Lisa
Rua M. WilliamsIt is impossible to describe the relief I feel reading a student paper that has grammar errors, typos, missing words, or second-language idiosyncracies and I can confidently read the work knowing my student actually wrote it and is expressing their knowledge in their own words.
Dave GoldsmithDo you have any idea how widespread the use of AI is in your students' writing? Do they all use it to some degree? Are any of them shunning it completely? What are their reasons for using or not using AI?
Dr. Yurii Radiev@Dave_Goldsmith @FractalEcho I'm a PhD in Physics in Germany and I do seminars in our course on organic molecular materials. We mostly have foreign students joining that course because it's in English. So in one of the last submissions 7/9 papers were written using LLMs. They ranged from direct "copy-paste" of the output to "copy, format, add some figures to make it look authentic". Funniest thing that LLMs still can't do proper referencing of sources – it just put stuff that's remotely relevant
David J. Atkinson@FractalEcho @Dave_Goldsmith @kungfyurii This is a shocking change in attitudes of students from my time in college. The idea of copy pasting anything and then representing it as my own work is anathema. There was no doubt that was cheating. In college, I might have gotten a stern warning for a first offense and suspension for a second. Clearly things have changed. What rules do you enforce?
@meltedcheese @FractalEcho @kungfyurii
Not only would we have gotten into trouble for plagiarism, I understood that it defeated the entire purpose of the exercise to steal other people's ideas whole cloth.
I took pride in attempting to synthesize the reading in order to come up with a (somewhat) original interpretation of the materials. Because for me the grade was secondary to the learning.
We live in a society with a weak social safety net resulting in the pursuit of money trumping all?
@Dave_Goldsmith @meltedcheese @FractalEcho It's really a difficult question. On one hand I see that less and less students care about actual knowledge. On the other hand, in the times where your CV has to get through multiple "AI"-powered filters before even being read by an actual human-being, having an excellent transcript of records seems to be a must have. So in some way the society reaps what it sowed.🤷
Still get's me pretty mad when I see students giving absolutely 0 effort.
Still get's me pretty mad when I see students giving absolutely 0 effort.
@kungfyurii @Dave_Goldsmith @FractalEcho The students who embrace AI don’t really want to learn. They want to check a box that is the prize for attendance. A collection of attendance prizes gets you a degree, and that gets and keeps you a job. That view is grossly mistaken. Those who want to learn come away with better knowledge of the world and how to reason to make good decisions. That is what employers want.
@meltedcheese @kungfyurii @FractalEcho
At the time they make their hiring decisions, can prospective employers distinguish between those who have checked the boxes and those who can think? How?
@meltedcheese @FractalEcho @Dave_Goldsmith This is a drastic change even for me, and I did the same course only about 4-5 years ago. I've seen "normal" plagiarism before in my ~4 years of tutoring in this seminar, but LLMs definitely changed the situation a lot by making plagiarism even more "accessible".
Unfortunately our department is very "soft" in this matter (due to a lack of students). People get warnings and 0 points, even for repeated "offenses". Strict rules are only for thesis.
Unfortunately our department is very "soft" in this matter (due to a lack of students). People get warnings and 0 points, even for repeated "offenses". Strict rules are only for thesis.
Kevin Karhan 
@kungfyurii @meltedcheese @FractalEcho @Dave_Goldsmith which I think is bad, cuz it sets a bad precedent and harms the integrity of the institution.
Normally, shit like this gets people.summoned to Academic Affairs and if they're lucky they'll be allowed to stay after doing an ethics course, or take tze risk and if caught get expelled and basically banned from any reputable collegue / university...
Like we had cheating in academic settings for decades, softballing means it'll harm the reputation like any lack of quality control, #accountability & #consequences!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbzJTTDO9f4
UCF Professor Richard Quinn accuses class of cheating [Original]
@Dave_Goldsmith i actually had an assignment where i asked them whether and how they opened to use it. I haven't actually read all the responses yet because my heart can't take it. I had them read three issues, labor exploitation, water consumption, and linguistic discrimination, first.
I'll be writing about it later.
BigD@FractalEcho
We were allowed to have slide rules in our maths exams in the 60s.
AI has been in use for years, to the power of 42/5 apparently.
We were allowed to have slide rules in our maths exams in the 60s.
AI has been in use for years, to the power of 42/5 apparently.
dr2chase@FractalEcho We'll fix future LLMs to add a few flaws, for simulated authenticity. #ProblemSolved
CaveDave@FractalEcho should add occational the spelling spelling mistake then to signify that it's original work to anyone who's reading
Twobiscuits🚴♂️ 
@FractalEcho Big me too here! 90% of my work is making them *want* to write. It's almost killing me but its a fascinating test of my course concept. Still not right after 5 goes, but next year! Next year I'm gonna have it all worked out. As sequence of exercises and tasks and personal interactions they can't escape! It's like catching fish with your bare hands (not that I've ever tried that). 🤗
RhesusPieces@FractalEcho unless it’s a new AI program that simulates actual students!
Bill Seitz@FractalEcho that will be a customization upgrade, to mimic those
Charlie McHenry@FractalEcho LLMs are becoming ubiquitous, and will continue to do so. In schools, the key is to teach students how to properly and acceptably use them. For example, as research assistants, brainstorming partners, and finally as proof-readers and editors. Used in that manner, the resulting work *is* the student’s original content. As a professional writer, the notion of a teacher feeling “relief” at bad grammar or missing words is disconcerting.
Unprecedented 2023Will you give extra credit for grammar and spelling and punctuation mistakes?