MicroWaveConsumers say they're pulling back on tipping servers, drivers and hair stylists
Flying SquidI don’t know about hairdressers and drivers, but many servers are legally paid less than minimum wage because they are expected to make up the difference in tips.
So this is essentially people being fucked over by not being paid enough fucking over other people who aren’t being paid enough. And if you object to them not being paid enough, the solution isn’t to not tip them, it’s to not go to the restaurant.
SandySocksThey are supposed to be paid the difference if tips plus base pay don’t add up to minimum wage. But I’m guessing a lot of places don’t do it.
finleyThe minimum wage for tip workers is often lower in most states then minimum wage for non-tipped workers.
California has, for a while now, required that tipped workers be paid the same minimum wage as anyone else, period. Tips are extras on top of minimum wage.
No, that’s a Federal requirement, too. It only requires them to be brought up to the $7.25/hour Federal minimum wage so it’s pretty useless, but it exists.
Interesting. I didn’t actually know that.
In Oregon tipped employees are required to be paid the state minimum wage. Seems to be an exception though unfortunately.
California as well. Tipped workers make the service industry minimum wage, which is actually higher than the state or city minimum wages, so they make $20 an hour plus tips. Which means that they are barely scraping by.
If you aren’t making up the difference, you probably aren’t going to last long anyway.
% based tips are bullshit and always have been. And moving the scale up to 18,20,22 is insane.
Especially because a 15% tip is almost twice as good as it was 10 years ago due to rising food costs
Yes! The raise is already built in.
Anyone else notice the “essential workers” never got that minimum wage increase?
I get republicans not supporting it, but the moderate Dems not fighting for them is going to hurt in November…
Voters know Republicans obstruct progress, but they need to see that Dems are at least willing to have the fight.
Where I live they got it. While it isn't law, the local fast food is all starting at $16/hour or more.
…
I mean, wages can go down, and will go down when there’s a larger labor pool.
Which is why we should have taken advantage of the small labor pool during COVID to raise minimum wage.
We had a chance to raise it while workers have leverage, but republicans will always oppose it and moderate Dems didn’t push for it, so nothing happened.
That’s wildly considered the biggest negative of moderate Dems, they don’t act when we have the leverage to get things done. They tell us to be happy with temporary things we can lose tomorrow, like how they refused to modify Roe v Wade while we had the numbers to codify it, now it’s gone.
They don’t actually want to fight for us. They’re controlled opposition to make sure when we do have the opportunity/leverage to fix shit, we waste that time “looking into” if we should really fix it. Then when the opportunity passes, they say they tried.
But they didn’t.
In California they got it. Fast food is $20 an hour to start.
breadsmasher- laughs in european *
I’m a generous tipper at sit down restaurants, but draw the line at places where I’m grabbing a prepackaged sandwich and drink and being asked to tip the employee to literally ring up the items at the cash register. I wonder if the expansion of this practice is turning people off of tipping even when it’s warranted, hence these statistics
NeatoYeah. The blurbs examples are places you really need to tip. They are providing a direct service to you. But pretty much every digital pay interface is asking for tips now. And a lot of them aren’t even offering 15%. They start at 18% and go up. It is really souring me on going out at all.
Pretty much every sit-down restaurant now has tips calculated on the bill, and 15% is never one of the calculations. It's typically 18%, 20%, and 22%, but I've seen them start higher.
Is this due to the same machines? Since it can differ, I assume it's the owner who chooses to make it higher.
It depends on what payment thing they use. Most places use a third-party payment POS and stick with default settings.
The blurbs examples are places you really need to tip. They are providing a direct service to you.
Do you really not realize how ridiculous this sounds?
Yes. But there is no other alternative in America. If you stiff servers, they get hurt. If enough people do it, they quit and your favorite places die. You can encourage places that don’t allow tipping and pay a living wage but those are so rare as to be pointless.
Only assholes refuse to tip for service in America.
To be clear, it’s never warranted. It’s just some cultures that have normalized the practice for certain services. Companies should always fully pay their employees. Full stop.
Not true. It depends on the job and the state. NY for example, has a tip allowance of $5 per hour. That means establishments can pay their servers $10 per hour and still meet minimum wage law, because the staff is expected to make at least $5 per hour in tips.
While I agree that employers should pay their staff well, it’s standard practice for servers in NY to be underpaid and rely on tips as part of their income.
All of that also being known as…normalization.
That’s fair. I thought you were implying societal normalization by identifying cultures rather than governments. I see how this would be considered systemic normalization.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen this written about so -
The reason these tipping prompts are so egregiously inescapable now is that those point of sales systems are handed out by Clover and the like when the business starts using them for POS and inventory and credit card processing.
For each CC transaction, the business pays something like 2-3% of the transaction and so the CC processor becomes incentivized to make that transaction amount higher. That’s how we got here. You’re being guilted into tipping a shitty tech company.
Carry cash. Pay cash whenever possible. That’s how you avoid that screen.
Is clover getting money for cc transactions? I thought it was the cc companies charging that fee.
Clover or whoever also gets money for letting whoever use their system. They get an upfront fee then a percent of sales.
Point of sale companies like Clover charge a fee and the credit card company gets a cut of that. The rest is for the point of sale’s services.
Credit Card companies (ie MasterCard or Visa) typically have a flat per transaction fee that is very small (like fractional cent small). The processors are the ones that take the percentage cut (PoS and your bank). It’s been a bit since the last time I looked into it, so things could be a bit different, but I would be surprised if it was.
These used to be separate things, but now most of the older POS systems have been bought by the processors or, with the “newer” systems, were in the business of processing from the get go. It’s all very incestuous.
QuarterSwede
Granbo's Holy HotrodWhen they flip that screen, I cringe. US tip culture sucks.
Drivers should not be tipped as they cannot do anything different. Either you get there or you don't. If you get there slower they are incomitent. If you get there faster they broke the law and your tip indicates you enticed them to do so and so you are guilty.
VoyajerUnless you’re tipping them for driving smoothly.
proleIf you get there faster they broke the law and your tip indicates you enticed them to do so and so you are guilty.
Hahahahaha… Is this for real?
This is very real. Take an ethics class sometime - indirect effects and what things look like are very important.
Dude, pizza delivery guys in the days of “30 minutes or it’s free” were fucking crazy.
Yes they were. It wasn't right then, and it isn't right now.
I worked in craft beer. Man, beer release days were nice. Get a bunch of bozos all want a whole case of the latest IPA for like $100, all of em blindly tapping the 20% tip option. Like, homie, I did nothing for that tip. I’m over here bartending, getting less from the people I’m actually serving. Thanks I guess?
So now, especially that the economy is fucked, I’m very particular about what I tip.
Yesterday I went to a juice place. Got 2 bottles of juice and a fruit bowl thing. I’m only tipping on the fruit bowl thing. I’ll tip 20% on it, but you simply grabbed the bottle of juice from a fridge. That’s not a service.
All in all it looks like an 8% tip, because their juice is $11 a bottle and the fruit bowl is like $20 after everything I added to it.
$4 tip. That’s 20% on your $20 bowl. I’m ignoring the other $22 on the bill. That wasn’t a service. I’m not tipping $9 for this interaction.
I do that too. Get draft beer, pizza and then a bunch of cans at a brewery. 60% was prepackaged so I’m not tipping 20% on the whole bill. Did my own math and it was like 10%.
I don’t get it.
What’s not to get? You seem to understand it just fine. Rather than actually paying their workers a living wage, they can have customers subsidize their pay.
And then when they have a bad night and end up making $4/hour, tips included, you blame the customers for not tipping and not the employer who pays you literally $3/hour.
TheTeej107I’ll tip my waiter/waitress. I refuse to tip a PoS device. I have no shame selecting the “No tip” button on those things.
whotookkarlIf everyone stopped tipping at the same time, say labor day, then businesses would need to properly pay their staff again. As soon as tipping became expected the whole system was fucked.
Shit like this is a good way to prevent me from returning. I don’t want to feel bad about giving someone money I didn’t need to and if I’m pushing the lowest recommended amount it feels sad.
I think a lot of these “cab companies” use the tips to pay the drivers now and take more for themselves.
Returning? I wouldn’t even be completing that order.
RubberDuckOther > zero
And there is a service fee!
they should honestly ban tips on credit card machines.
Pizza Hut prompted me for a (minimum) 18% tip on a take out order. I could see tipping for takeout if it’s a large, complicated order, but this was not. 18% is for standard table service.
Gotta love corpo news.
have made some people stingier
They’re no longer appreciating service industry workers
Shut the fuck up and pay them a living wage you animals. Don’t try and continue pitting individuals against each other. “Blame the consumer for everything” is so played out at this point.
The reality is that these jobs rely on tips. If they were to “pay them a living wage” then the cost of the service would just go up.
Don’t get me wrong, I want tipping to go away, and it’s gotten absurd where people are asking for tips now. But it’s absolutely stingy to not tip in these places where traditionally they would be tipped. If you don’t want to tip, don’t buy their services. It should be a recognized part of the cost: you just think it should be made official, some think it should be based on the quality of service they received.
The cost would not increase. That is not how supply and demand works.
It is extremely unlikely this has not been explained to you before.
It’s just perception. It’s the some bullshit logic why sale taxes are not included in the price and calculated at purchase… makes the product seem cheaper than it actually is.
I agree. Right now with tipping the true cost is obscured. If you take away tipping, the services would just charge more.