I want to invent a currency that has a coin worth 1/3rd of a dollar, just to punish programmers
@foone make it even worse for everyone and have it be 1/3 of specifically the us dollar but in that new currency and it changes based on the exchange rate
@foone Please don't, somebody will have to build a computer with a floating point format that uses a base-3 mantissa.
@acsawdey @foone wasn't there an early Soviet computer that used trinary electronics in some way?

@pettter @foone You don't necessarily have to implement it in trinary ... IBM POWER processors support a base-10 floating point format and it's not done that way.

The 40's and 50's were wild for building computers, people tried everything 😂

In modern microelectronics, some forms of flash memory use multiple voltage levels to increase the number of bits stored per cell.

@acsawdey
Do not use floats for currency :D even crypto people know it.

@foone

@licho @foone IBM would tell you "do not use _binary_ floats for currency" 😂
@licho
Not even ice cream floats?
@acsawdey @foone
@phi1997 @licho @foone Maybe if you make a machine that's a combination cooler for overclocking and ice-cream maker?

@acsawdey @foone Honestly, the way we do it now isn’t great

I worked out if we stored values in a 60-digit system, it would be heaps cool

Of course I’m referring to 60 base 9+1. I don’t want to appear 9+1 chauvanist.

@whophd @foone

Marketing: What if we supported arbitrary-base floating point?

Logic designer: 🙀

@acsawdey @foone noooo no no, not arbitrary 😂 you gotta have highly composite numbers

Each base-60 digit requires six bits, with a wastage of four redundant values (per every power of 60)

Now you could use that for error correction, or something else with the extra values — 0 to 59, then 0', 1', 2', 3'

You’d need 3 x 60-digits (18 bits) to exceed a short variable (32,767) that normally takes 16 bits

You’d need 6 x 60-digits (36 bits) to exceed a long variable (2 billion etc) that normally takes 32 bits

But of course the real fun comes in fractions — you need 2 x 60-digits (12 bits) to represent the 100 cents after a dollar, or the 240 old pennies after the “old” pound sterling

Decimal cents would normally need 7 binary digits on the end or taken off the big numbers, and 8 digits for the old pennies. Each cent would be 36 units of the 60^-2 power, and each oldpenny would be 15 units of the 60^-2. But they could cohabitate! And you could calculate them together.

Sadly, halfpennies (of the old type) and farthings are too small for this, so if you’re building a computer for use between 1222 and 1961, you’re out of luck.

(The new halfpennies were fine though — 36 units goes down to 18. They knew better and removed the old farthings and halfpennies from circulation a decade before decimalisation, and this allowed the transition to reuse the halfpenny idea with newpence; by the 1980s they were taken out again, when coins started replacing notes for entire pounds).

#base60 #binary #bit #digital

@acsawdey @foone Now the REAL question is whether we are on a quest for base2-and-composite convergence, discovering why the universe doesn’t line up

Or, do we need to continue building computers and data structures with binary structures? Some things aren’t even pure binary at a low level — cheaper SSDs like QLC? Don’t even need to cite quantum CPUs.

Binary does have some objective simplicity and merit. But the 1940s and 1950s were a wild time when everybody-alive-today’s assumptions were being questioned, and built. CPU, RAM, storage, input, output, yeah — who says? Who put them in charge?

@whophd @foone Processor-in-memory structures get interesting because DRAM has been failing to scale in latency for decades now…
@acsawdey @foone they will invent the ternary computer
@foone That'll teach em to decimalise the currency, didn't have this problem when it was 12d to the shilling
@julesh @foone 7 shilling used to make a pfund in germany. so you even have some nice prime number action going on
@FeminineFreyaNyctophile @julesh @foone And then there's the British pre decimalisation practice of pricing luxury goods in guineas (21s) vs pounds (20s). To handle both required factors of 2, 3, 5, and 7.
@foone There's prior art for that in Sterling!
@foone rate it at 0.6 cents and watch the rounding errors accumulate

@foone A few years ago, the company I worked for wrote an internal currency (customers buy credits, get charged credits for accessing data).

I argued for accounting in 1/840 ths of a full credit, because it's 2³·3·5·7.

But no, we went with milli-credits (1/1000) instead. :(

@darkling aww. Thank you for trying to make it more interesting, though

@foone

under the Lsd system, tuppence is a sixth of a shilling, and then there's 20 shillings to the pound....

@munin @foone I remember seeing a picture of a rotary switch on an IBM mainframe that let you choose between 4 ways to encode UK currency.
@jernej__s @munin yeah. that's why modern computers are so crap. you can't set the dial to pounds/shilling/pence. I should make one of those dials for my main PC
@foone @munin Found it:

@jernej__s @foone

wait ......-what-

you can choose between one standard's pence and another standard's shillings?

-what-

@jernej__s @munin @foone I wonder if the dial will cause data race when turned.
@munin @foone And under the decimalisation rules, the old half-shilling (sixpence) coin was redeemable for 2-and-a-half new pence.
@munin @foone under the Lsd system, people attended Grateful Dead concerts.
@foone foone haven’t we already been punished enough
@foone You'd make a million dollars in two weeks
@foone honesty this is just british currency before the 70s
20 groats is ⅓ pound

@Datenegassie @foone OK that's awesome, I learned something new. I'd never heard of a groat.

From books I read when I was young, I knew about pence, shillings, pounds and guineas and how they were related. And heard the terms farthing, bob and crown.

And now I see there's even more (googling found https://www.iheartbritain.com/understanding-british-money-whats-a-quid-a-shilling/)

Understanding British Money: What's a Quid? A Shilling? - I Heart Britain

British money has a lengthy history, so it's not surprising that it's evolved and changed over the years. Whether you're watching British TV, reading British

I Heart Britain

@foone

IDK don't just joke about it. I would find it helpful were you a millionaire for no reason.

The A&W 3/9 lb. Burger | A&W Restaurants

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@foone This will be interesting. Many Americans think that ¼ is more than ⅓ , so I see a great opportunity for scams.
@foone not so much of a problem in FORTH with the */ operator - p119 here: www.forth.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Starting-FORTH.pdf
@foone seems like there's the Maltese scudo
@foone surely there are some worse options? Maybe a graph-colouring currency.

@foone Last week I learned that UK banks before 1971 had implemented some computers using £/s/d, and that due to the (relatively rare) conversion of 1:1 new pounds to old pounds, they continued using it in the back-end — in some areas to this day

https://youtu.be/dip8eHw3guo [further citation required IMO]

But yeah, £0/6/8 is exactly a 1/3 of a pound, and that’s the same pound as now.

Predecimal Currency: The Nightmare in Your Pocket

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