturo182 Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn I have dibs on the handheld ;)

dok Feb 26, 2025

@mntmn i wonder if all the reform next pcbs could fit in a tiny case that can be vesa mounted behind a display, plus it would be fan less