jeffwGender-affirming surgeries are mostly performed on cisgender people: 'Bitter irony'
socphoenixOut of the 151 breast reductions that were performed in 2019 on American minors, 146 (97 percent) were performed on cisgender males.
The thing is, growing up in an evangelical church they don’t want these people getting breast reduction surgery either. they firmly believe that any change to the body is going against God’s will regardless of the physical or mental harm it may cause.
FuglyDuckpretty sure they’re okay with women getting boob implants, though.
That one did oddly enough draw less of a stink, though it did still get whispered about when it suited one’s purpose.
bizarrolandIdk, the #1 thing people said behind Dolly Parton's back and held against her was that she had fake tits.
People are awful. If there’s nothing that they can be mean about, they’ll make shit up. I suspect most of that was more because she was rich/famous/influential in her own right rather than being tied to a husband.
(though she’s married. I looked it up outta curiosity. He doesn’t even have a Wikipedia page…
Dolly’s husband has never been a part of her public persona. He’s always been in the background and almost everyone has respected his/her choice on the matter.
absolutely true but Dolly Parton did not have to face transphobic harassment and violence
very very very important distinction
Except male genital mutilation, aka circumcision. (Please don’t take this as me saying FGM and MGM are equally bad. FGM is much, much worse.)
There are five grades of FGM; MGM is equivalent to hoodectomy, which is grade III.
The worst FGM is much, much worse that MGM, but the least-worst FGM is much less-worse than MGM.
where so you cite this five grade model?
the world health organization is not quite in line with you here (CW, hopefully obvious explicit discussion of mutilation) thanks !
Hm, it’s been a while since I’ve been active in this space, I’m quoting from memory. I’ll look up some stuff.
There are other forms of MGM too. Fortunately most of them are rare these days. Castration, subincision, penectomy.
And then there’s intersex people. That are routinely subject to “corrective surgery” in infancy. As adults they tend to be firmly of the opinion they should have been left alone and that the surgeries were harmful.
IMO bodily integrity and autonomy is a fundamental human right that should be absolutely respected for every human being.
thesatanictemple.com/…/there-are-seven-fundamenta…
III One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.
SqueakyBeaverHonestly, that’s only because the Bible says it’s a thing that should be done (apparently)
Jojo, Lady of the WestThe Hebrew Bible maybe, but it’s pretty clearly outlined by Paul in the new testament that non-jewish Catholics definitely don’t have to follow Jewish custom (and don’t have to be circumcised in particular)
True. It’s been a while, heh.
You’re good, I just think it’s worth saying out loud. There’s probably plenty of parents who do think the Bible says it, even though it doesn’t
This appears to be an issue with accurate reporting.
I’m not sure I am perfectly following you but, slightly concerning/missing the point comment?
Important considerations:
- plenty of transphobes are non-evangelical, or even non-religious
- evangelicals having distaste for tattoos and breast implants is incomparable to transphobic hate and its precipitating violence
Correct me if I am misreading you here.
just because I had something to add doesn’t mean I missed you point.
thank you for the helpful correction i really understand my error now /lie
well i am missing your point i guess, sorry. could you rephrase what you are saying ? im quite lost
well i am missing your point i guess
Yes, despite it being very simple and my having explained it clearly…
sorry
No, “confusing and distracting” by muddying the waters was you whole point. You’re clearly arguing in bad faith. It’s just that I called you out.
see my edit :)
Your dissembling changes nothing. It only confirms my claim that you’re arguing in bad faith.
Thanks for that!
ah there’s out miscommunication! i am not arguing anything i just misunderstood at first and offered a possible solution
but i was wrong so i issued my apologies and asked for clarification :)
you stated there was something that was a problem with the reporting, and i inaccurately surmised that it had to do with trans people experiencing hate. what was it in reality?
ah there’s our miscommunication!
No. You’re clearly arguing in bad faith, and I’m not falling for it. And I’m calling you out on it. Deflecting is the tactic of a coward.
i literally don’t know what you are talking about, lol. just asking for clarification because my initial reading was clearly wrong :)
Sealioning (also sea-lioning and sea lioning) is a type of trolling or harassmentthat consists of pursuing people with relentless requests for evidence, often tangential or previously addressed, while maintaining a pretense of civility and sincerity (“I’m just trying to have a debate”), and feigning ignorance of the subject matter.[1][2][3][4] It may take the form of “incessant, bad-faith invitations to engage in debate”,[5] and has been likened to a denial-of-service attack targeted at human beings.[6] The term originated with a 2014 strip of the webcomic Wondermark by David Malki,[7] which The Independent called “the most apt description of Twitter you’ll ever see”.[8]
Just asking questions (also known as JAQing off, or as emojis: "🤔🤔🤔"[1]) is a way of attempting to make wild accusations acceptable (and hopefully not legally actionable) by framing them as questions rather than statements. It shifts the burden of proof to one’s opponent; rather than laboriously having to prove that all politicians are reptoid scum, one can pull out one single odd piece of evidence and force the opponent to explain why the evidence is wrong.
The tactic is closely related to loaded questions or leading questions (which are usually employed when using it), Gish Gallops (when asking a huge number of rapid-fire questions without regard for the answers), and Argumentum ad nauseam (when asking the same question over and over in an attempt to overwhelm refutations).
My mother (religious) once told me my tattoos make her sad. There are only two that are visible on a forearm (the third is under my shirt). I told her that they make me feel happy. She’s never brought it up again. But hers is less fervent, still rooted in the same origin.
Flying SquidI’m guessing that’s because the Bible says no tattoos in the same book where it says not to eat pork and shellfish, but Christians only believe the passages in the Pentateuch if they’re okay with them.
Bible says no pork, pork is ok.
Bible says not to be gay in the exact same book, being gay is an abomination unto the lord.
What it actually says is not to lay with a man as you would with a woman. It’s not about being gay, it’s about topping!
this should hilight to us the outsized effect transphobia has on discourse.
if we were to believe the line that “we’re just concerned about people getting mutilated” we must naturally expect to see that 97% margin of outrage at breast implants, hair implants, weight management surgery etc. for cis folk.
and we don’t. here and there you might hear an evangelical getting upsetti spaghetti avout Ozempic et al but transphobic talking points dominate, in vast disproportion to actual individual cases.
Well except for giant fake titties, God wants those.
Although they’re usually fine with things like wearing glasses and getting stents. Odd, isn’t it?
My mother is fond of saying “God doesn’t make junk”. Easily disproven whether or not you believe in a god, but she’s a “if I don’t like it, it didn’t happen” variety of Trump supporter, so I err on the side of changing the subject over arguing.
I’m so sorry you have to deal with that.
There’s no way I could continue having a relationship with anyone who is a trump supporter.
Thank you. It is really difficult. It’s especially hard to find the line. (Un)fortunately for me she’s always been unreasonable per se, so I already had her at arm’s length before Trump flopped onto the scene.
Oh they absolutely do. The alternative is men with breasts. They’ll say they don’t, but when the time comes to accept cis men’s bodies when they fall outside “male” expectations they won’t.
Why are so many cis males getting breast reduction surgery tho?
Because the alternative is a brossiere.
I believe the options were the manssiere or the bro.
Brossieres are known to cause medical issues, mostly back, spine, wear and damage.
cm0002I’ve got to get to a damn gym right now
Because of dem tiddis fool.
Dude, I saw that picture of Elliot Page after he got his breasts removed. He looked HAPPY. Rejuvenated. I want to get rid of mine to. I’ve never wanted gender affirming care as much as I do now as a cis gender man, these guys are getting it done. It’s clearly making them feel better.
Especially when you can get them enlarged! C’mon fellas. Have fun with it.
Seriously though, I get that this could be terribly embarrassing if you have boobs as a man. I feel bad for kids in gym locker rooms getting teased.
Sometimes you just need some round things in your face, even if they are your own
Don’t have to tell me twice
Now, imagine how bad it would be if you were a man with breasts and a vagina and woman’s name and you were forced to stay that way. Truly sounds like a nightmare.
Because they’re overweight and a bunch of the fat ended up there and it makes them unhappy when they look in a mirror.
Theres a reason most fat males keep their shirts on at the beach.
Sterile_TechniqueSurgical tech here!
We do these (breast reduction surgeries on men) every now and then. Not super often… I’ve been in maybe 10 of them? Of the ones I’ve been in, one was a dude with breast cancer - chopped out the cancer, then chopped down the other moob so they’d heal to be the same size. All of the other ones were gym rats who took steroids and grew some boobs. None were overweight.
I’ve only been in a handful, so grain of salt, but in my experience weight is NOT a factor.
…and this seems like a good time for a plug: Men can 100% get breast cancer. Not often, but possible. If any of you fellas feel a weird lump in your moobs, DO NOT hesitate to get it checked out!!
This is one of the first comments I have seen on lemmy that truly feels like old school reddit. You applied your professional knowledge to that fairly unkind commenter not only to correct them but also to express something many might not know!
Very cool of you keep it up champ :)
When I was at the Mayo Clinic in March, I met a couple there, the guy had breast cancer 10 years ago and his wife was in remission for appendix cancer.
It’s different for everyone, I’m overweight and don’t have tiddies at all, but I’ve seen men who looked like a fairly healthy weight who had noticeable tiddies.
All dudes have boobs. They have nipples and breast tissue. They can lactate (small amounts) and get breast cancer.
This is because, in mammals, the default sex leans towards more female. An XY-chromosome ‘male’ foetus that doesn’t respond to androgens in the womb will not develop male external genitalia, and will probably be assumed to be female on birth.
Sex is not binary, because biology isn’t simple. Gender, which is more complex than that, is not, either.
I believe that male lactation, while possible, is rare.
Rare cam be a deceptive term, with the current population of the human race ‘one in a million’ is still 8,000 people.